Wikipedia talk:Deletion reform/Proposals/Uncontested deletions

As the originator of this proposal (although it is far from original - Radiant! suggested something similar recently) can I ask that this be a discussion, not a poll at this stage. --Doc (?) 21:38, 10 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

General Comments

Good idea. No code changes needed. Let's do it. JesseW, the juggling janitor 19:34, 10 October 2005 (UTC)

Yes. This also avoids the problem with proposals for early AFD closing - that some people may not show up until late, or some good argument may not be made until too late. ~~ N (t/c) 20:16, 10 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Sounds like a good way to make the process more efficient, while not causing any problems. Martin 21:19, 10 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

A relatively small number of AfD articles are ever truly contested. Most are either overwhelmingly slated for deletion or overwhelmingly slated to be kept. I think we need a process to filter both kinds out quickly - this helps for those that are obvious (but not speedy) deletes, I'd also like to see a proposal for accelerated retention of obvious (but not speedy) keeps. BDAbramson ^talk 21:42, 10 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

This does not solve quick 'keeps' - but most uncontested nominations are 'delete'. However, it may help the 'keep' cases, as if someone nominates for deletion under this system, if the tag is subsequently removed - and a good reason given on the talk page (i.e. 'yes he is notable, you've missed this ...' or verifying references are added) there is good chance that the nominator will not push the point and take the matter to afd/contested deletions. --Doc (?) 21:56, 10 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Good point, I hope it works out exactly that way. BDAbramson ^talk 22:16, 10 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Hmmm. I like it but - if there are articles on AfD that are overwhelmingly voted for one way or the other, it strikes me that it would be better for CSD to be expanded, instead of introducing another class of potentially deletable articles. By extension, we could have an unlimited number of "categories" for articles ranging from "speedy deleted within minutes of creation" to "kept after 7 months of arguing", each with varying rules and thresholds. Would you consider expanding on why the purpose of this proposal cannot be accomplished by a widening of CSD?--inks ^T 23:07, 10 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

The problem with speedy deletion is that there is almost no double-checking. I have seen many articles nominated for AfD where the nominator seemed to believe that it was an obvious band vanity or dicdef or whatever, but to have someone jump up and point out how important the subject is (or better, improve the article to the point where it is a clear keep). The waiting period and central location for people to review the reasons and votes give an easy way to ensure that every article gets at least some second scrutiny before being deleted. — brighterorange (talk) 04:23, 11 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- Double/triple/quadruple checking would be easy enough to implement - e.g. A Speedy article needs to have the signatures of 2/3/4/N number of admins who agree it is a speedy candidate before it can be deleted. Perhaps more importantly, the current proposal only deals with articles that are clearly deletes, and if they are that clear, we should make it easier to delete them by making use of the systems already in place, instead of creating new ones if at all possible. Also note that expanding CSD does not eliminate AfD - something Speedied in error can always be undeleted and put on AfD instead. I'm just against the extra layer of procedures, because I think we can accomplish these objectives without them.--inks^T 04:49, 11 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]
  - I actually considered 'scrutinised speedies' for a while, but I rejected it for three reasons. a) It is actually quite bureaucratic to implement when you think about it. b) It still gives too little scrutiny for possibly valid articles - three admins agree and it is gone - no chance for others to point out some value (they can go to AfU, but only if they know the article exists in the first place. c) Paradoxically, it is too much effort for bad articles (created in a click - but needing the form to be signed in triplicate to get rid of them). The proposal here has the merit of 'one tag and it's gone in a set number of days', yet still visible and several days for any user to halt the process - and by putting the article in a deletion category for those days drawing attention to it. --Doc (?) 08:11, 11 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]
    - Hmm. I note the concern regarding deleted articles that shouldn't have been. But how extensive is the problem? Are there any studies showing proportion of speedy deletes subsequently restored? (excepting "Oops, I hit the wrong button" type mistakes). Similar to MGM's comment below, I'm also concerned that the proposal as it stands makes it too easy to push it to AfD, and then we're back where we started. Alternatively, just have people note on the articles talk page if they disagree with the speedy, and the admin can check there before deletion.--inks ^T 21:15, 11 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Changes

How long should the time be?

I think the time time should be just as long as the regular AFD lag. You don't want material lying around for longer than absolutely neccesary when it's going to end up being deleted without being contested. Also, I think it may be effective at first, but when creators and vandals catch on they'll find a way to flood AFD with the nominations again. - 131.211.50.137 10:06, 11 October 2005 (UTC) (MacGyverMagic who's too lazy to sign in)[reply]