Talk:Sufism

Proposed Merge: Langar khana and Langar (Sufism)

It has been proposed that the article Langar khana be merged into the article Langar (Sufism). If you would like to express support for, or object to the merge, then you are encouraged to do so at the talk page for Langar (Sufism). Jay ^(Talk) 06:52, 9 July 2021 (UTC)

على 89.46.207.58 (talk) 23:00, 23 September 2023 (UTC)

Care and sensitivity is required

I removed a section stating in summary that there is a "western understanding" of Sufism that is apparently "incorrect understanding." But not only do they not describe what the "understanding" is, but they also pin the blame on "Western understanding" as if the entire West believes the same monolithic idea or is a monolith itself. Or that some Western organization has openly declared such an "understanding" which it did not. The citation's quote explains further that there is a contested idea within the Muslim majority world, not just in some Western academic world, that debates whether Islam and Sufism are intertwined or not. But what does that even mean? It is meaningless. Such vague and meaningless statements are not at all encyclopedic and seems more like a personal bias someone has. Sufis are indeed Muslim and it's very dangerous to suggest that either the "west" or "east" has such-and-such understanding on something that the citation author admits that it is highly contested in the Muslim majority world itself. Further to suggest that Sufi and Islam are exactly the same is additionally offensive and sensitivity must be shown to this fact. They are two different words for a reason with many competing ideas and traditions throughout Islamic history, even the mere existence of competing Sufi orders should be more than enough to dispel the crazy idea that total uniformity or an opposite "correct Eastern understanding" even exists to say "oh you said otherwise? Well that is not the correct understanding."

It would be like some author suggesting that Arminianism and Anglicanism are the same thing (they are two different words, two different traditions/thoughts even if there are many similarities and overlap and they are BOTH Christian) or--that Anglicanism IS Christianity as it always was throughout the past (Anglicanism is Christianity but not the only kind or tradition or school of thought nor does is it something that oppose Christianity because Anglicans consider themselves Christian as Sufis consider themselves Muslim)--or that the "Eastern understanding of Anglicanism is bad" suggesting monolithic "east" and monolithic "west." That's essentially what the quote + citation was suggesting.

These are highly biased and offensive ways to Muslims, to Sufis, to Western scholars of Islam as well. Sensitivity and care must be taken to avoid bias and introducing a debate that not only has no proper context but even the authors in that citation admit is "highly contested." — ^talk § _Arsenic99_ 00:08, 10 July 2022 (UTC)

The original quote, including the point about orientalists in the 18th and 19th centuries favouring the translation of esoteric texts over chronicling of lived practice is not at all problematic, however, and has been restored (in a 100% different form, based on the actual quotation) in the section on 'perceptions outside Islam'. Iskandar323 (talk) 09:14, 10 July 2022 (UTC)