Talk:Big Ben

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

• London panorama with Big Ben -- original watercolor by Maritess Sulcer March 2020.jpg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 07:52, 30 March 2020 (UTC)

I've removed the image but not because I saw this notice. It was placed in a section where there were already two other images, and the text was being scrunched in a way that made it potentially less readable. The editor placing the image has an account name with similarities to that of the painter, and I assume that their choice wasn't strictly based on what was the most appropriate out of all those available. If we were to have a representative painting of the tower, there are the studies by Monet, as well as probably other famous ones to chose from. Dhtwiki (talk) 21:42, 30 March 2020 (UTC)

The Monet studies show only Victoria Tower; so they aren't appropriate here. Dhtwiki (talk) 21:49, 30 March 2020 (UTC)

What's the big ben made of?

What is Big Ben made of? Materials to produce the Elizabeth Tower came from all over the United Kingdom, with cast iron girders from Regent's Canal Ironworks being used. Yorkshire Anston stone and Cornish granite were used on the exterior and a Birmingham foundry supplied the Elizabeth Tower's iron roofing plates.2804:14D:BE86:9172:1D5D:CC0A:6AD0:E335 (talk) 21:36, 1 April 2020 (UTC)

Do you have sources for this and what changes to the article do you want made? As for the metallurgical makeup of the bell itself, which is what I first thought was wanted and did not see in the article, the contract specified 76% copper and 24% tin. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dhtwiki (talk • contribs) 01:57, 3 April 2020 (UTC)

References

Breakdowns and other incidents

I see no rationale for keeping this nerdy compendium of banal trivia. The clock stopped from 7:16 a.m. to 1:15 pm on 2 April 1934. Hold the front page. The lights were switched off during the Blitz. Well I should bloody well hope so. What would be interesting is if they were NOT switched off! Firebrace (talk) 22:00, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

What is an encyclopedia but a "nerdy compendium"? The entries detail stoppages important enough to have been reported in the news, even if the front page wasn't held (although not sure that it wasn't in every case). So, the entries are sourced, and not just to an variety of sources (although there's one book that is used for several of them) but through the use of carefully-filled-out citation templates (something of a rarity in itself). Such relevance and care deserve more than just being swept away. The entries are somewhat lacking in fuller explanation and could be better grouped according to cause (e.g. stoppages due to repairs vs. snowfall vs. ceremonial funerals vs. air raids, etc.); but the list is certainly relevant and well sourced and should be kept, subject to judicious modification. Dhtwiki (talk) 18:58, 23 January 2021 (UTC)

3D Image

I've removed the 3D image from the article - while interesting, I'm not sure it contributes to our readers understanding the building. BilledMammal (talk) 01:45, 14 January 2022 (UTC)

I agree; pointless when the building is identical on all four sides. Firebrace (talk) 10:44, 14 January 2022 (UTC)

Name of tower more relevant than name of bell

Big Ben is far more commonly used to refer to the Tower than the bell, the fact that it is also used to refer to the bell can definitely be mentioned, however the name of the tower should be the first sentence not the name of the bell. The tower being Big Ben is more relevant than the Bell, especially since this is the page for the tower, not the bell. And such this name of the tower should be the first sentence. Dhtwiki Thank you for fixing the reference, but I kindly ask you to discuss with me the issue before reverting my edit. Just your average wikipedian (talk) 06:31, 4 May 2022 (UTC)

But BB isn't the name for the tower, although some might think it is. Your version of the start was very confusing, & I have reverted. You say "this is the page for the tower, not the bell" - clearly it's the page for both. Johnbod (talk) 13:59, 4 May 2022 (UTC)

Agree with revert. Current description corrects misconception and then clarifies all in first sentence. Edit by Just your average wikipedian confused the description. The article is, as Johnbod says, about both the bell and tower and how the generic name 'Big Ben' has, over time, been used for both in common usage but isn't correct. Robynthehode (talk) 19:24, 4 May 2022 (UTC)

Hi, Johnbod In fact Big Ben is not the official name of the tower OR the bell. with both names being unofficial what differentiates them is the prevalence of their use, and Big Ben is far more commonly used to refer to the tower. This is the page about the tower far more than anything else, with the main picture being the tower, and the vast majority of the content of the page being about the tower, the great bell only having a small subsection. I am very happy for you to reword my beginning sentence to be less confusing if you think it is such. My grievance only lies with the bell being the topic of the very first sentence, when really the first sentence should mention the tower, which the name Big Ben (which is a nickname in both cases) is almost always used to refer to. And the bell can definitely be mentioned in the following sentences. Hello Robynthehode, I don't believe there is any misconception, maybe if people called the tower "the great bell" then it would be. Just your average wikipedian (talk) 09:06, 5 May 2022 (UTC)

The misconception I referred to was that the tower is called 'Big Ben' but is, instead, the nickname for the great bell. So you have misunderstood my comment. You are incorrect to say the first sentence's topic is only the bell where in fact the bell is in the lead clause only and the clock and tower are clearly mentioned in the final clause. If an alternative where these two clauses were swapped was suggested I (after reviewing it) would possibly find that alternative acceptable. But the first sentence should refer to both the bell (the real Big Ben) and the tower (what Big Ben has come to refer to in many people's understanding). If I have time I might suggest an alternative but not at the moment. Robynthehode (talk) 19:19, 5 May 2022 (UTC)

There's no misconception; the tower is called Big Ben because that's what everyone calls it. Big Ben isn't the actual name of the bell either (Great Bell), so who cares? Those tiresome people who always try to sound clever by going "heh, well aCsHuAlLy the bell is called Big Ben!" are wrong too. Firebrace (talk) 19:44, 6 May 2022 (UTC)

Robynthehode, I really must disagree with you saying, quote "the bell (the real Big Ben)" .Big Ben in the nickname for the bell, AND and nickname for the tower, there is no such thing as an official nickname, so really if you want to be pedantic there is no such thing as the real Big Ben. I would definitely be agreeing with you if the official name of the bell was Big Ben however it is not. In this case there really isn't a "well aCsHuAlLy" situation, as Firebrace has comically put it, because both names are nicknames. Since both the tower and the bell have big ben as a nickname then deciding on which is more relevant comes from other measures, Big Ben is far more commonly used for the tower. You could argue on the case that the bell had the nickname first, however the English language (and most languages really) is not stagnant, it changes, just because something was correct or not correct in common use in the past doesn't keep it that way for all eternity. Even the favorite word of this discussion "nickname" comes from misspelling "an ekename" as "a nekename" but we don't insist it should be "an ekename" because really the age of a word or phase has no jurisdiction on whether is should still be said in the modern day. If almost everyone calls a certain tower "Big Ben" then really the name of that tower is Big Ben, just like how if almost everyone says "nickname" then that is the correct word.

Here below is the beginning paragraph from my previous edit, it would be greatly appreciated if you could change the grammar to your liking to make the sentences more clear.

Big Ben is the name frequently used for clock tower at the north end of the Palace of Westminster in London, England. The name Big Ben originated as the nickname for the Great Bell of the striking clock but the name has now commonly been extended to the clock and clock tower. The official name of the tower was originally the Clock Tower, but it was renamed Elizabeth Tower in 2012, to mark the Diamond Jubilee of Elizabeth II. Just your average wikipedian (talk) 02:36, 7 May 2022 (UTC)