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February 16

Arabic:

Somebody told me in spoken (Palestinian) Arabic: ana biddi atwannas (Maybe he said: ana biddi aruḥ atwannas). I asked him what he meant by atwannas, so he answered: "travel". But when I looked it up on Google translator, I had a difficulty in finding that word, maybe because I didn't spell it well in Arabic scripts. What's the correct spelling of atwannas, and mainly: does it really mean "travel", or any additional meaning? 185.24.77.178 (talk) 08:17, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

~~Which country was your source from? Apparently Arabic could vary widely between different nations. 惑乱 Wakuran (talk) 16:33, 16 February 2022 (UTC)~~[reply]

Is macaw and macau the similarity?

Macaw is a bird Macau is a country 2404:8000:1005:555:1995:D90E:4A1:1594 (talk) 10:19, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Are you asking if they share an etymology? If so, the answer appears to be "unknown". Macau derives from the Portuguese version of the name of a temple. Macaw is also Portuguese in origin, but where that name came from is unknown. Given that Macaws come from South America and Macau is in Chine, it think it would be unlikely that they're related - although it wouldn't be the first time that European explorers took a word that referred to a particular people/place/thing and used it for a completely different people/place/thing. Iapetus (talk) 10:36, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

According to Wiktionary, the name of the bird comes from a Tupian language, whereas the name of the city is a corruption of southern Chinese 阿媽港 (A-Ma Gong) meaning "Mazu Harbour". If the latter is correct, and the harbour was named after the temple (or directly after the goddess), there is no need to invoke a misunderstanding between the Portuguese explorers and their local informants. --Lambiam 11:22, 16 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

February 17

Relativity of "city", "town", etc.

Asking as an American, is the set number a place's population has to reach before it can be labelled a "city" or "town" relative to the state it's in? For example, Kansas City is much smaller than New York City. Does that mean that other places in Missouri have a lower population threshold to be labelled a "city" than those in New York? I hope I'm wording this right. Thanks, Gageills (talk) 19:10, 17 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Both Kansas and New York are states as well as cities. I guess that also could have played a part in this nomenclature. 惑乱 Wakuran (talk) 19:22, 17 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Star City, Arkansas, had at the time of incorporation (1890) a population of 204. It seems that the label is not an indication of the size. --Lambiam 20:40, 17 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Even more dramatic, Soldier, Kansas "is a city in Jackson County, Kansas, United States. As of the 2010 census, the city population was 136." No, I have no idea how Americans define cities. HiLo48 (talk) 22:33, 17 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The terms "city" and "town" and "village" and "township" and "borough" and all of the other names for geographic places in the U.S. have different usages depending on the state in question. Almost literally every state has a different way of managing their local municipalities, and what they call them, and the status they have, and there is NO national commonality. If you think Kansas City is small, check out Siler City, North Carolina, for example. In some states, there are different statuses for different terms. In some places, it is based on form of government. For example, Massachusetts makes distinctions between towns, governed by a Board of Selectmen, and cities that are governed by a Mayor-Council or Council-Manager system. In North Carolina, all municipalities are treated exactly the same by the state government. They draw no distinction by the name, and municipalities can call themselves "village", "town", "city" or whatever. Thus Cary, North Carolina, the seventh largest municipality in the state, is official the Town of Cary, while we have places like Siler City, which is MUCH smaller in population; North Carolina doesn't care. Everything is just a municipality. On the other end of the spectrum, check out Local government in New Jersey, which has 5 types of municipality, and those 5 types can have 12 different types of government. It gets really confusing, and there are no nationwide principles. Check out Local government in the United States for an introduction. --Jayron 32 20:50, 17 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Wow. This answered my question and gave me a bunch of new pages to read. Thanks a bunch :-) Gageills (talk) 03:11, 18 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

"New York, New York, it's a helluva town!" --Trovatore (talk) 21:31, 17 February 2022 (UTC) [reply]

My kind of town, Chicago is...

I'm going to be a home-sweet-homer
There, I'll settle down
Beneath the palms, in someone's arms
In Pasadena town

--Trovatore (talk) 22:03, 17 February 2022 (UTC) [reply]

In California, incorporated cities and towns have exactly the same powers and authorities, and cities are not necessarily larger than towns. It is up to each municipality to decide which it wants to call itself. A couple of examples: Thirty years ago, I lived in San Anselmo, California, a town of about 13,000 people. I now live a few miles from Nevada City, California, which only has about 3,000 people, even though it is the county seat. Cullen328 (talk) 23:03, 17 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I can beat that. The "city" of St Davids has 1,600. (Yes I know the question was about American cities, but couldn't resist. Also city status is actually a conferred thing in the UK, so might be interesting) Fgf10 (talk) 00:13, 18 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

"East side, west side, all around the town [i.e. New York City]". Also, from "Little Johnny Jones", the lyric "All aboard, goodbye to Londontown, say hello to old Broadway"[1] --←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 06:28, 18 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Way on down south... Londontown. --Jayron 32 13:03, 18 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

London's case is a little complicated; the original centre is the City of London, which together with the adjacent City of Westminster and 30 other London Boroughs make up Greater London, which is technically a ceremonial county, but colloqually is a city or town, depending on your whim. A city proper in the UK originally only needed a cathedral (hence the City of St Davids which is really a small village), but nowadays a Royal Charter is required. Alansplodge (talk) 15:38, 18 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I live in a large village (pop. around 1000), which is historically a town, because it was given a market charter in 1307. Six miles away is the city of Ripon (pop. around 16000, the only city in North Yorkshire) and fifteen miles away is the town of Harrogate (pop. 72000). The city of York is much larger, and lies geographically within North Yorkshire, but not administratively. --ColinFine (talk) 22:54, 18 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

More info in Town, and worth noting that in parts of New England, a "town" is what other states would call a "township". In New England, a "town" can have one or more villages within it. --←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 07:09, 18 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, a New England town is an incorporated municipality, and operates like any other incorporated municipality. In most other states (outside of New England), and "township" is a administrative division of a county, and has no municipal powers. The census bureau can't deal with this, so they treat them like townships (aka minor civil division) but the state governments treat them like municipalities. --Jayron 32 12:56, 18 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Also, regarding villages, in all of the New England states EXCEPT Vermont, village is just a term for an area of urban-like density within a town; some named villages exist as postal addresses, but they have no separate governmental function. In Vermont, villages are semi-separate from the towns that surround them; in these cases the rest of the town is usually so sparsely populated that the village has incorporated separately so that certain services the town doesn't provide, it provides for itself. --Jayron 32 17:27, 18 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

In Wisconsin, on the other hand, you have a "town": a low-level entity, which governs itself through an actual annual town meeting [2] and also has an elective board, with limited governmental powers; but any portion of which can be annexed by higher-level municipal entities. Then you have a "village", with some higher powers and not subject to being shaved down by annexation; and a "city", with higher taxation and home rule powers yet. But villages do not have to become cities, and some have chosen not to. --Orange Mike | Talk 15:55, 18 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I grew up in Champaign, Illinois, a city coterminous with a township named Champaign City Township to distinguish it from the adjacent rural Champaign Township. (The adjacent city of Urbana is coterminous with Cunningham Township, similarly distinct from the rural Urbana Township.) In the Midwest, counties are typically divided into townships, each six miles square; Champaign and Urbana Townships appear (when they are marked on maps at all) to be what was left over when the cities were incorporated (and expanded by annexation). I would sometimes pass a building labeled Town of the City of Champaign, which was not city hall; I never did know what went on there. —Tamfang (talk) 02:10, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Tamfang: Perhaps something to do with City of Champaign Township? DuncanHill (talk) 02:45, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

February 20

Wellbeing (services)

In Finland the country has been, of late, divided into "national health areas" that are called, in English, wellbeing services counties. Since asking for opinions is not allowed, I'm not asking whether the 3-word concoction sounds bad or ungood to a native speaker of English, but I'm rather interested in the word "wellbeing" itself. Doesn't it mainly encompass mental health and support, at least in the UK? You only mend broken hearts but do not replace broken heart valves at the wellbeing councellor's. --Pxos (talk) 08:32, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Yes I would say wellbeing would be understood to be about mental health first and foremost in the UK (1,2) Fgf10 (talk) 09:28, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Although in in this case, the British NHS uses "wellbeing" to mean all-round healthiness. Alansplodge (talk) 11:32, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I would actually disagree with that interpretation, as it specifically says psychical health wellbeing. I would interpret that as meaning the mental health benefits of exercise. In other words, I read it as "(physical health) and wellbeing", and you're reading it as "physical (health and wellbeing)". But I agree, it's ambiguous. Fgf10 (talk) 15:17, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

For greater clarity: the NHS page says "physical health and wellbeing". I'm guessing that Fgf's spelling-checker guessed wrong. And I, being North American, would have guessed (before reading the comments here) that "wellbeing" was an incorrect translation. --184.144.97.125 (talk) 05:26, 21 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

And "welfare" on the other hand would point the reader to unemployment benefits and financial support, would it not? And "wellfeeling" is meant only for people who wear flowers in their hair when going to San Francisco... --Pxos (talk) 10:27, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

We actually have a whole article discussing the term. --T*U (talk) 11:39, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The article does not tell what comes readily to people's mind upon hearing the word. I understand the concept of love even without looking it up in a dictionary, but if I walk past a "Love Service", I might be a bit confused. That's why I put the question here, in the Lang. Sect. If an American doesn't have a clue what "wellbeing services" are, and the British think the concept refers mainly to mental health, then it seems the translation is for people who speak English as a worst language. --Pxos (talk) 12:21, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe a Finnish parallel to Wasei eigo? There are certain words (such as "Informatics") which seem to be used more by non-native speakers of English than by native speakers... AnonMoos (talk) 17:51, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Well the whole term is a mixture of Newspeak, adminis... advertisement language and a political compromise (choosing a word that is equally semi-acceptable for the Left, Right and Center). The Finnish word (hyvinvointialue) can ill-literally be translated as "Well-Feeling Area", which really ought to be a nice Japanese spa (all inclusive). The national health system is not called "wellbeing" in Finland, there are no "wellbeing stations", no "wellbeing professionals" and indeed no "wellbeing services" anywhere, but in the name of the new counties. When the various government orgs of the world come up with translations like "a place for restoring goodness in the male non-juveniles" (i.e. a prison for men), it is nice to know how they sound in the ears of people whose language is being used without just compensation. --Pxos (talk) 01:13, 21 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Understanding a Hebrew mascot

This sign contains some incomprehensible words in Hebrew letters. Can anyone explain what's written? Probably has to do with Jewish mysticism. Gil_mo (talk) 16:00, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Which words specifically are you wondering about? Is the text in Hebrew or Yiddish? ± Wakuran (talk) 16:35, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The text is part Hebrew part what seems to be gibberish, or some sort of acronyms, starting at line 4. Gil_mo (talk) 16:41, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I thought it could perhaps facilitate if you had the corresponding text typed down. Although I cannot read Hebrew, personally... ± Wakuran (talk) 16:50, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Gil_mo -- Once you get beyond the first line of text below the curlicue divider, the final form of the letter mem is not used, while in the first (rightmost) word of the third line of text from the bottom, the final form of the letter kaf is not used. Not sure what to make of that... AnonMoos (talk) 17:51, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Nice catch! That most certainly means these words are actually acronyms. But of what? Gil_mo (talk) 21:34, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

If they are, they're quite long, and not marked with primes or "gershayim" (the way some words on the line directly above the curlicue divider, are). The only other things I can easily notice are that he-vav-yod-he (an anagram of the tetragrammaton?) occurs both as a separate word, and also as a prefix to other words (to most of the longest words), and also that there are an implausible number of zayin-zayin letter sequences for Hebrew. Is there any Jewish language for which zayin-zayin is a customary digraph in the spelling? AnonMoos (talk) 01:08, 21 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

he-vav-yod-he is probably given as the anagram of the holy name of God - yod-he-vav-he. And what seems like zayin-zayin is actually a single chet letter in that specific font. Gil_mo (talk) 09:50, 21 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

That would be quite bizarre (why should the top horizontal stroke of this one letter be interrupted, something which I've never seen before?), but you may be right, since single zayin letters have the annoying pseudo-tagim, while what I've been interpreting as double zayin letters don't... AnonMoos (talk) 12:31, 21 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

P.S. He-yod-vav-he occurs in the middle of the penultimate word of the third line of text down from the curlicue divider (the second of two consecutive lines where he-yod-vav-he occurs as a separate word at the end). If you could solidly nail down the meaning of HYVH, then you would probably be halfway there... AnonMoos (talk) 12:37, 21 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Some more: the penultimate line is composed of acronyms to the mystic poem Ana beChoach. The last word is probably an acronym for - ובא לציון גואל במהרה בימינו אמן Gil_mo (talk) 17:29, 21 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Welsh question, probably

I found this sentence in a recent Donald Duck pocket book:

Cymerwch y stryd gynta i'r chwith!

Is this Welsh? What does it mean? JIP | Talk 22:31, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

According to Google Translate it is Welsh for "Take the first street to the left!" DuncanHill (talk) 22:33, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Is Donald perhaps training to take his Prawf gyrru? Martinevans123 (talk) 22:40, 20 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

It's hard enough to understand Donald when he's talking in English. --←Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots→ 03:05, 21 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

February 21

Deaf as a door-post

I had a great aunt who always used to say "deaf as a door-mouse", which I assumed was a Malapropism for "deaf as a door-post". But where does this expression come from? Is to connected to "dead as a doornail"? 205.239.40.3 (talk) 10:22, 21 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Dictionary of Proverbs p. 134 has deaf as a door (1599) or deaf as a door-nail (1572) as well as deaf as a post (1575). The "door-post" simile must be a conflation of two of those. The same source also offers "deaf as a beetle" (1867), "deaf as a haddock" (1882) and "deaf as an adder" (1605 - adders had been believed to be deaf since antiquity). There's also the well-known "stone-deaf".

Dead as a door-nail is dated to c. 1350, so you may be right about a connection, but I couldn't find anything to confirm it.

Similes often seek assonance; for example, "plain as a pike-staff" or "good as gold", which may explain the connection between deafness and doors, but that's just my guess. Alansplodge (talk) 13:04, 21 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

And the other phrase is "Silent as a dormouse" (note spelling). You can find usages of the phrase from 1850 and 1841. It still has some usage in the 21st century, 2013 for example. I'm not entirely sure why dormice are particularly known for being quiet, but apparently they are. --Jayron 32 14:09, 21 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe because they don't talk in their sleep? {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 90.193.130.191 (talk) 14:27, 21 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, Gliridae exhibit semi-hibernation in winter", so that's dor as in dormant, not door as in hinged moveable barrier. I guess Lewis Carroll's The Dormouse may have appeared deaf as he was always falling asleep. Martinevans123 (talk) 14:28, 21 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Oh yeah. Maybe that one's deaf. :) Martinevans123 (talk) 14:49, 21 February 2022 (UTC) p.s. not only do mice dream, but they are also prone to manipulation.[reply]