Talk:The Simpsons

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Fourth Anonymous E.P.

In the Production section is an uncited claim of a fourth, anonymous executive producer who wishes to avoid the press. Sounds bogus; I've neither heard nor read mention of this by anyone involved with the show, nor from any fans of the show. - JoshG

News to me. I reverted it. -- Scorpion 20:23, 18 January 2007 (UTC)

Question from a Brit

In a few episodes, when faced with a difficult situation, a character, or characters will cringe and go something like 'Na-hur-hurgh!' Where does that come from? Martyn Smith 19:36, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

As a fellow Brit, I'm not entirely sure, but I always just thought it was an expression of something like fear, but less scary, as something bad has just happened. Or it's just something just made up, like "Doh" or "Woo Hoo!".Gran2 19:47, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

I think it's a reference to the Three Stooges, they're referenced a lot. Cєlαя∂σяє^Talk 18:14, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Comments

Though I'm pleasantly surprised to see that this has become a featured article, I think it could still use a lot of work. I've done a (very quick) copy-edit and corrected a few minor things, but here are some issues that might require input from more people:

• From the subsection Animation: The last episode to be animated by Klasky Csupo was "Kamp Krusty", in production order. What exactly does "in production order" mean in this sentence? It's just dangling at the end.
  • It means that "A Streetcar Named Marge" was aired later than "Kamp Krusty", but produced before the episode. --Maitch 10:48, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
• From Setting: As a response, in more recent episodes, the show has been intentionally deceptive about the state, and nearly every state and region in the U.S. has been both suggested and ruled out by conflicting evidence. Hasn't the show been making jokes about Springfield's state since, like, the third season? (I'm thinking of Mr. Lisa Goes to Washington.) I don't think this can be considered a recent trend in the series.
  • I think that in the beginning the writers would just do whatever the joke required them to, but as soon as people started to "figure out the clues" they truly becan being deception. However, I do agree that we don't need "in more recent episodes", because it is very vague. What exactly is a recent episode? I would probably say seasen 16 to 18 and we know they did it before then. --Maitch 13:24, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
• From Plots: The show has been rife with political satire over the years, often lampooning current and former U.S. presidents as well as other world leaders. Some examples include: Richard Nixon shown as a friend of the devil in "Treehouse of Horror IV", George H. W. Bush was portrayed as a cantankerous nemesis to Homer in "Two Bad Neighbors", Al Gore's seemingly banal personality being ridiculed, Bill Clinton claiming to have engaged in bestiality in Homer to the Max, and the United Nations frequently shown to be an incompetent and bickering organization. This passage is sloppily-written, and perhaps it could be more specific about Al Gore and the United Nations' appearances on the show. Has the UN really been a "frequent" target of the show, anyway? I can only think of one example off the top of my head (You Only Move Twice), but perhaps they've been lampooned in some of the more recent episodes that I haven't seen. Any help? Zagalejo 00:52, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
• From the same section: There are many episodes of The Simpsons which are less pleasing to social conservatives; for example, in "Homer's Phobia", Homer overcomes homophobia and befriends a gay man, and the episode "There's Something About Marrying" promotes acceptance of gay marriage. Lisa Simpson, the most intelligent member of the Simpson family, is portrayed as an unabashed liberal. Someone should find a source (or sources) to back up the claim that social conservatives were displeased with these episodes. (I'm sure they were, but we do need some sources here.)
• From Recurring jokes and catchphrases: There are many running gags and catchphrases on The Simpsons, several of which have been retired during the series. Have any gags/catchphrases been intentionally "retired", or do most simply fall out of use after a while? I'm not sure about the wording in this passage.
  • Usually the retire a running joke when they can't come up with any more material. This was the case for the prank call joke. --Maitch 09:38, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
    • So, at some point, the writers agreed that they wouldn't do any more prank call jokes? Zagalejo 19:16, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
• From the same section, second paragraph: Recurring jokes are also used. The way this is worded suggests that there is a difference between recurring jokes and the "running gags" introduced in the preceding paragraph. I don't think that's the intention here.
  • The article now uses "running gags" instead of "recurring jokes". --Maitch 09:45, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
• From Guest stars: Many episodes feature celebrity guests contributing their voices to the show, as either themselves or as fictional characters. In the early seasons, it was common for guests to play a character, but during seasons 7-13, guests playing themselves were common, often as a cameo without a significant plot connection. Just during seasons 7-13? I don't know; I think this whole section could use a rewrite. There was no specific moment when celebrities started playing themselves. Tony Bennett appeared as himself, in a mostly insignificant cameo role, way back in season 2.
  • I decided to removed the section and added instead a link and a sentence to the "Voice actors" section. --Maitch 09:35, 8 January 2007 (UTC)
• From Impact on television: It features some of the same editing, the use of sight gags, and does not use a laugh track like most sitcoms. We should be more specific about how the editing of The Simpsons is similar to Malcolm in the Middle, because I'm not sure myself what the similarities are.
• From Merchandise: Music is featured in The Simpsons, with characters breaking into song during the course of the series. The best known song is "Do The Bartman," which was written by Michael Jackson and released as a single, became an international success. The Simpsons Sing the Blues and The Yellow Album contained cover versions of songs, as well as some originals. Songs in the Key of Springfield and Go Simpsonic with The Simpsons are CD collections of original music featured in the TV series. In the United Kingdom, "Deep, Deep Trouble" was released as a follow up to "Do The Bartman". Is "Do the Bartman" still the "best-known song"? I'm not sure how you prove that something is "best-known," but a good number of younger fans have probably never heard of this song. I don't think it's been aired on TV since the early 90s, since it wasn't actually included in an episode.

That's all I have for now, but I might come back with more suggestions later. I hope I don't come across as some sort of a Comic Book Guy. I just want to see this article succeed. Thanks, Zagalejo 00:52, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

For guest stars, yes Tony Bennett was the first person to appear as himself. I was always of the opinion that in recnt season guest star have been brought in for ratings, and do nothing for the story. As they say in Behind the Laughter "trendy guest stars". I mean, when a character is voiced by a celebrity, like Hank Scorpio, they are often considered to be one of the best characters of all time. But when they appear as themselves it doesn't always work. I mean in early seasons, Leonard Nimmoy as himself, both times it made sence, it greatly added to the episode and it was good. But then people like Tony Blair, where it was just weird, and added nothing to the plot. So pbviously you couldn't use what I have just said, as it doesn't make much and couldn't be cited, but I agree the section, and others, need re-writes. So that was a slight rant/point. Gran2 08:28, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

The article still needs some work if we want perfection. I will continue to work on it. Thanks for the copyedits by the way. --Maitch 10:48, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

I'm curious, how do we get the page on the Wikipedia main page? I actually know very little about Wikipedia outside of editing and I was wondering how we do it. -- Scorpion 15:57, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Today's featured article/requests is the answer, I was thinking, although it is a long time away, we coul ask for it on July 27, so it can coincide with the filmns release. But that's only if you would want its featureing to have some meaning. Gran2 16:12, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

I think there are even better dates. 19 April 2007 is date of the Simpsons 20th anniversary and 20 May 2007 is the air date of the 400th episode. --Maitch 18:51, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Nerds

For editing and contributing these pages are best avoided due to the excessive amount of saddos and nerds. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Paul210 (talk • contribs)

Why thank you for taking time out of your busy life to enlighten us with this world changing prophecy. Gran2 08:12, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

The days are over where anybody can insert anything to the article. We want the article to maintain its FA status. If you want to have fun editing then go to another article, which has a lower standard. --Maitch 13:18, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

You mean I can't insert a picture of Homer in a speedo? There's no reason to live! (Runs up stairs and rides a kayak off a mountain) -- Scorpion 15:58, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Well this debate mixes both Nazi-like oppression and 'idiotic-style' humour. Atlantis Hawk 12:23, 18 January 2007 (UTC)

FA

I've been off Wikipedia for a while so could somebody please give me a date of when this article was featured? 220.101.41.184 12:50, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

30 December. Gran2 17:58, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

It hasn't appeared on the front page yet, if that's what you're asking. It passed the FA process on December 30. (Honestly, though, I still think it needs a lot of work.) Zagalejo 20:06, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Okay good, I haven't missed it! Atlantis Hawk 05:19, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

Quotes in the episode summaries

Is it really necessary to add a page and a half of quotes to each episode summary? They could both be considered spoilers, as on most pages, you can find all the jokes in the episode, and they certainly don't add any useful information. How about limiting them to the really famous ones (like the one about cheese eating surrender monkeys)? Sorry for not posting on the appropriate page, but I figured it'd be better to raise the issue here than on 390 separate pages. 217.211.102.6 23:04, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia frowns upon quote sections and we're actually in the process of removing the quotes from many pages, but it's not a priority, so nobody is devoting a lot of time to it. I remove the quotes from every page I edit, and I think others do too. -- Scorpion 23:19, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Mr. Mooch

Is Mr. Mooch Nelson's only pet?67.175.138.202 00:41, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Probably, considering his violent nature, and i can't find any other pets --Kzrulzuall 09:18, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Did Mr. Mooch have something in his eye in The Haw-Hawed Couple?67.175.138.202 01:17, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

You might have better luck posting your questions at the NoHomers.net Q&A thread. Zagalejo 02:01, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, why exactly is this essential to the main Simpsons page? Discuss it at the Nelson page at the very least. -- Scorpion 03:37, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

Hey! Be nice. This User can talk on The main talk page if wants to. The Educational films should be on the Troy McClure page, but he or she they want to talk about it on this page they can if they want to.Kongsaurus12 21:14, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

Bart - Matt or Mark?

In the introduction to the article, it is said that Bart is named after Matt Groening himself, but in the origins section, it is said that he is named after Groening's older brother. I'm not sure which is accurate, but I thought I'd point it out --24.62.34.122 00:33, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

I thought he was named 'Bart' because it is an anagram of 'brat'. Trixovator 12:46, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

You read it wrong. Bart's character is based on Mark Groening, but his name IS an anagram of Brat. -- Scorpion 15:28, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

The Bart Simpson article itself says that no-one really knows who he is named after, but points more in Matt's direction. Surely the articles shouldn't conflict? Trixovator 10:43, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

Hey, here's a second opininion, Bart got his name because it's an anagram of brat. Capisce?Atomic45 08:48, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

that makes sense, but the sections still conflict- based on Matt or his brother?

I believe I heard in an audio commentary or in an interview on one of the DVDs that Matt Groening said that Bart's name was originally going to be "Matt", but thought it would be too obvious (making the parallels from his family's names). In this case, he would be based off of Matt, himself. But without an exact source, this couldn't be added. So if anyone knows where that clip came from, we could use it to back up Bart's origin. --WillMak050389 04:35, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

Archive

How come Archive 6 still has the edit sign? It's an Archive and it shouldn't have the edit sign?67.175.138.202 02:50, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

I will do it, but I don't know how to do it.Kongsaurus12 01:20, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

If anyone knows how to do it, please fix it.Kongsaurus12 01:24, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

Is any one listening. An Archive should not have an edit sign and please fix it.Kongsaurus12 21:19, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

It can not be fixed. It is just a page like everything else. --Maitch 21:26, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

I think the user means that Archive don't have the edit sign and Archive 6 has the edit sign and it shouldn't be there like the other Archives.67.175.138.202 02:51, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

Someone got got rid of the edit sign. Whoever did that...Thank You.Kongsaurus12 22:02, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

Educational films

The Simpsons series is full of mock educational films, yet there is not a single mention about it in the article(?). Svetovid 23:34, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

Well, there's only so much we can include in a hub page like this before the article starts getting incredibly long. FYI, though, there's a list of most of the educational films at Troy McClure's page. Zagalejo 00:01, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps said films could be mentioned at the Education in The Simpsons page. -- Scorpion 14:38, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

Actually, I've had a change of heart. I think we could briefly mention the filmstrips in this article while describing how the show satirizes the American education system. At present, this article says nothing at all about Springfield Elementary, which seems like a significant omission. Zagalejo 15:40, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

I want to do a complete rewrite of the "Plots" section, but I'm waiting for a book I've ordered in order to source it properly. The section should mention Springfield Elementary, but I'm not sure if it is really necessary to include mock educational films. It should however definately be in the Education in The Simpsons article. --Maitch 16:06, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

Which book? I've got Planet Simpson and a couple others, Planet Simpson is an excellent book by the way - I'm considering making a page for it. -- Scorpion 16:16, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

"Leaving Springfield". It has been delayed until mid February. I would also like to read the philosophy book and Planet Simpson, but lets see what I got time for. --Maitch 16:28, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

Anime Counch Gag

Which episode of Simpsons had the anime heroes and which family member was which anime hero67.175.138.202 02:49, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

Again, you'd be better off posting this question at a Simpsons message board. This talk page is reserved for discussions about the Wikipedia article's content; it's not meant for general discussion about the TV show. But since I'm feeling generous, the gag is from 'Tis the Fifteenth Season. Here's a picture. Homer is Ultraman, Marge is Jun, Maggie is Pikachu, Lisa is Sailor Moon and Bart is Astro Boy. Zagalejo 04:45, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia is not a message board. I realize that by writing this I am going against my own axiom, so don't bother pointing out the irony. Dflav1138 01:30, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Setting / Location of Springfield

Although this is a contentious subject, I'd like to offer something:

In the episode "On a Clear Day I Can't See My Sister" (346, GABF05), the couch gag is a zoom out from the couch, out from Springfield, out from the US and so on. When zooming out from the US, although the cartoonist's impression is not perfect, it is an approximate impression of the US landmass and seems to suggest Illinois as the home state. The location of the town of Springfield, IL agrees with the the couch gag location. Further evidence to this is the existence of a town called Shelbyville close to Springfield, IL. What say you? Should this brief hypothesis be added to the main page? Icezebra 14:18, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

No, this page is for general information and not speculation. discuss it in the Springfield talk page. -- Scorpion 14:22, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

Repeats of the famous episode to have mentioned "Kentucky" have been revised to say "Missouri": http://animatedtv.about.com/od/springfield/i/whrsprngfld.h

The first two images

Are there for any reasons? I mean, a pig and a big key? What's the connection with The Simpsons? Gspinoza, 17:15, 30 January 2007 (UTC)

That was vandalism from last night. You should reload the site or purge your cache. Gdo01 17:19, 30 January 2007 (UTC)

Revert

Why does someone keep reverting my action figure link? Instead of it looking like this> action figures, I made it look like this> action figures. Someone keeps reverting back! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Supergeeky1 (talk • contribs)

Because it is against policy to make hidden links like that. --Maitch 11:16, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

I'm sorry, I didn't realize that. Supergeeky1 06:16, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

Guiness World Record

The Simpsons won the Guinness World Record for Longest Running Animated TV Series, does any-one else think it's good for the article. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Atomic45 (talk • contribs) 08:55, 6 February 2007 (UTC).

The articles already stated that The Simpsons is the longest running animated TV series. People would assume that if they broke the record, it would be on the Guinness book of records. A small footnote towards the book will do, and its already on there. There will probably be no more reason to add any more information. --[|.K.Z|][|.Z.K|] 09:21, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

Typo

Please correct "controvery" to "controversy" 13:35, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

I have completed this for you [1]. Thank you for pointing it out. --WillMak050389 14:18, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

The Simpsons are from ....

The Simpsons are from Norther Kentucky, most probably Illinois, which have a city called sprigfield [2].

And if you watch the episode Behind the Laughter, the voice commentator says that they are from Northern Kentucky. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Tamaeril (talk • contribs) 07:30, 27 February 2007 (UTC).

No, no they arn't. They arn't from any state. See Springfield's state (The Simpsons). Gran2 07:41, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

The behinf the laughter episode is considered non-canon. rhodrifawrRhodrifawr 08:40, 4 March 2007 (UTC)04 march 2007Rhodrifawr 08:40, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

I agree with Gran2, but let me say it in a different way. More than saying "the Simpsons aren't from any state", I think the poetic idea here is that the Simpsons "ARE FROM EVERY STATE". The Simpsons are "Americans", they are Joe and Jane America. As a comparison, the character Al Bundy from the longest running sitcom Married...With children is understood as being "every man", a hero with whom the average American man can identify. The Simpsons deliberately avoids identifying with one state or region in order to allow all Americans to embrace them as theirs, which is a far more powerful means of engendering an emotional attachment; also, it allows the show to avoid being handcuffed into a certain politic or viewpoint, which supports the show's ability to look at any and all oddities in life. Nothing is sacred, everything gets a critical eye (politics, law enforcement, education, religion, culture and race, gender...) - everything is in play precisely because we can't say the Simpsons are "Bible belt South'ners" or "midwest bumpkins" or "eastern city slickers" or "west coast wierdos" or...whatever. They're none of them - and all of them, all at the same time.

Nuff said?

dgaubin 14:55, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

The F word

Which simpsons episode was the first to use the word fuck. even when the word censored.67.175.138.202 00:16, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

Try the NoHomers.net Q&A thread. I have no idea, and as it is, this space is reserved for discussions about the Wikipedia article itself. There's some implied usage in "Homer and Apu" (the scene where James Woods is cleaning the Kwik-E-Mart microwave), but I'm not sure that's what you're looking for. Zagalejo 00:46, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

The word was used in I Love Lisa.Kongsaurus12 22:09, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

And in Who Shot Mr. Burns? (Part One) where Burns didn't put his name on the thank you note.

Hey when did the part in I love Lisa, have the word fuck in it?67.175.138.202 22:59, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

Sideshow Mel said the word in I Love Lisa.Kongsaurus12 23:02, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

Main page

I have a made a request for this article to featured on the main page of Wikipedia and requested April 19, because it is the 20th annoversary of the first Ullman short. The text I used is basically the current article lead, except with the cites gone and the last paragraph cut out. Any revisions or suggestions are more than welcome. You can find it here-- Scorpion 06:26, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

Contradiction

In the introduction, it says that Groening chose the name Bart for himself, but in the next section, says Bart was Groening's brother's substitute name. Naysie 01:10, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

It is explained better in the Bart Simpson article. I have removed it from this article, because it is not that important and people keep asking about it. --Maitch 19:41, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

D'oh

I just looked up this word in the Oxford English Dictionary, and apparently it has been in the language since the 50's. This is problematic for the intro section, although a simple fix is possible. If we could find a specific date at which it was added to an American Dictionary, that would satisfy me, as the argument is that it entered the popular American lexicon through the Simpsons, not that it entered the language this way. Wrad 06:21, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps the article could say that the show popularised the word? It certainly did that. --Mike 09:36, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

Spoken version of article

I would like to record a spoken version of this article. Any suggestions or objections? (besides those included in the reading guidelines) Notbot 02:35, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

I don't see why not. Good idea. Gran² 05:51, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

Go ahead. Even if anyone objects to your version in any way, it could always be removed or deleted. Practice your "annoyed grunt" though so you get it right. D'oh! Quadzilla99 05:40, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

Season 20?

Does anyone know whether or not there will be a 20th Season of The Simpsons? Any news from Fox?-mattawa

Not yet, but even if they do decide to stop the production of The Simpsons now, it is very likely that there will at least be a short season 20. They are about 8 episodes ahead of the aired seasons, so unless they decide to air 30 episodes during season 19, there will be some left for season 20. --Maitch 15:34, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Besides, if Fox drop the Simpsons then someone else will just pick it up, so the show would probably continue anyway JayKeaton 04:01, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

Required or not?

I've done a big copyedit of the article [3] (the first half at lease) and I'd like opinions as to whether these sentences are needed in the article.

• (On Julie Kavner) She has been known to refuse to perform Marge's voice in public, to maintain the mystique of the character.

JameiLei 12:19, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

I don't care that much whether it stays or goes, but since it is unsourced, I'm leaning towards removing it. --Maitch 20:31, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

Unprotect

{{editprotected}}

Free the edit — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nate Speed (talk • contribs)

There's a reason why the page has been protected. If you have recently created an account, please wait a few days to be able to contribute to the article. Alternatively, say what you would like changed here and a registered user will update the page for you. JameiLei 20:29, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

I removed the edit protection. -- Samir 01:25, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Middle American

Being from the United Kingdom, I am unaware of the term Middle American. Could someone briefly explain if and why the Simpsons class as Middle American so I can support the claim with some additional but not unnecessary information. JameiLei 22:13, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

Middle American usually denotes their class status. Neither upper nor lower class, but Middle class. For some it also hints at their geographic location, as the Midwest, or geographically Middle America, is the bulk of the middle class, with many of the major cities (New York, Miami, LA, Seattle, for instance), mostly upper and lower class, lining the coast.Thesetrixaintforkids 20:14, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

Homer once stated that their family was upper-lower-middle class. If one thinks about it, it means the upper part of the lower section of middle class. This could probably be abreiviated to mid-middle class. Emperor001 23:51, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

For a very good, if fairly uncited, explanation, read the Middle America (United States) article

FA

I have a question. Why was the FA status removed? I will revert that removal until this is explained. Sjones23 01:03, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

Check the links on the FA template at the top of this page. Wrad 01:07, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

Shortening the Page

Perhaps the simpsons article is too long. There are so many sub-articles that the main page probably does not need to sum them all up. For instance, the movie section can probably be shortened up or left out completely if there is already an article about it. 12.216.100.205 21:25, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

I disagree. It's fine as it is. --LtWinters 00:43, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

The article is within Wikipedia's recommandation for article size. --Maitch 09:32, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Rumor?

I heard that after The Simpsons Movie, they will end the show. Is this true? -Yancyfry 03:28, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

Nope; it's been renewed for another season. (Check out Google News.) Zagalejo 03:47, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

Screen Shots

Why aren't screne shots of each episode uploaded/allowed? I feel this adds A LOT to each episode capsule. Is it possible FOX can allow these for Wikipedia use?

What are you talking about? Each episode page clearly has a screenshot... Gran² 05:49, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

copy editing

how can we copy edit the damn page when it is locked? or is this just because I don't have an account?

Because you don't have an account. Gran² 07:39, 28 May 2007 (UTC)