Talk:John F. Kennedy/Archive 5

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wrong link

sorry I would have edited myself, but I don't have an user.

Please edit the link in the 2nd cite note.

http://www.pulitzer.org/faq —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.250.44.113 (talk) 02:04, 11 October 2008 (UTC)

I've fixed the link. Thank you. Gamaliel (talk) 23:09, 15 October 2008 (UTC)

Sense?

In the "Memorials" section (ref. 62), one of the bullets reads, "The first school in the United States named after had been the Kennedy Middle School, in Cupertino, California, while he was alive." You, as well as me, can guess that this doesn't make sense. I suggest changing it to read: "The first school in the United States named after him, while he was alive, was Kennedy Middle School, in Cupertino, California." Or something along those lines. I changed "had been" to "was" because I felt that "had been" suggests that the schools name has since been changed, in which case, to my knowledge, it has not.

Also, in the third paragraph from the beginning of the page, please change "Lee Harvey Oswald was charged with the crime and was murdered two days later by Jack Ruby before he could be put on trial." to "Lee Harvey Oswald was charged with the crime but was murdered two days later by Jack Ruby before he could be put on trial." Thanks. // Jugis (talk) 08:02, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

Never mind, I have the correct permissions now. // Jugis (talk) 11:20, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

Family Life

It seems very strange that there is no section on his family, given how important Kennedy's family was, and the iconic status of his wife, Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis. I'm going to address this. Gacggt (talk) 15:20, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

Inauguration Speech

Need an opinion on adding YouTube links? Found quite a few there...like: Kennedy's Inauguration Address on YouTube. Opinions? -- Mjquin_id (talk) 04:44, 24 January 2009 (UTC)

I'm assuming C-SPAN owns the copyright on it, in which case, no, we can't link it. faithless (^speak) 04:58, 24 January 2009 (UTC)

If CSPAN themselves uploaded it, and we are going to the CSPAN source, why can't we link to it? I don't see that as a copyvio any more than linking to an NYT article (which of course is copyrighted by the NYT). --OuroborosCobra (talk) 05:14, 24 January 2009 (UTC)

Now that I give it a little bit of thought, you may just be right. Links directly to YouTube are generally frowned upon, but sine C-SPAN uploaded it, it may be permissible. faithless (^speak) 05:21, 24 January 2009 (UTC)

Category for Kennedy Administration

There is now a category for his administration as this seemed to be a big gap in the series for 20th century presidents: Category:Kennedy Administration (and it was missing for the "Years in Vietnam" Category).

But it could use some Category:Kennedy Administration personnel names apart from LBJ! Hugo999 (talk) 00:09, 3 February 2009 (UTC)

Page locked.

Stop being silly over this and talk it out here. No comment on the section. Kwsn (Ni!) 20:51, 3 February 2009 (UTC)

Glancing at page history, looks like it's a matter of Big P from one side and Binksternet and Plazak from another. I'm about to restore JFK's tribute to Presidential Medal of Freedom in Domestic politics subsection, as it's widely covered. Brandспойт 23:08, 4 February 2009 (UTC)

I have concerns about these portions of the article:

• Regarding Jack Ruby, the phrase "Yet, in an ironic and somewhat suspicious turn of events" should be deleted.
• Regarding Executive Order No. 11110, the paragraph "If enough of those silver certificates were to come into circulation they would have eliminated the demand for Federal Reserve notes. That situation would have been catastrophic for the Federal Reserve, while at the same time prove to be a blessing for the actual country" is supported only by a blog-style message board entry. These sentences need either a more expert, published and mainstream analysis as reference or they should be deleted.
• Similarly, the paragraph "Executive Order 11110 could have prevented the national debt from reaching its current level, as it would have eliminated the U.S. government's need to pay interest on the loans it took out with regards to the national currency. Mysteriously enough, the silver certificates halted in circulation shortly after Kennedy's death." is not supported at all. Buh-bye.
• Following that, the paragraph "Even more striking, is that Executive Order No. 11110 was never repealed by any U.S. President through an Executive Order and is still valid, yet no one has used it to help reduce deficit." is referenced only by a list of JFK's orders by date. This reference supports only that the order was given and that it was never revoked. I think the phrases "even more striking" and "yet no one has used it to help reduce deficit" should be deleted.
• Regarding JFK's changes to the Presidential Medal of Freedom, I have two minor problems with the entry: The placement in the article should NOT be under the heading Civil liberties and the supporting reference should be of higher quality than the blog-style essortment.com essay. Binksternet (talk) 00:07, 5 February 2009 (UTC)

I'll place it directly in the Domestic politics and there are other sources, such as JFK Library. Brandспойт 08:36, 5 February 2009 (UTC)

Lem Billings

In the section regarding Choate, I think it would be useful to mention Lem Billings and he met there, quickly becoming very close and life-long friends. The page on Lem_Billings as well as mentioned in Dallek's An Unfinished Life (http://www.amazon.com/Unfinished-Life-John-Kennedy-1917-1963/dp/0316172383) Billings was a confidant of JFKs all his life.

From the Billing's wikipedia page is this: Jackie Kennedy, who liked Billings for the most part, commented to a White House usher, "He (Lem) has been a house guest every weekend of my married life." However, the relationship between the two men was friendship. "It’s the story of a really close friendship — and one of the guys just happened to be what we think of today as gay," Pitts said.

I don't necessarily know that the mention of Jackie thinking Lem was gay is necessary or germane to the conversation, but he is worth mentioning as I looked for him in JFK's page while listening to Dallek's book.

Vargob (talk) 23:19, 5 February 2009 (UTC)

Misspelling

hightened (sic) is misspelt.

Fixed! Thanks. Binksternet (talk) 16:09, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

Clarification

A recent edit misinterpreted the statement, John F. Kennedy became the first President to fly in his own jet aircraft [1] (emphasis added) Previously, propeller aircraft were used to fly the presidents. Jehochman ^Talk 08:42, 21 March 2009 (UTC)

not very encyclopedic. This particular plane came on duty in Kennedy's term so he was the first president to fly in it? Big deal. If that's what Wiki says he's famous for, it diminishes his stature. Rjensen (talk) 08:56, 21 March 2009 (UTC)

That too! I was pointing out why a statement that had been added, and then removed, was incorrect.Jehochman ^Talk 09:52, 21 March 2009 (UTC)

Executive Order 11110

I think this order and its possible ties with his assassination should be added. Here is some more information: http://www.john-f-kennedy.net/thefederalreserve.htm Mustanggt5000 (talk) 20:59, 28 March 2009 (UTC)Mustanggt5000

The order itself is already here in this article. The conjecture about its possible ties to his assassination is not. This is a high profile article! References need to be higher quality than the one you point to—they'll publish anything they like without checking facts. If you find something better to support a quote about conjecture, you would probably want to go over to John F. Kennedy assassination and add it. There's nothing at all about the order over there. Binksternet (talk) 02:10, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

Bay of Pigs

The failure of the Bay of Pig was not, as the JFK article states, because of "The failure of the plan originated in a lack of dialog among the military leadership." The invasions success hinged on three air strikes to take out Castro's meager air force. After news of the first air strike became public, Kennedy panicked because he was afraid the world would find out about U.S. involvement. So, to save his own skin,Kennedy canceled the final two air strikes. This left the CIA advisers and the U.S. trained Cuban insurgents at the mercy of Castro's old planes. The invading forces on the beach had no anti-aircraft guns because they were not expected to be battling air power. Hence, when Kennedy was shot, it was rumored that the CIA might have some involvement. But then again, it was also rumored that the Mafia, Cuban refugees, Castro, Russia, husbands of all the wives with whom Kennedy slept, and all the other people he knifed in the back were involved in his death. Mjpriz1 (talk) 16:20, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

Secret Society Speech

Why they are no mention to this very important speech? http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/John_F._Kennedy#Address_before_the_Press_.281961.29 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qs5ldP6pRC4 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Echofloripa (talk • contribs) 17:44, 15 May 2009 (UTC)

Addison's disease

It's been argued that JFK's healthy tan could very well be due in part to his Addison's disease. Addison's results in hyperpigmentation and can leave darker skin even if well controlled due to persitent high levels of ACTH hormone. Given that Kennedy's healthy appearance was a big factor in his televisual appeal, maybe this could be an interesting point for a Kennedy-enthusiast to look into (I don't have any articles to hand myself) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.108.156.90 (talk) 08:21, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

Kennedy wasn't shot three times

{{editsemiprotected}}

The John F. Kennedy page, under the assassination section says, "He was shot once in the back, once in the neck and was killed with a final shot to the head." This makes it sound like Kennedy was shot three times. As far as I know, no non-conspiracy version of the assassination says Kennedy was hit by more than two shots. One shot, the first to hit him, struck him in the upper back and exited about where the knot of his tie rested against his throat. He was not "shot in the neck." This all may be a bad choice of words, or it may be intended to support a conspiracy version of events. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Arizona008 (talk • contribs) 23:42, 3 July 2009

 Done Welcome and thanks for wanting to improve the accuracy of this article. Normally, using the {{editsemiprotected}} template requires a "please change X to Y" level of detail and factual changes require a reliable source to support the facts. Since the main article for that section supports your change and has reliable sources, I'll just remove the inaccuracy. If you would like different wording, please suggest one here. Thanks again. Celestra (talk) 17:17, 4 July 2009 (UTC)

Rewriting History

Some bits missed of history missed out and some bit written twice, thats what I call rewriting history!

Why not mention his affairs? I don't know if it's true or not but the one thing everyone will tell you is that he was having an affair with Marilyn Monroe, why is it not in the article? If its not true it at least need acknowledging that it has been alleged.

Why does the article inform me twice in two adjacent paragraphs that his first child was still born?

And this little gem is wrong in so many ways: "One of the fundamental aspects of the Kennedy family is a tragic strain which has run through the family, as a result of the deaths of many of its members" I have no Grandparents does this mean my family suffers from a tragic strain? How do you define a tragic strain? And once defined are we sure that it caused the deaths of many of the family members? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.243.194.27 (talk) 22:09, 6 July 2009 (UTC)

Military service rank

On this article it shows in Kennedy's military service in the info box it says that Kennedy's rank was Lieutenant by shows the insignia for Captain. Is there a reason for this? I'm still pretty sure it's an error. Cheers!--Martin (talk) 03:24, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

In the Navy, that is the rank insignia of a Lieutenant. It is the insignia of a Captain in the Army, Air Force, and Marines. A naval Captain has the full bird insignia. --OuroborosCobra (talk) 06:32, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

search term?

shut up your stupid

 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.101.164.169 (talk) 02:37, 6 August 2009 (UTC) 

You do. That search term leads you to a disambiguation page, where this article is linked to in the opening paragraph. --OuroborosCobra (talk) 02:39, 6 August 2009 (UTC)

Vietnam

The current wiki entry on Kennedy in Vietnam contains questionable material on Kennedy's inclination to withdraw in 1963. The text cites National Security document 263, which indicates a discussion about the possibility of removing some U.S. advisors. As a number of scholars have argued, this doesn't provide any compelling proof that Kennedy wanted to limit U.S. troop presence, and in fact the document reasserts JFK's determination to support the Diem government.

As disturbing, the present text uses Fog of War, Errol Morris's terrific film, as proof that Kennedy planned to withdraw. At the least, more evidence is needed beyond Robert McNamara's memories. Better still, however, this section should be removed or rewritten to indicate the nature of discussion. I am also disturbed by the implication that Lyndon Johnson assumed a more aggressive posture in 1963/early 1964 in Vietnam.

This information came to my attention when one of my students used it in a paper. I think we can edit this piece to suggest the more nuanced approach most historians present. Any ideas about this? Anyone agree or disagree? ````mmay89 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mmay89 (talk • contribs) 19:02, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

• The fact is LBJ did "assume a more aggressive posture." First with his own NSAM #273 on November 26, 1963 reversing the minor withdraw considered by JFK. (ofcourse one is only talking about approx. 1,000 so don't "boot-strap" a full withdraw guys from that). Second, after the "Gulf of Tonkin Incident" in Aug. 1964 (that was based on a false pretext, as Johnson later admitted), he got passed the "Southeast Asia Resolution" (and away we went on the road to direct combat action). The text is cited; certainly one can always add to it but be objective.Kierzek (talk) 02:25, 13 July 2009 (UTC)

Cabinet/Administration

Please add Robert F. Kennedy as Attorney General 1961-1963 as Attorney General is a Cabinet position. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kkoling (talk • contribs) 13:00, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

• Done...Kierzek (talk) 00:52, 17 August 2009 (UTC)

This link should be removed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bill Ladd (talk • contribs) 16:55, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

A comment needs to be deleted

Some moron wrote the following under the template on the top right of the article:

"Died November 22, 1963 (aged 46) He got his ass shot his head fell over hahahaha lolsz"

I've tried to delete it but I can't access the template through the article's "edit this page." Can anyone who knows how please delete it? 71.84.35.97 (talk) 03:52, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

The comment was thankfully reverted by Tide rolls.--JayJasper (talk) 20:57, 1 September 2009 (UTC)