Talk:Scouse

There was a {{POV check}} template inserted on this page for no apparent reason, with no attempt made to justify it. I have removed it. Previously there was a cleanup notice, but I can't see any need for that as the article seems to be a perfectly reasonable linguistics discussion of the Scouse accent. -- Arwel 11:10, 2 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I'm inserting a POV check on the article, because many of the things aren't clear as to what the mean. For example, The final letters of many words are often lost in a glottal stop: i.e. 'get' becomes 'gerr.'

What is meant by gerr hear? Does that mean that they pronounce get to rhyme with burr and purr or does it rhyme with the first syllable of terror?

I think the article does need a cleanup, Steve.

The first case - I think the glottal stop article explains what it is reasonably well. Anyway, this is not a POV issue, which is used when two contributors are disputing the contents of an article - a cleanup request would be more appropriate. -- Arwel 19:51, 3 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Why are they representing the word get with a glottal stop using two r's? An r at the end of a word is not pronounced as a glottal stop and so the spelling gerr does not make it clear what is meant.

{{Cleanup}} is more appropriate than {{POV check}}. But I've also added {{Unsourced}} because we need to have references to linguistic descriptions of the dialect. As for what needs cleaning up, the phonetic transcription should be in IPA so there's no uncertaintly about how get (for example) is pronounced. Also, there needs to be some context about how Scouse compares to other accents of English English: pronouncing get as [gɛʔ] is certainly not unique to Liverpool, but replacing /θ ð/ with /t, d/ probably is (within England). --Angr/_comhrá 14:26, 24 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

'Lancashire has one of the most diverse selections of spoken accents of any English county or region.'

Liverpool's no longer in Lancashire. Whether it should be or not is a different matter, but this statement is either inaccurate, or if modern Lancashire does have one of the most diverse selections of spoken accents of any English county or region, irrelevent to this article.

is there any point in listing all the scouse words we can think of? it turns the article into a bit of a farce and it will never cover anywhere near enough to fully document scouse slang. this page isn't the appropriate vessel for that.

'Lid'

My god, I don't believe all these scouse people never heard of lid before, it is derived from slanging rhyme " BIN LID " = Kid scousers shortened it to lid.. It has even been used in films, was in the Liver birds, and was very common all over Liverpool especially the City. "Look at those bin lids over there up to no good" was common in St Johns market every Saturday I assure you.

Okay, 'lid' is very commonly used. End of. I've also lived in Liverpool all my life.

Indeed the Lancashire comment is out of date. I've never heard of 'Lid' either

I've lived in Liverpool all my life as well, and I've never heard the use of 'Lid'. Even 'La' is fairly rare, but as far as I know 'Lid' isn't heard at all. James R 20:14, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

I've also lived in Liverpool all my life, and I'm 100% sure that 'lid' is never used. 'La' is going out of use, but it is still quite common. --EddieBernard 17:08, 15 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Ok, maybe we need the originator of the input ``lid`` to comment, certainly as a 57 Year old Scouser, it is news to me !

I've lived on Wirral all my life and never heard it. 81.79.22.201 18:33, 23 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

its been doing my head in for ages and ive finally deleted it. nobody i know has ever heard of 'lid' being used for lad. im sorry but thats the way it is:) Samgb 10:37, 30 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

excuse me, sorry to rain on your parade... im 19 and from halewood, and "lid" was fairly common here about 6 months ago, it has however declined in use since then. i have friends from anfield and further north but theyve never heard of it. maybe its a south liverpool word. It definately has been in use though. i may change it. seany87

seany87 im halewood too mate and honestly not heard it. the majority here seem not to have either! if you want it in go for it but it obviously isnt widely used and i would certainly put 'la' and 'lad' before it. cheers Samgb 08:10, 5 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

samgb - i cant believe youve never heard it before! i think its still quite commonly used, although obviously not as much as la or lad. ill do a compromise and say its used rarely. seems to be the fairest way. seany87

I live on the Wirral - you don't hear 'lid' around here very much but I regularly hear it used by friends who live in Liverpool. 80.93.170.99 08:12, 11 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Yer 'lid' was common like a year ago, just another term for lad. diedof quite quick like.

i'm from huyton and lid is still very common. so is lad. la is said but getting rarer and usually replaced by lad or lid. and i'm not talking about a small group of people here either. a lad - december 2006

Viking sources?

Are there not grounds that the word 'scouse' is of Viking origin? They settled in the Wirral and Lancashire in the 10th C after being ejected from Ireland, and (though I'm admittedly looking for a reliable source) "scouse" is purportedly a Viking word for "marsh" and also "stew"; Scandinavians still eat Lobscaus. Being such a marshy region at the time, it could have been used to describe the region just as "Liverpool" does. Given that many placenames on the Wirral still have Viking origins there seems to be a logical follow-through.

Other Dialects

Can we also add links to other english accents/dialects under a See Also section?

Merseyside

Scouse is the accent and dialect of English found in the northern English city of Liverpool and adjoining urban areas of Merseyside, northwestern Cheshire and Skelmersdale, West Lancashire.

Is it appropriate to call most of Merseyside's accent "Scouse", as the article currently does? Is there a distinctive Wirral accent? Johnny Vegas provides an example of a distinctive St Helens accent - how about other areas? And is Skelmersdale actually Scouse? DWaterson 17:44, 30 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with this point, though there is no distinctive Wirral accent. It's extremely similar to the Scouse of north Liverpool and is particularly strong in Birkenhead and adjoining areas and Heswall. Regarding St Helens, the accent for parts of this borough is near identical to Liverpool scouse, but you do hear some with elements of Lancashire (such as Johnny Vegas or Carley Stenson). Sefton is also an exception - the accent of Formby and areas northwards (particularly Southport) is usually Lancashire. L1v3rp00l 18:06, 6 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The problem here is that it is thought that anywhere in Merseyside is Liverpool linked. This is not so. 'Scouse' accent is Liverpool accent, not Merseyside accent. The only people with a Liverpool accent in such places, in Merseyside, as Haydock, Newton le Willows, Garswood and Billinge, are those who are from Liverpool and have moved there. The older residents of these places often speak with a 'broad' Lancashire accent. There are a lot of Liverpool people who now live in parts of Wigan, just out of Merseyside. Winstanley, for instance, would pass as being in Liverpool if the local pub was visited during a televised football match! 80.192.242.187 17:30, 31 December 2006 (UTC) JemmyH.[reply]

Having lived on the Wirral all my life, I think there definately is a distinctive Wirral accent that is a bit softer than the Liverpool one. Also, the article says scouse is also heard in north Wales, think thats stretching it a bit and should be removed. Wilston 22:45, 8 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

It's not stretching it at all. The English-speaking accent of northeast Wales (as opposed to the Welsh-speaking accent) can sound very Scouse, especially near the coast.Bedesboy 21:46, 7 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Pook?

Is the first line of the article the best place for this info? Also note that there is no reference to 'Pook' in East Sussex --jazzle 09:25, 20 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Nob'ead?

Thats hardly scouse specific is it? Hear all over the country probably and definetely in London

Perhaps not, but maybe it originated in Liverpool like many words taken for granted across Britain, such as "shag" and "made up". Pobbie Rarr 02:11, 31 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Christian Bale

Why was he deleted? When he isn't using an accent he sounds exactly like Ringo Starr.70.249.240.12 09:25, 8 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Christian Bale is Welsh. SteveLamacq43 00:03, 1 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

So? I've heard Scouse accents well into North Wales before the Welsh accent starts. Being a different nationality doesn't change your accent neccessarily Big Moira 21:38, 26 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I've heard scouse accents well into Spain too. I have a place in Mora, Moira (bum-bum) and my neighbour (600 mtrs away, thank heavens for that) is a 'scouser', but he says he's not a scouser as he only comes from Huyton? 80.192.242.187 17:35, 31 December 2006 (UTC) JemmyH.[reply]

... which I guess exactly proves the point you made above, ie that "The problem here is that it is thought that anywhere in Merseyside is Liverpool linked". Huyton is in Knowsley. Actually, then this seems to exactly DISPROVE your subsequent point, that "'Scouse' accent is Liverpool accent, not Merseyside accent". Please, JemmyH, make your mind up! SoniaUK 21:50, 7 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Most people from outside of Merseyside would identify most of the regions inhabitants as having Scouse accents, but for residents of the various areas, certain locales produce a much broader accent. Think of it as a kind of continuum, with a softer accent spoken in the outskirts, hardening as you approach the central areas around the Mersey. 88.212.174.4 00:47, 15 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

lerd

This word is used in the speech examples given for 'jigger' and 'pure'. It doesn't sound like any scouse word I've ever heard - I assume it's supposed to mean 'lad'? I've never heard it said that way. Johnwccres 13:11, 9 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Non-Scouse

A lot of the words / phrases listed as Scouse dialect are common in many parts of the UK, e.g. cackhanded, gob, knackers, leg it. It looks as if someone has got carried away and tried to include every slang expression used in Liverpool regardless of where else it is used. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 80.7.20.133 (talk) 00:04, 18 March 2007 (UTC).[reply]

Aye-eh - calm down! Maybe nicking other people's slang is just another event from the Scouse Olympics Bedesboy 20:17, 7 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Ok it may just be me, but the word kopite is meant to be koptie in that list of Liverpools words.