Talk:2023 Lewiston shootings

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shooting/shootings

Police reports indicate only one shooter. Since it occurred at multiple locations media sources seem to be conflicted on whether this is one "shooting" or multiple (ABC reports former, CNN latter). Looking for consensus on which title is more correct Elijahr241 (talk) 01:25, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Multiple shootings. See 2022 Saskatchewan stabbings. elijahpepe@wikipedia (he/him) 01:33, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I think the plural option, shootings, works better. @Elijahr241: what do you think? City of Silver 02:40, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

plural works better because even if it is one guy, it's still seperate instances of mass murder in different locations

Most people will identify it as seperate shootings in different areas Marmorda (talk) 02:42, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Bit conflicted because to me, "shootings" implies multiple suspects. Maybe it could just be made clear in the lead that it was all one guy (at least, once we have more information) Elijahr241 (talk) 02:43, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Okay! I changed it to singular but if anyone wants to change it back, go for it Marmorda (talk) 02:45, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Concur that this should be plural because at least 3 places have been shot up. Clyde _{[trout needed]} 02:45, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Suspect

Has (BLP violation removed) been identified as the suspect by police? Local Facebook (I know, so reliable) groups and people are identifying him as (redacted). Marmorda (talk) 02:50, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Please refresh yourself on the BLP policy, probably shouldnt be dropping names like this at such a preliminary stage. @Acroterion you may need to hide this discussion thread. LegalSmeagolian (talk) 02:53, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Oops, sorry! Marmorda (talk) 02:53, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Removed his name! Marmorda (talk) 02:54, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

You forgot to at the start of your comment as well, also page revisions will need to be blanked. No worries but in the event it isn't who people are id-ing the picture, it can be real bad news bears. LegalSmeagolian (talk) 02:57, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I've yet to see any official statements or news reports, only twitter and facebook. Elijahr241 (talk) 02:54, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with Acroterion. Just scrolling through the twitter thread there is so much conflicting information and I would be very hesitant to add anything to the article from any of those sources. Qwexcxewq (talk) 03:03, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Bangor Daily News claims a Maine Department of Public Safety spokesperson has confirmed the name. SpaceTeapot (talk) 03:07, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Lets wait for a few more sources to add that info back. LegalSmeagolian (talk) 03:09, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Most of the major news sources are reporting the same. SpaceTeapot (talk) 03:09, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Wow that was fast, yes CNN has identified him as a "person of interest" so I assume other outlets have this as well. LegalSmeagolian (talk) 03:11, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

'Admin warning Nobody has any business posting suspect names or links until it is amply reported by a consensus of major news outlets. I've already protected the aricle and warned editors about this. Please stop, and wait. This rush to post a name has potential for great harm to innocent individuals. Acroterion (talk) 03:00, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

A significant number of remaining revisions have a name in them, the oldest I can find being revision 1181926587. — Greentryst ^T_C 03:08, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I've gone back through, but it's looking like it's moot in any case. The notion that we must name somebody on the thinnest of references or rumors is a perennial concern. However, any descriptions of people's level of interest from law enforcement must stick closely to the way sources word it, and it must be well-sourced. The same goes for any mentions of possible victims. Acroterion (talk) 03:13, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Would person of interest be appropriate to add?LegalSmeagolian (talk) 03:16, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I believe that's how they're expressing it, and that's done for a lot of obvious legal and ethical reasons that editors should respect, and use the same terms. Acroterion (talk) 03:20, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Person of interest named

Robert Card is a person of interest. Source: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/live-blog/rcna122249 2605:8D80:404:9D6:D9CC:757D:2060:A51A (talk) 03:09, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Also named on NY Post and CentralMaine.com . Qwexcxewq (talk) 03:17, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Maps

Can you please explain @ElijahPepe why you deleted the map with "Maps should not be done this way. Hold off on including one with three locations." Thanks. - Fuzheado | Talk 03:10, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Infobox civilian attack includes map parameters already. I recommended holding off because there are three locations and pinpointing one to use is difficult; in theory, we could use Template:OSM Location map with specific points. elijahpepe@wikipedia (he/him) 03:13, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I've edited dozens of breaking news (sadly) shooting articles over the years, and adding a map is standard practice. We can have a basic map now and get it more detailed as we go along. - Fuzheado | Talk 03:16, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Since this is multiple location, a custom made map of each of the locations would likely be more helpful to the reader. LegalSmeagolian (talk) 03:20, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Once things are clearer, sure, but for now this map provides a lot more context than none at all. I sure didn't know where Lewiston was before. — Greentryst ^T_C 03:26, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Edit request: active voice

Can someone with extended edit privileges please edit the opening section to use the active voice? Dreameditsbrooklyn (talk) 03:16, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Could you elaborate? Active voice is not always preferable if passive voice would be clearer. elijahpepe@wikipedia (he/him) 03:25, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Suspect has been identified by NYT, CNN, and NBC

Is it now safe to include his name in the article @Acroterion:? Di (they-them) (talk) 03:19, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

They have since been added. LegalSmeagolian (talk) 03:20, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Also add some information about him. His DOB is April 4, 1983 and lived in neighboring Bowdoin at the time of the shootings, as this was all according to The Maine Wire. It was unknown where he was born or any early info on him, but all I know is that he was once part of the military and was divorced twice. 2600:1702:5225:C010:40C8:CE30:D97F:2B6A (talk) 03:25, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

is there a source for this in more than one news outlet? Marmorda (talk) 03:25, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

No. See WP:SUSPECT. -Ad Orientem (talk) 03:21, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Could you provide a quote where providing a suspect's name is not allowed given several reliable sources and police confirmation? elijahpepe@wikipedia (he/him) 03:24, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I'd support this, now that he has been named in quite a few RS. Clyde _{[trout needed]} 03:21, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Nevermind, per Ad Orientem. Clyde _{[trout needed]} 03:23, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

All I asked was the editors wait until that kind of consensus emerges among major news organizations. The rush to name a name at all costs on thin sourcing or rumor is unseemly, and editors really need to remember BLP at all times. Acroterion (talk) 03:23, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Police have confirmed his name. That is as far as I'm willing to go here, and I have created a custom label in the infobox to that extent. elijahpepe@wikipedia (he/him) 03:25, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Only two locations

Can someone with edit privileges add that there was no shooting at the Walmart location? See the Sun Journal article quoting a Walmart spokesperson - Kefr4000 (talk) 03:24, 26 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]