Talk:Tringa Hysa

stop the reverts

Please stop the reverting and lets talk. I have been asked to look into this ariticle by altin, he feels that his edits are being unfairly treated. please stop reverting them and lets discuss the matter. thanks James Michael DuPont (talk) 07:14, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

Discussion Moved here

Hello to you Mdupont.

Obviously I had Tringa Hysa in my watchlist and I consult that prior to anything else upon logging in and I did indeed revert to my revision; I read your request after that. I am very happy to discuss this with you and with the editor who has twice cancelled my edits. First of all, I can assure you there is no POV issue; there were no adjectives thrown into the main text which were evidently contrived to swing people's opinions of fact, the edit is merely a content issue. To be honest with you, these things are ongoing and normally from IPs and single-issue accounts. Most patrollers tend to instantly revert persons who play with presentation facts - on this occasion, User:Altin.ukshini's edits slipped through the net.

There are two matters regarding Tringa Hysa, the first is her birthplace. The practice followed by editors in general is to produce the sovereign nation observing historical accuracy which here produces FR Yugoslavia because she was born in 1995 when her territory was recognised as such by every country and intergovernmental organisation with the exception of Albania who instead recognised Republic of Kosova, furthermore, the Republic of Kosova exercised no de facto control over Priština in 1995 therefore it is wholly correct to apply the term FRY for the region up until 2003, Serbia and Montenegro 2003-06, and Serbia 2006-08; for all subjects pertaining to Kosovo post-2008, we use the Kosovo note template when using a raw Kosovo, OR we use either AP Kosovo and Metohija or Republic of Kosovo depending on the actual subject. Kosovo is a disputed region with recognition and non-recognition by world states in almost a 50/50 deadlock as we write. The codes of practice are already laid out for us and most established editors know exactly which entity applies and where there is doubt, others such as I may be on hand to correct the edit in good faith. What we never do is use an emphatic Kosovo all by itself, especially in a birthplace slot where everywhere else historical accuracy is observed including on all Kosovan subjects.

The second issue concerns the spelling of the individual's name. Indeed per source and convention, Tringa Hysa is correct. The Serbian name is not a claim on the individual's ethnicity; if that were the case, there would be an attempt to move the article. The entire site is full of articles with translations and for each one there exists a purpose. In Hysa's case, it was the spelling of her name in the land her parents chose to give birth to her and send her to school. I have recently been involved in a discussion akin to this with User:Majuru. I don't believe this is a genuine editor any more than Altin.ukshini, activity from them is too rare and furthermore they all pop up time to time simply to adjust presentation on subjects in a favourable way. So I don't go on and on too much and exhaust myself rewriting things and presenting examples, I'd like to draw your attention to a discussion between Majuru and me which he appears to have abandoned - probably because it is a duff account controlled by an anonymous user (in my opinion). If you read the contents here, you will see that there are indeed exceptions to people having their names in the local Slavic language even when born there; as well as whether it should be included in Cyrillic. I have reached consensus in the past with other users, however they don't seem to edit these days. I can link you to the talks, but for now - please see the discussion. By the way, it is open and you are most welcome to continue to talk there as is Altin.ukshini, it is on my watchlist so there is no urgent need to write here or on my talk unless you wish to. The link follows below, thanks Mdupont.

See [1]. Evlekis (Евлекис) (argue) 18:13, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

Lets look at Mother_Teresa she accepted the indian nationality thus died an indian, independant of where she was born. So lets just add her nationality to kosovo and be done with this? James Michael DuPont (talk) 19:38, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

Mmmm!! I don't know quite how to reply!!! Teresa was indeed an ethnic Albanian born in Üsküp (Skopje/Shkupi) which was as you say in Kosovo in 1910 - Kosovo itself being an Ottoman vilayet. But I don't know what you mean "add nationality to Kosovo", none of my edits have ever interfered with Kosovan nationality (I assume you mean citizenship). I believe most Kosovo-related pages that deal with persons related to the entity normally refer to the present-day territory and Skopje is outside of this. I opposed Macedonian language used for Teresa's name based on there being no Macedonian entity until 1943, and even Serbian does not suffice for although the region went to Serbia from 1912/13, I don't think she lived there for very long before departing to become the person we knew. Difficult one. Evlekis (Евлекис) (argue) 20:30, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

Also - looking at your edit to Tringa Hysa, I see what you are getting at and I endorse your version. Ethnic Albanian she is and if a Kosovan passport is what she happens to possess, then possess it she does and is a Kosovan citizen. The document exists and is accepted in over half the world's states so there is no problem there. Evlekis (Евлекис) (argue) 20:35, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

I have moved the edits here. I have also swapped the names of serbian/albanian in order. James Michael DuPont (talk) 20:37, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

Yeah I see what you've done and that's fine - better infact, as the Albanian is a pronunciation guide, it should not be estranged from the headword. I can go one better and isolate the Serbian spelling as we do with others. Strangely, that was the original plan according to the consensus but I found that editing these things alone, it was time-consuming. The notes/references at the bottom can contain that part instead. By the way, you don't need Albanian pronunciation, just the word pronunciation is fine. It is the job of every speaker in every language to pronounce things as closely as possible to source language. In English we don't actually have the Albanian /y/ sound but a simple /oo/ as in book is good enough. Evlekis (Евлекис) (argue) 20:51, 19 April 2012 (UTC)