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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Justmeherenow (talk | contribs) at 18:00, 12 October 2009 (→Notice: Is anybody interested in helping to exand: new section). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Article milestones
DateProcessResult
October 4, 2009Articles for deletionNo consensus

I restored the link to the Fark thread in "External links," as the primary source credited by the creator of the website for his idea for his parody of Beck (per WP:PRIMARY). ↜Just M E here , now 08:07, 4 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Do you have a source for that? Techdirt says the same thing but citing blogs for when a parody was started is just ignoring WP:RS on a multitude of levels. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 08:13, 4 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
"Google" found this: "The origin of the website is an Internet meme that came into being on Fark.com."---Harvard Law School's Citizen Media Law Project (link: which source is not self-published, as far as I can tell, but a professional new media site?) ↜Just M E here , now 08:33, 4 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Does it help that I myself say this? I put two links on the site on the left - the two "Origin" links. One goes to the very first person ("oldweevil") that posted it. Link: http://www.fark.com/cgi/comments.pl?IDLink=4608536&IDComment=54042337#c54042337 -- I saw that thread the next day, registered the domain, and the rest is history. I'm just not sure what works for sources with Wikipedia. Also, although I've found this talk page and article, I will restrict myself to commenting here on the talk page - I will refrain from editing the actual article itself. I can't believe it won't be deleted, but I think it's really cool to see it. It popped up on a google news search... If there's anything I can do to help out, please feel free to send an email to the email address I have posted on the site (shortest link: http://gb1990.com/ ). Any way I can help, I will (and I figure one of the ways to help is to NOT edit the article. heh.) Isaac.Eiland-Hall (talk) 10:14, 8 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Title

If kept, I think the title could be redone as suggested at the Glenn Beck talk page. I do not feel "Beck v. Eiland-Hall" would be appropriate just because the case is pending from what I understand. That would be approporiate if the case does go forward, though. "Rape satire of Glenn Beck" or something similar might be a little cleaner.Cptnono (talk) 02:13, 5 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

How about Glenn Beck rumor parody website. Clean, easy to remember, obvious what it means. LK (talk) 07:39, 5 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Should we call it a rumor? Per are article a rumor is often viewed as an unverified account or explanation of events circulating from person to person and pertaining to an object, event, or issue in public concern. It was never started as a rumor, it has always been a satire meme. Also, it's not a law suit as far as I understand, it's just a compliant to the domain name board. Morphh (talk) 12:24, 05 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Well, it is a parody of a rumor website, i.e. a parody of the websites created by groups such as the birthers. How about we call it Glenn Beck parody rumor website or Glenn Beck rumor website parody. Which makes it more clear that it is a parody of a rumor website about Glenn Beck? LK (talk) 04:46, 6 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
LK, of course Wikipedia needs to avoid implying the parody to have been 'by Beck, as well -- but, once you figure out the formulation you like best, keeping in mind the ambiguity issue I've just raised, I think it would be OK for you to move the article there, until or unless opinion coalesces around moving to the name of a future legal case(?)↜ (‘Just M E ’here , now) 11:05, 6 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Per WP:Naming conventions, I've boldly moved the article to "Glenn Beck – Isaac Eiland-Hall controversy," which I believe to be less imprecise and ambiguous than the previous title of "Rumor website parody of Glenn Beck." (There are many websites parodizing Beck while mentioning rumors.)↜ (‘Just M E ’here , now) 23:32, 7 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Sources

It is good to see someone went through the effort to format the sources. It does come across a little knee-jerk in response to the AfD as is. We still need to consider quality so consider removing it if anything looks overly bloggish and lets move them into inline cites instead of that list.Cptnono (talk) 11:03, 6 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It looks like Bostonist is part of Gothamist which isn't a no no on the RS noticeboard but it looks to be user contributed. Isn't needed for now but the refs are here in case they need to be checked or reincluded:

Cptnono (talk) 12:59, 6 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Google bomb

Please insert it if anyone finds a source for this. Also,info on Youtube and additional methods of propagation could be of use.Cptnono (talk) 12:51, 6 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Does this work for a source? http://www.google-bombs.com/?p=367 Glenn Beck Being Google Bombed! --70.181.237.167 (talk) 09:42, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Not really, no. Cirt (talk) 10:47, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I would be happy to contribute the music video I made- Glenn Beck (No Alibi) under a CC license to the Commons if appropriate --Gwsuperfan (talk) 10:01, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

@Gwsuperfan - though the song itself at Glenn Beck (No Alibi) may be your own original content, the video and images used are not. Thus the video portion of the music video could not be licensed by you under a free use license. Cirt (talk) 10:46, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
@Cirt - I can get the audio only. Gwsuperfan (talk) 11:18, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
That doesn't meet the policies and guidelines in a few ways (I'll go with "Any site that does not provide a unique resource beyond what the article would contain if it became a Featured article." per WP:ELNO) Funny stuff, though.Cptnono (talk) 11:36, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Layout

I have said at the AfD that people might be chicken littling and assuming this is an attack page. The meme./attack/whatever is shit. Now that that is out of the way: this has the information to expand past a stub. We have to watch out for WP:RECENTISM but we should get a layout. The lead can be the shortest part so what are the important aspects to use as subject headers? Lead->Meme(essentially "history" + "description"->Legal->See also(list of internet phenomena + others if not in the prose)->Refs->External links (should just be site for now)). Any thoughts?Cptnono (talk) 11:54, 6 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I started it, with some subsections. :) Cirt (talk) 16:55, 6 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Additional possible sources of info

  • Schmelzer, Paul (October 7, 2009). "Glenn Beck appeals to international body to shut down satirical site". Minnesota Independent. Retrieved 2009-10-08.
  • Brayton, Ed (October 6, 2009). "Brilliant Response to Beck Case". ScienceBlogs. Seed Media Group. Retrieved 2009-10-06.
  • "Beck DESTROYED after efforts to get rid of site parodying him". Daily Kos. Kos Media, LLC. October 6, 2009. Retrieved 2009-10-06.
  • Brayton, Ed (October 5, 2009). "Beck Tries to Kill Parody Website". ScienceBlogs. Seed Media Group. Retrieved 2009-10-06.
  • Schmidt, Steffen (October 5, 2009). "Media Meme's and Glenn Beck – Truth or Lies?". Des Moines Register. The Des Moines Register. Retrieved 2009-10-06.
  • Sawyer, Rick (October 1, 2009). "Today in Randazza's Zings: Glenn Beck, Why Do You Hate America?". Bostonist. Gothamist. Retrieved 2009-10-06.
  • Sawyer, Rick (September 30, 2009). "Gloucester Lawyer Defends Satirical Glenn Beck Website". Bostonist. Gothamist. Retrieved 2009-10-06.

Cirt (talk)

As I and others find sources, they are put here: http://didglennbeckrapeandmurderayounggirlin1990.com/discussion/index.php?topic=50.0 -- don't know if that helps, but I hope it does. Isaac.Eiland-Hall (talk) 10:11, 8 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Can we not just name the website once?

This article would be a lot cleaerr and useful if we just named website. I don't think we need to name it more than once, and it doesn't need to be in the title of the article. And I fail to see how it's BLP violation if it's put in the appropriate context. If you came to this article and were unfamilar with the meme, you'd have no idea what this article was talking about. If knew the Gottfried/Sagat joke, then you might be able to figure it out, but I'm not so sure. I think with careful writing and appropriate context we can use the website name--once--and make this article a whole lot clearer while still conforming with BLP requirements. Yilloslime TC 23:45, 7 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

If it helps, there are three domains that go to the site: GlennBeckRapedAndMurderedAYoungGirlIn1990.com, DidGlennBeckRapeAndMurderAYoungGirlIn1990.com, and gb1990.com. Perhaps the latter would be useful? Isaac.Eiland-Hall (talk) 10:09, 8 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Lawyer interviewed

The lawyer for Eiland-Hall, Marc Randazza, was interviewed by Ed Brayton on the program Declaring Independence, on WPRR, See some additional info at [1], [2], [3] and [4]. Cirt (talk) 05:29, 10 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Nice find. Do you know off the top of your head if there is a transcript floating around?Cptnono (talk) 05:44, 10 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I do not know. In the interview, Randazza discusses the Supreme Court of the United States case, Hustler Magazine v. Falwell. Cirt (talk) 05:46, 10 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
A friend of mine has transcribed it. Would that be helpful? I need to clean it up a little, which was planning on doing today... then uploading it, perhaps to gb1990.net where I have the legal docs posted - but maybe in gb1990.net/interviews or something... I'll edit this when I get it uploaded... Isaac.Eiland-Hall (talk) 15:28, 11 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
That would be a fantastic primary source! Thank you, Isaac.↜ (‘Just M E ’here , now) 16:12, 11 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Got it here: http://gb1990.net/radio/20091008-MarcRandazzaInterview.txt - Full disclosure: It was a friend of mine who transcribed it, although the interview itself is in that same directory on the server, so anyone can listen for themselves :) And I'm glad to be able to help. This is really awesome to see this article here. :) Isaac.Eiland-Hall (talk) 23:23, 11 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I ask because I want to use the cite episode template. A link is not required but it would make verification easier for people. Unfortunately, we can not link to copyright violations which I think is the case for the video/audio presented above.Cptnono (talk) 23:37, 11 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Not an appropriate usage, IMO, as the copyright is likely that of WPRR. Cirt (talk) 04:18, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, Cirt, probably not.
Hey, Isaac, do you think that WPRR's Ed Brayton has got the wherewithall to grant it a Creative Commons 2.0 license so I could post it on Wikisource?↜ (‘Just M E ’here , now) 04:29, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I'm on it. Cirt (talk) 04:36, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
See Audio, and Text. :) Cirt (talk) 15:11, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Some info here [5]. Cirt (talk) 06:36, 10 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  1. Brayton, Ed (October 8, 2009). "Interview with Marc Randazza". Declaring Independence. Grand Rapids, Michigan: WPRR.
  2. "Glenn Beck Seeks to Take Down Parody Website Using 'Unpatriotic' International Law". ChattahBox. chattahbox.com. October 8, 2009. Retrieved 2009-10-09.
  3. Brayton, Ed (October 8, 2009). "Radio Show Preview 10-8-09". ScienceBlogs. Seed Media Group. Retrieved 2009-10-09.
  4. Schmelzer, Paul (October 7, 2009). "Glenn Beck appeals to international body to shut down satirical site". Minnesota Independent. Retrieved 2009-10-08.
  5. Brayton, Ed (October 6, 2009). "Brilliant Response to Beck Case". ScienceBlogs. Seed Media Group. Retrieved 2009-10-06.
  6. "Beck DESTROYED after efforts to get rid of site parodying him". Daily Kos. Kos Media, LLC. October 6, 2009. Retrieved 2009-10-06.
  7. Brayton, Ed (October 5, 2009). "Beck Tries to Kill Parody Website". ScienceBlogs. Seed Media Group. Retrieved 2009-10-06.
  8. Schmidt, Steffen (October 5, 2009). "Media Meme's and Glenn Beck – Truth or Lies?". Des Moines Register. The Des Moines Register. Retrieved 2009-10-06.
  9. Sawyer, Rick (October 1, 2009). "Today in Randazza's Zings: Glenn Beck, Why Do You Hate America?". Bostonist. Gothamist. Retrieved 2009-10-06.
  10. Sawyer, Rick (September 30, 2009). "Gloucester Lawyer Defends Satirical Glenn Beck Website". Bostonist. Gothamist. Retrieved 2009-10-06.
  11. "Traffic details from Alexa". Alexa Internet. Alexa Internet, Inc. 2009. Retrieved 2009-10-06.
  12. Hesslam, Jessica (2009-10-02). "Bay State lawyer takes on FOX yakker". Boston Herald. Retrieved 2009-10-03.
  13. Davis, Wendy (2009-09-30). "Glenn Beck Urges Parody Site Be Shut Down". MediaPost. Retrieved 2009-10-04.
  14. Anderson, Nate (2009-09-09). "Can a mere domain name be defamation? Glenn Beck says yes". Ars Technica. Retrieved 2009-10-04.
  15. Quigley, Robert (2009-09-03). "Anti-Beck Backlash Hits Nauseating Extreme with "Murder and Rape" Meme (UPDATED THRICE)". Mediaite. Retrieved 2009-10-04.
  16. Citizen Media Law Project staff (2009). "Beck v. Eiland-Hall". Citizen Media Law Project. Retrieved 2009-10-29.
  17. Cook, John (2009-09-09). "Glenn Beck, PR Genius, Spreads the False Rumor He Raped and Murdered a Young Girl in 1990". Gawker. Retrieved 2009-10-04.
  18. Citizen Media Law Project staff (2009-09-11). "Will Glenn Beck Sue a Defamatory Website in 2009?". Citizen Media Law Project. Retrieved 2009-10-04.
  19. Gardner, Eriq (2009-09-29). "Glenn Beck Satire Site Fights Back". Adweek. Retrieved 2009-10-04. {{cite news}}: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |1= (help)
  20. Carvin, Andy (2009-10-02). "Glenn Beck Internet Meme Gets Ugly". National Public Radio. Retrieved 2009-10-04.
  21. Allemann, Andrew (2009-10-01). "Hot off Press: Domain Owner Responds to Glenn Beck". Domain Name Wire. Retrieved 2009-10-04.
  22. Bremer, Jack (2009-09-11). "Fox's Glenn Beck fights 'rape and murder' website". The First Post. Retrieved 2009-10-04.
  23. Anderson, Nate (2009-09-30). "Memes strike back: Gerbils, gay blood elves, and Glenn Beck". Ars Technica. Retrieved 2009-10-04.
  24. Weiss, Jeffrey (2009-09-17). "The 'Glenn Beck as Murderer' Meme: Vaccine or Infection?". Politics Daily. Retrieved 2009-10-04. {{cite news}}: More than one of |author= and |last= specified (help)
  25. Masnick, Michael (2009-09-08). "Glenn Beck Didn't Rape And Murder Anyone... But He Doesn't Want Websites Discussing It". Techdirt. Retrieved 2009-10-04.
  26. "Glenn Beck Introduced to the Streisand Effect". FoxNewsBoycott.com. 2009-09-10. Retrieved 2009-10-04.
  27. Emerson, Jim (2009-10-02). Chicago Sun-Times http://blogs.suntimes.com/scanners/2009/10/all_your_beck_are_belong_to_us.html. Retrieved 2009-10-11. {{cite news}}: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |1= (help); Missing or empty |title= (help)
  28. Manes, Billy (2009-10-07). "Happytown". Orlando Weekly. Retrieved 2009-10-12. {{cite news}}: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |1= (help)

Cirt (talk)

Free speech

Randazza made this request due to Beck's political commentary favoring the United States Constitution over international law.[12][13] It should be made clear that they were trying to make a point. They are essentially going "haha in your face haha in your face". I am trying to find a source summarizing that a little more professionally, though.Cptnono (talk) 00:02, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Per WP:V, best to go by what the sources say, instead of what we believe to be true. Cirt (talk) 03:41, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I agree. I am saying we shoulod double check to see if there is a source. I did not find one from a quick check and don't want to cherry pick if only one lame one is found. However, I think it is noteworthy if a good source does discuss it. I also think it is funny but that is my personal thoughts on it.Cptnono (talk) 03:50, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I'd agree with that. :P Cirt (talk) 03:58, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
A couple of blogs point out the irony but I hate using blogs. Jim Emerson looks decnt but it is still a blog.Cptnono (talk) 04:22, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Well, that guy appears to be a legitimate journalist for the Chicago Sun-Times... Cirt (talk) 04:23, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I would like to add "irony/the irony was commented on..." somewhere in the line but am having a hard time piecing in where.Cptnono (talk) 04:32, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Best to have that sort of stuff in the Commentary section. And keep the other sections of the article just to a bland, factual history in chronological order. Cirt (talk) 04:35, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Disclaimers

Eiland-Hall placed two disclaimers at the top of the site which prominently describe it as a form of parody.[1] Another source (it should be in the refs and I will start looking if needed) said that it was a disclaimer at the bottom. Through OR (blast!) I know that for some time it was only a single disclaimer at the bottom. It also looks like we are starting to play for the defence. Most of the sources are poking fun at Beck for this and we need to make sure we do not unintentionally adopt that tone.Cptnono (talk) 00:05, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Well, as far as what the sources say, that is what we have to go by. Per WP:V. The threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth. Cirt (talk) 03:41, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Agian, it was just a heads up in case anyone came across some other sources.Cptnono (talk) 04:03, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Fixed.Cptnono (talk) 04:10, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Looks good. :) Cirt (talk) 05:21, 12 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Notice: Is anybody interested in helping to exand

or cleanup the article "Marc Randazza"?

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