Talk:Ku Klux Klan

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• Talk:Ku Klux Klan/Archive4 - : Sep 2005–Feb2006
• Talk:Ku Klux Klan/Archive5 - : March 2006
• Talk:Ku Klux Klan/Archive6 - : June 2006
• Talk:Ku Klux Klan/Archive7 - : December 2006

expand vocabulary section?

A few places in the article use Klan terminology such as "wizard" and "dragon" without explanation. I assume from the context, and from similar terms which are explained (like "grand wizard" and "imperial wizard"), that these refer to leadership positions of some sort, possibly from the Reconstruction era Klan only, but it's never explicitly explained. If the terms are used, they should be adequately defined. Mycroft7 07:36, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

Required Edits

Hey, I don't know how edit this article and I don't have enough time to learn at the moment. The table in this article showing membership of the Klan appears to have a wrong amount for the year 2007. I would appreciate if that would be fixed soon. Thank You.

Hi, I don't know how to edit the article but the first note says: "According to the 1920 census, the population of white males 98 years and older was about 31 million". I assume it means 18 years, this needs correcting.

Had to edit the following paragraph because it is nonsensical.

"The Klan sought to control all of the political and social status of the freed slaves. Specifically, it attempted to curb black education, economic advancement, voting rights, and the right to bear arms. However, the Klan's focus was not limited to African Americans; Southern Republicans also became the target of vicious intimidation tactics. The violence achieved its purpose. For example, in the April 1868 Georgia gubernatorial election, Columbia County cast 1,222 votes for Republican Rufus Bullock, but in the November presidential election, the county cast only one vote for Republican candidate Ulysses Grant.[8]

The second part of the paragraph was removed alltogether because it is an obvious non sequitur "Southern Republicans also became the target of vicious intimidation tactics. The violence achieved its purpose. For example, in the April 1868 Georgia gubernatorial election, Columbia County cast 1,222 votes for Republican Rufus Bullock, but in the November presidential election, the county cast only one vote for Republican candidate Ulysses Grant.[8]

Reasons: 1. Choosing not to elect a public official is hardly a "vicious intimidation tactic." 2. "The violence achieved its purpose," makes absolutely no sense because choosing not to elect a public official is most definitely not an act of "violence." 3. The sentence, "Southern Republicans also became the target..." implies that there were repercussions to "Southern Republicans." Since the Republican candidate, Ulysses S. Grant was not chosen to be president of the USA by some little county in Georgia, AND he was not southern (Grant was born in Ohio, and would have never allowed anyone to call him a Southerner) there is no stated backlash for "Southern Republicans."

I think you misunderstood the point of that sentence, which made perfect sense to me. Within a period of approximately seven months, Republicans who lived in the South (Southern Republicans) were so intimidated by Klan tactics or members that whereas 1,222 of them voted Republican in April, only 1 of them voted Republican in November. I did not re-add this sentence to the article; it was already back there again (someone else must have done the reversion), so I'm happy to see that more thoughtful heads have already prevailed. 66.32.35.45 15:53, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Old Political Parties

Should there be some mention in the article that even though the old KKK was mostly Democratic, the Democratic party of the time is in no way related to the party with the same name today? The way the article is right now it raises the impression that the current party was once associated with the KKK. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.40.190.172 (talk) 02:35, 9 January 2007 (UTC).

umm u should listen 2 where is da luv by black eyed peas people...gosh —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 72.199.66.185 (talk) 00:39, 8 March 2007 (UTC).

Actually, 69.152.64.166, the Democratic Party of both the original and the second KKK was, indeed, the Democratic Party of today. It is the same Party, though its positions on racial issues have changed. NCdave 11:39, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

2005 Kingston, NY KKK Rally

I am unable to add this, so somebody might want to.

On November 19, 2005, renowned white supremacist, Hal Turner, rallied the Ku Klux Klan near Kingston High School, Kingston, NY in response to a brutal assault on a 14-year old white teen named Robert Hedrick by a 16-year old black teen named, Joseph L. Williams Jr,. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Darkicon (talk • contribs) 01:28, 13 January 2007 (UTC).

Homophobia?

Last I understood, phobia means "fear." Is this a biased term? Perhaps we should replace it with "anti-homosexuality" or something similar to remove the assumption that they all quiver in fear of the Gay Rights Movement. The Klan, love them or hate them, are pretty brave and unafraid. 207.43.79.22 18:01, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

While phobia literally means "fear," in this context, "homophobia" is used to mean one who hates gays, not actually fears them. The Swagga 22:07, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

The well accepted meaning of the term "homophobia" is hatred or dislike of homosexuals. Language being relative, words have only as much meaning as we give them (for example, there is no one to say we couldn't make homophobia mean, for example, what we now describe as "cup") and the majority of people give the above stated meaning to the term homophobia. Very few people reading the article will mistake "homophobia" for "fear of homosexuals" unless they are young and this is their first time hearing the term. Jaimeastorga2000 09:18, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

I'm not sure about "the well-accepted meaning" of "homophobia," unless you refer to the "well-accepted meaning" by those who want "homophobia" _to mean_ hatred or dislike of homosexuals. Personally, I've heard the word "homophobia" probably as long as it's been in use, and I still am unwilling to use it to mean "hatred of homosexuals," or allow its use in that particular context to go unchallenged. Our language is still based in words that have other words at their roots, and "homophobia" is still, quite literally, the "fear of," not the "hatred of," homosexuals or homosexuality. I, too, agree that "anti-homosexuality" or something similar sums up the meaning quite admirably, and without pandering to the "gay rights" movement and the misuse of the English language that they may feel they require to make their points, attempting to make it appear that straights are "afraid" they'll become homosexual if they associate with homosexuals (and this was the original usage of "homophobia," by the way). After all, look at what's happened to the use of the word "gay" itself. I suggest "hatred of homosexuality" in place of "homophobia." It is both specific and accurate, whereas "homophobia" is neither. 66.32.35.45 15:31, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Agreed. "Homophobia" would technically denote an intense and irrational fear of homosexuals, which isn't what I think the KKK is exhibiting here, I think. JamesMcCloud129 02:21, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

I'm 14 and I know homophobia DOES mean fear OR hatred of homosexuals. --• Storkian • 21:46, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

• English words are defined by how they are used, not by how they should be used. Read the preface to any good dictionary. That said, clarifying the language used in the article is a worthwhile pursuit. Perhaps "violence and threats against homosexuals" is the clearest way to explain the KKK's activities. --Dystopos 21:59, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

Strictly speaking homophohobia means a fear of the same (see the wiki article). The word's current use came about pretty much from gay rights propaganda (not saying they're wrong, but that's just what it is) in an attempt to make the prosecution of gays sound like the prosecutor's problem and that it is without reason.

IE saying 'He doesn't like spiders' or that someone is 'Anti-Spider' seems like the problem is with the spider and that there's a reason why they don't like spiders. Saying someone has 'Arachnophobia' means they have an irrational fear of spiders and it's basicly their problem not the spiders.

Basicly same deal here they added the phobia suffix to make it sound like an irrational fear and to make it sound scientific. I guess if the kkk has some sort of rational basis for their hatred of gays (unlikely) they wouldn't really be called homophobic...--Reyals 00:55, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

P.S. Just because someone has a fear of something doesn't mean they run away screaming (though generally....) take xenophobia for example. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Reyals (talk • contribs) 01:02, 16 May 2007 (UTC).

Suggested addition

This is an interesting article that I found that I thought would be relevant to the article if some of the information could get added, but I just don't know where! Perhaps a more experienced wikipedian could read through it then add where they feel relevant?

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/02/09/national/main2454885.shtml

Etymology

Anyone know the etymology of the name? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by PyroGamer (talk • contribs) 13:15, 22 February 2007 (UTC).

It's already in the article: the Greek "κυκλóς," transliterated "kyklos," and meaning "circle," (sorry, don't remember exactly where the accent goes in the Greek; is that right, or can someone correct it?) coupled with "clan." 66.32.35.45 15:38, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

cfdnotice

The related Category:Ku Klux Klan members and Category:Ex-members of the Ku Klux Klan has been nominated for deletion, merging, or renaming. You are encouraged to join the discussion on the Categories for Discussion page.

ACLU reference

The statement (at the end of the "Present" section)

"The ACLU has provided legal support to various factions of the KKK in defense of their First Amendment rights to hold public rallies, parades, and marches, and their right to field political candidates."

may well be true, but such an audacious claim really needs proof. Does anyone have a reference on this? If not, it should be deleted. MennoMan 21:58, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

It's true. At least the part about rallies, parades & marches is true. I don't know about the political candidates claim, but I suspect that it is true, too.

I recall the famous Skokie NAZI march as a similar example, involving a similarly despicable group, which the ACLU defended. Google finds lots of information on the ACLU's defense of Klan & NAZI rallies and marches as Constitutionally-protected free "speech."

I agree, with you, however, that the ACLU's passion for defending as protected free speech the activities of hate groups seems strangely out of character, since the very same organization also fights even harder to prevent Christian student commencement speakers from praying out loud, which the ACLU argues is Constitutionally-prohibited / non-free speech. To this outsider, the ACLU's rule of thumb when deciding on what speech to defend appears to be: hateful=good/protected, but wholesome=bad/prohibited. Or maybe, as is the common perception, they just like dislike Christians. NCdave 12:46, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

_______________________________________________________________

stormfront.org should be included in the see also. The founder of stormfront Don Black was KKK. David Duke was also KKK.

Lincoln Controversy

The Klan has in fact hid many facts about Lincoln. Upon also reading messages on the Knights 311.org forum, posted by a username Michael Smith, I have discovered more and more facts the Klan have hid about these Lincoln speeches.

Half-truth

I quote at length from the final paragraph of the First Klan: Activities section:

"In an 1868 newspaper interview,[17] Forrest boasted that the Klan was a nationwide organization of 550,000 men, and that although he was not a member, he was "in sympathy" and would "cooperate" with them, and he could muster 40,000 Klansmen with five days' notice. He stated that the Klan did not see blacks as its enemy so much the Loyal Leagues, Republican state governments like Tennessee governor Brownlow's, and other carpetbaggers and scalawags. This was a half truth since one of the main reasons for targeting these white groups was that they were impediments to efforts against the former slaves. The Klan went after white members of these groups, especially the schoolteachers brought south by the Freedmen's Bureau, many of whom had before the war been abolitionists or active in the underground railroad. Many white southerners believed, for example, that blacks were voting for the Republican Party only because they had been hoodwinked by the Loyal Leagues."

Halfway through that paragraph, the term "half-truth" is used to discredit Forrest's words; however, then much of the rest of the paragraph is used to illustrate the truth underlying his statement. Rather than using the damning "half-truth" (a very negative thought) here, shouldn't the context warrant something more to the point that "There was at least some factual basis behind Forrest's remarks," and then list the ways in which white Reconstructionist groups were targets of the Klan's activities? I haven't been part of the editing behind this page, but I couldn't see any reference to this specific topic here on the talk page, so I thought I would bring up this proposal. StavinChain 17:07, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

The KKK is one of the worst things that ever happened in America.

Vandalism

This opening sentence indicates Vandalism. Can any expert look into it please ? "Ku Klux Klan (KKK) or the Kool Kids Klub are a bunch of inbred maggots who enjoy sucking their own cock. They can all have a suffering bloody death. " http://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Ku_Klux_Klan&diff=132172611&oldid=131813395 --Ninad 10:03, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

Lbsrbsxty 23:35, 22 May 2007 (UTC)i would like to helpLbsrbsxty 23:35, 22 May 2007 (UTC)