Talk:Nine Inch Nails

Template:OhioSAN

Alternative metal

Do you think NIN are alt. metal or is this a stupid question? Thundermaster^{Thundermaster's Talk} 12:37, 3 December 2007 (UTC)

Yes. It used to be in the genre list. It definitely should be included, not the least because NIN is considered metal to an extent (hence why this article is under the scope of WikiProject Metal). WesleyDodds (talk) 11:47, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

I dunno, I don't really see what's so metally about NIN's music, myself. Though I suppose if a few good sources back it up then my own opinion doesn't really matter. Drewcifer (talk) 12:21, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

It's better than saying their alternative rock! Seriously, they are NOT, they are far from mainstream Titan50 (talk) 11:19, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

NIN not mainstream? Odd notion. Zazaban (talk) 16:37, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

NIN are quite mainstream, but they are like heavy alt. rock aka alternative metal. Thundermaster^TRUC 14:08, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

We could debate this ad naseum, but since this is Wikipedia, the important thing is a source. If we find a reliable source that says they're alt metal then fine. Same thing goes for alternative rock, for that matter. What we really should be discussing is which source to go by, since inevitably the souces will disagree slightly with one another. Drewcifer (talk) 23:09, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

Please stop switching the genres, NIN is clearly Industrial Rock over Alternative Rock. In fact, the opening line says Industrial rock, yet Alternative Rock is on top. tribestros (talk) 15:22, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

One more vote here for Industrial Rock. Bmc152006 (talk) 22:36, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

I think NIN would be labeled as electronic, experimental, or industrial. It really doesn't fit with the metal genre. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.2.32.93 (talk) 22:48, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

This isn't an issue of you me or anyone else thinks NIN sounds like, ultimately we need to leave it up to a reliable source. And that said, this source should ultimately be discussing NIN in as broad of a context as possible, since we could quote an article about Ghosts and say NIN is dark ambient, but then we could quote an article about With Teeth and say NIN is Alt. Metal. Or Year Zero and say it's electronic music. We need to find a source or sources that describes the music in general, then attribute the band's genre to that source, rather than voting here for or the other. Drewcifer (talk) 22:59, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Just a suggestion - use AMG for genres if there's a dispute. I've seen similar discussions on talk pages for other artists, and it's a good neutral source for that kind of info. dil (talk) 01:17, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

AMG lists Industrial as first under "Styles." I am changing the order of the genres to reflect this. -65.12.134.148 (talk) 03:33, 8 May 2008 (UTC)

Ghosts I-IV

I have rewritten the section so that it is almost completely cited. The first paragraph needs to be cited, and the whole thing needs a copyedit. May I remind everyone that this is an FA quality article, and we need to keep on top of these recent developments so as to not upset this article's status. -- Reaper X 04:49, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

Not sure if it's a valid enough for citing on an FA but the nin.com posts referenced in the first paragraph are archived here and here. Also the Billboard article already referenced could be used for the second half of the first paragraph. If you want an additional source you could use The LA Times —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jmcbns (talk • contribs) 21:55, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

Seeing as how it's definitely something different (for the band and mainstream music as a whole), I think it may be worth noting that NIN apparently made an official release of Ghosts I on multiple torrent sites, including TPB, under Creative Commons. Here is one news source referencing the release. I'm not sure if Reznor has said anything to verify it yet, though. If it can be verified enough, though, then it should noted in some fashion probably. Dfsghjkgfhdg (talk) 02:55, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

Influence

Dunno if it's just me but shouldn't something be included in this section in reference to the way that he has changed the music industry, alongside Radiohead. Not only was With_Teeth the first major studio release to be streamed online in it's entirety before release at Reznor's behest, but there was the whole leaking tracks from Year Zero and the ARG (alternative marketing), the whole Niggy Tardust experiment and now the current Ghosts release, setting a new precedent for online label less releases and his association with torrenting, both his own material and his admittance to using Oink.

Personally I believe he's done more than anyone to begin breaking the power of labels in the modern day, Radiohead's stunt was just that, a stunt, it was for marketing purposes only and they openly admit to it. Whereas the Ghosts release was always intended for the internet and was intended as a way of proving that artists can survive without labels, which it seems be be doing very well indeed. Ajp100688 (talk) 01:52, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

Seems like it would be an appropriate addition, but with sources of course. But we should be careful of assuming too much has come from this single release: it's only been out a few days, so to say it "changed the music industry" would be really hasty. Nothing at all has changed because of Reznor's experiments, aside from a few albums which he has been directly involved with. Drewcifer (talk) 01:56, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

But would this be influence? At least not yet. We should wait a few months to see if any more bands follow NIN's online trend before posting it as an influence.

Gary Talapas

would anyone happen to have anymore information about Gary Talpas to add to the page. He is the designer of a few nine inch nails album covers and the nin logo. thanks

I tried to add some sources for you. AtaruMoroboshi (talk) 19:20, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Year Zero Part 2

With the release of Ghosts, many NIN fans assume the Year Zero Pt. 2 is dead. According to Trent Reznor's user profile on Echoing the Sound, teitan, the project is still in the works, and includes "many other elements". The teitan user is in fact Trent Reznor, check with the Echoing the Sound mods if infact you do not believe me. Until then, please do not delete what I write surrounding this. tribestros (talk) 14:33, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Your edits (edit: if you are IP 70.245.71.28) had conjecture regarding "rumors surrounding" the project was dead. I didn't assume that, others may not have as well. It is a broad unsourced statement. I question article integration at this point, because there is nothing material to write about. The second album is still forthcoming. If anything maybe a sourced line in the Ghosts section stating, the Ghosts album was independent of Pt. 2, and did not replace it. AtaruMoroboshi (talk) 19:44, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

I was using the Nine Inch Nails official fansite Echoing the Sound as my source for fans assuming the project was dead. The general concensus there was that Trent Reznor was dropping the project. tribestros (talk) 14:49, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Not withstanding, perhaps we should wait to include when we have more information than "He's doing it." Maybe others can comment so we can get a consensus. Thanks! AtaruMoroboshi (talk) 19:56, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

I agree. tribestros (talk) 15:18, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Minor clarification -- Echoing the Sound is an unofficial message board. Thx. Leviathant (talk) 15:36, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Noted. AtaruMoroboshi (talk) 15:46, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Nine Inch Nails: Band?

Nine Inch Nails is most certainly not a band, and I think it is decieving to label NIN as a band on the Wikipedia page. On nearly almost every album booklet except The Fragile, the booklet says NIN is Trent Reznor. I'm not really quite sure what else to put there, but I do believe 'band' should be changed, NIN fits none of the categories. tribestros (talk) 15:25, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Well, I don't know if it is "deceiving", as you put it, since NIN does tour with a band. Though I do agree a distinction should be made. Take a look at the archived discussion page and see if any consensus appears there, I'm willing to bet this issue has come up before. I also think there may be some other band talk pages that have addressed similar issues. AtaruMoroboshi (talk) 20:38, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

As I read the archives, there was one argument over the box. That was it. I'll take a break and try to figure out how to phrase the beginning. Tribestros (talk) 20:46, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

I believe calling it an act instead of a band in the opening paragraph solves the issue. Any arguments against it ? (Fbergo (talk) 23:01, 16 March 2008 (UTC))

No, that's a great idea. I'll change it now. Tribestros (talk) 14:27, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

For the sake of clarity and inclusion the lead should acknowledge, that Trent Reznor is a constant, though Nine Inche Nails is commonly referred to as a "band." Nine Inch Nails can still be referred to as an "act", but needs further clarification. AtaruMoroboshi (talk) 15:26, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

In nearly every booklet, the headline states 'NIN is Trent Reznor'. The Fragile has a few other musicians, but the only reason NIN is ever considered a band is because it seems easier. Tribestros (talk) 21:05, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

I disagree that the 'only reason' anyone would consider it a band is because 'it's easier.' It more has to do with the fact that a) Live performances are done with a band, and b) There are countless NIN music videos that feature live performances or depict a band. I can name NIN music videos from every album up to Year Zero that feature a band (most recently survivalism comes to mind). This is not to say I personally considered NIN a "band", I don't. But proper weight should be given to specifically delineate that there is a band in multiple iterations that has appeared in music videos, and performed live. Despite our obvious interest in NIN, the casual non-discerning fan who may only be familiar with closer, is none the wiser. As I said before, it should be further clarified. AtaruMoroboshi (talk) 02:25, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

I think you'll find that Pretty Hate Machine is the only release that claims "Nine Inch Nails is Trent Reznor." Besides, it's generally understood that "band" in the context of music means the identity of a musical entity, that is, the identity under which records are released, tours are booked, etc. Thus, it's appropriate to call Nine Inch Nails a band; particularly since Reznor has made the distinction between NIN's music and Trent Reznor's music on the Lost Highway soundtrack. - rynne (talk) 20:18, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Sorry to sound smug, but as I look at Year Zero, The Downward Spiral, and Broken's booklet, this line jumps out at me: "Written and Performed by Trent Reznor." Tribestros (talk) 00:48, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

Which, unless I'm reading wrong, isn't "Nine Inch Nails is Trent Reznor." Semantics aside, I don't think there's any reason to claim that NIN is equivalent to Trent Reznor or that this article should use some non-standard nomenclature to talk about NIN. -- rynne (talk) 19:11, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Trent himself regularly (in interviews, onstage, etc.) refers to "my band, Nine Inch Nails" as a separate entity from himself. Add to this the synonymous way the article's prose interchanges "NIN", "Nine Inch Nails" and "the band" without problem and we have a longstanding consensus that NIN is a band. BotleySmith (talk) 20:14, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Well, I need to find the article, but Trent has claimed that the only reason he refers to NIN as his band because he doesn't want to be counted as a solo project, because he's not a big fan of solo artists. He says "technically, NIN is a solo act. But I consider us a band," Where, oh where is the article... tribestros (talk) 23:05, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Front page of nin.com today: "the band has been reformed." -- rynne (talk) 20:43, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

Discipline

My local rock station (102.1 Milwaukee's Alternative) is going to be playing it tonight. They said that yesterday night Trent's "manager" (does he even have one?) called them and told them that it would be arriving, and today they recieved the single via e-mail. Also, Trent wishes to make the single free--and thus will release it for free download tomorrow afternoon. I don't know if this helps or not, but I thought it'd be an interesting bit of info.

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.114.233.112 (talk) 23:32, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Yep, NIN's manager is Jim Guerinot and this information is confirmed on the front page of this evening's nin.com update! BotleySmith (talk) 01:41, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Featured Topic

So I have noticed alot of work going into some of the later Nine Inch Nails stuff lately, and it led me to think: what if we made Nine Inch Nails a featured topic? Let's review what we have:

Main page	Articles
Template:FA iconNine Inch Nails	Template:FA iconNine Inch Nails discography - Nine Inch Nails live performances‎ - Trent Reznor - Year Zero (album) - Ghosts I–IV - With Teeth - The Fragile - The Downward Spiral - Pretty Hate Machine - The Slip

Wikipedia:Featured topic criteria

WP:FT? presents the following requirements: It is a set of similar, interrelated articles that cover a specific topic (a) There are at least three distinct articles.  Done (b) The articles have a clear similarity with each other under a well-defined topical scope.  Done (c) All articles in the topic are linked together, preferably using a template, and share a common category or super-category.  Done (d) There is no obvious gap (missing or stub article) in the topic. A topic must not cherry pick only the best articles to become featured together.  Done The topic has an introductory and summary lead article or list.  Done Each article is of high quality, including references.  Not done (a) A number of articles are featured class (featured articles or featured lists), according to the following rules: (i) At least twenty percent (rounded up) of the articles are featured class.  Done (ii) At least two articles are of featured class.  Done (b) All other articles are good articles.  Not done (c) Items that cannot achieve a high rating (as stated in 3.a and 3.b) due to their limited subject matter have passed an individual audit for quality which included a completed peer review with all important problems raised fixed. Such items cannot be used to fulfill criterion 1.a. Not Applicable

---

So the only criteria we haven't met are 3(a) which will be met if Year Zero passes it's FAC, and possibly 1(d). Now as for that, do you think that we could have a "gap" because we have included NIN's two latest major studio releases, but nothing before it? In that case, I think With Teeth and The Downward Spiral are in good shape to tackle, and Pretty Hate Machine would need major work poured into it. Thoughts? -- Reaper X 21:58, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

Featured topic is definitely the eventual goal, but we have to get everything pre-Year Zero into shape first. Like the criteria says, we can't just cherry pick the good ones. Drewcifer (talk) 22:06, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

The "nom box" has been updated accordingly then. I'll see if I can contribute, but no promises with my academic load thus far. -- Reaper X 01:41, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Cool, some more help is always appreciated. Drewcifer (talk) 05:36, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

I made some suggestions for improvements on the Pretty Hate Machine and The Fragile talk pages. I'd recommend taking the time to take these article by article, working collectively to bring them up to Good article status, and then working on either the Trent or Year Zero article enough to bring at least one of them up to FA status. It might take quite a long time but I definitely think it's possible. --Ubiq (talk) 18:14, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Yea, I knew it would take some time, but I just thought it was a neat idea to bring to everyones attention, especially seeing as there is only 14 Arts FT's. -- Reaper X 21:36, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

New album

New album, The Slip http://www.nin.com/ http://theslip.nin.com/ Another completely unannounced album...

Those who wish to can begin contributing to the individual album article at The Slip (album). AtaruMoroboshi (talk) 12:18, 5 May 2008 (UTC)