Talk:Lee Atwater

What's with the Rove and Bush comment?

Bounce polling is NOT a research technique, it's a smear tactic. For example, when Bush did it against McCain, he called up 10,000 homes in South Carolina, and asked: "If you found out that John McCain fostered 3 black children out of wedlock with his mistress, would you vote for him?"

It's not true, but the idea is make people think that John McCain has fostered 3 children out of wedlock. The polsters don't care about the answers (hence, it's not a research technique). The only purpose of it is to make people think bad things about the other guy, and that's a smear tactic.

--Raul654 16:20, 20 Oct 2003 (UTC)

The linking of Atwater doing or inventing bounce polling comes from Lies and the Lying Liars Who Tell Them, a book by liberal American humorist Al Franken. Franken does not cite any source. Jimmy Breslin, in an August 3, 1989 column in Newsday, states that Atwater denied it. I am removing the reference until another source is cited. (Breslin's POV is almost a lock on Franken's, so it's not a case of clashing POVs.) Ellsworth 23:01, 18 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Atwater/Rove/Bush connection

Dropped this sentence:

During that election, Atwater was assigned a "minder" by the Bush campaign, George W. Bush. The younger Bush's political strategist, Karl Rove, would later employ Atwater's dirty tricks tactics against John McCain in the 2000 Republican primary.

This has been disputed, please cite sources if it is to be in the article. Ellsworth 20:37, 16 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I've restored some of this material, with clarifications. It's well known that Atwater was a political mentor and personal friend of Karl Rove, but their relationship actually predates the 1988 presidential campaign by more than 15 years. According to Time magazine (December 20, 1999), Atwater "ran Rove's successful campaign to become president of the College Republicans in 1973." Boy Genius, the biography of Rove by Lou Dubose, Jan Reid and Carl M. Cannon, also offers details about their friendship and notes allegations of Rove's involvement in dirty tricks dating back to the 1970s. (See, for example, pages 10-12.) The fact that George W. Bush had an office across the hall from Lee Atwater so that he could serve as a "minder" during the 1988 presidential campaign has also been reported in a number of places, including the Austin American-Statesman (February 21, 1999).

I've left out the specific reference to dirty tricks against McCain in 2000. Atwater was long dead by then, and although he was a mentor of Karl Rove during his lifetime, it doesn't seem accurate to suggest that Atwater was the mastermind of every dirty trick with which Rove or others have been associated. He's only responsible for the activities that he himself planned and undertook. --Sheldon Rampton 07:52, 17 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

That looks good. Ellsworth 23:45, 18 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Lead paragraph

I've taken out the references to Terry McAuliffe and James Carville that an anonymous user keeps trying to add to the lead paragraph. Atwater was a Republican party strategist and a personal friend and mentor of both Karl Rove and George W. Bush. He was not a friend and mentor of McAuliffe or Carville. The anonymous user seems to be trying to insert a sort of "forced balance" into the lead that is actually POV rather than documentable fact. It may or may not be the case that McAuliffe and Carville use similar methods, but it is definitely not the case that they learned their political skills under his tutelage.

If other people find the current version unsatisfactory, I would suggest removing the entire sentence that begins, "Though Atwater died in 1991..." His relationship with Rove and Bush is described with greater precision elsewhere in the article anyway, and I don't think it needs to be part of the lead paragraph. --Sheldon Rampton 06:23, 20 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]