User talk:Dolfrog/Archives/2010 1

Dyslexia research

"As you probably have no understanding of the issues which cause me to be dyslexic, then I consider your actions to be vandalism, if you want to help edit the article please do so but do not just delete bits because it does suit your person way of understanding issues"

Maybe you should start your own page if it is your desire to talk about yourself. The page I was editing is about research in dyslexia, and it is not written very well. There is more work to be done in terms of content and how the content is presented, so maybe you should focus on explaining the issues more clearly if it is your desire to actually allow a reader to understand the information presented, rather than attacking someone who is trying to accomplish that goal. Ninahexan (talk) 04:01, 24 November 2009 (UTC)

Please don't start your own page, Dolfrog. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, which means it is about notable subjects based mostly on secondary and tertiary research. If you, yourself, and your dyslexia are notable, and they are written up, then a new article can be started. It is generally recommended that you do not edit an article about yourself, even if you are notable, as this represents a conflict of interest.

No editor is required to understand the issues which personally make you dyslexic, Dolfrog, in order to edit wikipedia. There are probably on-line support groups where you can discuss that issue. Wikipedia rightly encourages editors to stay away from the personal, this includes the issues "which cause you to be dyslexic." They have nothing to do with editing wikipedia articles. Thank you. --IP69.226.103.13 (talk) 04:17, 24 November 2009 (UTC)

I have no intentions of starting my own page.

I am dyslexic and as I have discussed over the lat few months or so on various Wikipedia discussion pages , due to the underlying cause of my dyslexia I am able to research dyslexia and understand the meaning of the research, but i am unable to paraphrase the research papers or copy edit the specific wiki articles. To this end last summer I summerised the main dyslexia article found the research papers to support the existing content, and correct the existing content to correspond to the content of the research papers. I then created a series of sub articles which was the intention of the editors Wikipedia dyslexia project. The articles which Ninahexan is currently editing do need editing, as i have mentioned I am not able to paraphrase and copy edit, so i rely on others like Ninahexanto perform those tasks. But I do understand the actual content, which requires copy editing and adding to Not deleting. So other editors do need to understand the limitations my disability impose on me with regard to editing a wiki article. ~From my experience of many Wikipedia editors they see themselves above the all others who have communication disabilities and actively promote disability discrimination against other editors who do not have the same abilities as themselves. So I have stopped being an active editor on Wikipedia to avoid this type of disability discrimination which causes me too much stress.

On my user page there are links to a wide range of Research paper collections including some 23 regarding different aspects of dyslexia. the causes of my dyslexia should not be the subject of any Wikipedia article, but it should be part of the consideration and understanding of other Wikipedia editors. I am prepared to discuss any technical issue about dyslexia on a discussion papge, but i will no longer add content to existing articles. Waht i object to is other editors deleting content without prior discussion about editing or changing the wording a skill which i have mentioned before i do not have. I am a team player where others in the team carry out the tasks I am unable to do. Wikipedia does not appear to be a team player working environment, more driven by editors personal ego. dolfrog (talk) 00:44, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

Your response shows you understand exactly what I am saying. --IP69.226.103.13 (talk) 02:37, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

So you saying, Wikipedia does not want dyslexics as editors of their articles, please correct me if I am wrong. dolfrog (talk) 02:45, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

People with dyslexia do not own "their" articles. Dyslexia belongs to everyone regardless of disability.

Competence is required for all editors, regardless of disability status. Anyone who is able to work productively is welcome. Anyone who is unable to work productively in Wikipedia's environment should stop editing. WhatamIdoing (talk) 03:31, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

WhatamIdoing I do not want to own any article, especially any article on Wikipedia, I only use Wikipedia now for the research paper references some of the more informative articles provide. The problem with so many Wikipedia editors that they have very little competence in understanding the content of the articles the are trying to edit, and more interested in their own small town interests. I have more important things to do than engage in such futile exchanges. I am only interested in scientific based information and theories and not the subjective nonsense which pre-occupies so may on Wikipedia. Your attitude and the attitude of so may others on Wikipedia would appear to discriminate against those who have a disability, under the misapprehension that you are vastly superior. dolfrog (talk) 15:12, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

Dyslexia research

Wikipedia is about presenting information in a coherent, efficient and for the most part accurate way. If your writing lacked clarity at any point it should be changed, and citing "disability discrimination" is meaningless in such a context. When stating that someone has referenced particular information you should state why they were referencing it. Your sentence lacked this information, so how could I put in that information? If you are suggesting that you are not capable of writing these things more clearly then don't be surprised when they get changed or deleted. As I said, I will update the page to reflect the various usages of the word dyslexia and the various reams in which the term is used, and this will mean that I delete the reference to Elliot referencing the various usages. I can't imagine that would be a problem, since what you have written at the moment only states that there are a number of different definitions, not that Elliot's reference to that fact carried any new information.06:25, 11 December 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ninahexan (talk • contribs)

I do not have the time nor the inclination to carry this any further, you obviously have no intention of trying to understand the UK debate regarding dyslexia, which created this controversy. personally I am not really bothered about the nature of the debate, but others have requested its inclusion to demonstrate the scientific differences regarding dyslexia. prof Elliot was asked to comment on a more recent media discussion regarding the existence of dyslexia and he referred to the 26 definitions of dyslexia listed in the dyslexia review to add weight to his own research.

the reason I stopped being an active Wikipedia editor was precisely due to this type of discussion. I have a communication disability, which others prefer to ignore with regard to my contributions. Arbitory deletion appears to be the working practice of most Wikipedia editors, which from my perspective is pure disability discrimination. MY only interest is to ensure all content regarding dyslexia is supported by scientific documentation, and that the articles reflect scientific research, and not the opinions of program providers, popular teaching methods, or the myths that have grown up around dyslexia. The clarification becomes less important to me as the quality of research regarding Auditory Processing Disorder as a cognitive cause of dyslexia continues to improve at a quicken rate in recent months. So do what every you want with regard to this issue. dolfrog (talk) 22:25, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Categories for discussion nomination of Category:Reading instruction by country

Category:Reading instruction by country, which you created, has been nominated for deletion, merging, or renaming. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the Categories for discussion page. Thank you. --Orlady (talk) 22:26, 15 February 2010 (UTC)

Auditory memory

Please complete the WP:RFD submission process, as detailed on the RFD link. You have done step 1 of the process, tagging the redirect, but the nomination is not complete until you list the redirect on the RFD discussion page and thus start an actual discussion on the fate of the redirect. - TexasAndroid (talk) 15:06, 29 April 2010 (UTC)

External links

As per the manual of style, external links should not be linked to directly within the text of an article, suitable links should be in the external links section. --Cameron Scott (talk) 17:01, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

Also you misunderstand what external links are for - they are for providing resources that help an individual to further understand the topic, so in regards to Dyslexia support in the United Kingdom, it should be (for example) scholarly resources or similar that discusses dyslexia support in general, it's not to promote helpgroups - in the same way that an article on car mechanics would use external links to articles on the principles of car mechanics not to individual garages. --Cameron Scott (talk) 17:08, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

you have delated all the information regarding the Disability Equality Duty, I added the links in the hope that an editor like yourself who has the skills could explain the techinical infornation and use the links as references now there is nothing dolfrog (talk) 17:22, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

It's still there in the history. Can you write something about the Disability Equality Duty and I'll format the references for it? If not I'll have a go at writing something. --Cameron Scott (talk) 17:29, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

I have problems doing that part of editing, and it becomes too stressful, I did try for 3 months this time last year, and waht you found in this article is where i got to before it all became too stressful, and i had to stop for my own health reasons. If you would be so good as to create some description I would be very grateful. as you may have seen from my userpage research and understanding issues id my thing, but my own form of dyslexic means i have problems expressing these issues in text. Sorry about any anger, but it is more frustration regarding my APD which causes my dyslexia. dolfrog (talk) 17:37, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

I'm off out for a meal but will take a stab in the morning, I'll also review all of the links I've removed and see if we can add them to the articles as references - that way they will safe from removal. --Cameron Scott (talk) 17:38, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

I got caught up in other things but will take a look today - you do realise that makes sure that articles confirm to the Manual of style *is* part of the process of being an encyclopaedia? If you are going to throw your toys out of the pram, do it somewhere else but my talkpage. --Cameron Scott (talk) 06:17, 4 May 2010 (UTC)

May 2010

Welcome to Wikipedia. Although everyone is welcome to contribute constructively to the encyclopedia, we must insist that you assume good faith while interacting with other editors, which you did not on User talk:Cameron Scott. Take a look at the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia. Thank you. Please also note that the editor can remove/blank talk page comments. Bidgee (talk) 13:21, 12 May 2010 (UTC)

Some editors stretch the concept of "In Good Faith" to conceal their own lack of good faith, which is in itself a form of abuse. dolfrog (talk)

Talkback

Hello, Dolfrog. You have new messages at Lova Falk's talk page.
Message added 06:56, 13 June 2010 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

Socks

Please click here and read what it says. "Bryan Fedner" is the latest account for a permanently banned editor. I'm not removing Jessica's edits because I disagree with them; I'm removing them because she's violating Wikipedia's terms of service and is not permitted to make any changes whatsoever.

In that process, I tried very hard to keep your recent improvements, and I'm disappointed that you did a wholesale reversion of accurate, sourced material on such a flimsy excuse as "Undid revision 368693187 by WhatamIdoing beleives that others who do not share her view are all socks which is the way she defends her own point of view". WhatamIdoing (talk) 15:42, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

MfD nomination of Wikipedia:WikiProject Latin alphabet

Wikipedia:WikiProject Latin alphabet, a page you substantially contributed to, has been nominated for deletion. Your opinions on the matter are welcome; please participate in the discussion by adding your comments at Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Wikipedia:WikiProject Latin alphabet and please be sure to sign your comments with four tildes (~~~~). You are free to edit the content of Wikipedia:WikiProject Latin alphabet during the discussion but should not remove the miscellany for deletion template from the top of the page; such a removal will not end the deletion discussion. Thank you. Cnilep (talk) 21:50, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for removing {{inuse}} from Dyslexia for me! I got distracted by a minor emergency and forgot to remove it. (I'm very absentminded.) Thanks again! --- cymru lass ^{(hit me up)}⁄_{(background check)} 21:23, 30 June 2010 (UTC)

Special education and other things

The special education article is something of a minefield and it has not been helped by the fact that there is a so-called "sock puppet" with an axe to grind who keeps reincarnating under different user names before getting banned again. You obviously have specialist knowledge of dyslexia within the UK system. Another UK voice in the debate is most welcome. Do feel free to edit the article and especially to add suitable references. You are not disqualified from editing if you have specialist knowledge of a subject. As you have written papers on the subject the only thing you should not be doing is quoting your own papers as references. If you don't feel up to doing the editing perhaps you can help by finding some suitable non-US references to help reduce the US bias. As you say, the Warnock report is now very out of date and is probably best used as a reference in the history section. Perhaps you can provide some more up-to-date references for the UK section. Presumably there are more recent government reports and OFSTED reports on special education. Don't forget however that this is a general article and we don't want to go into too much detail about every single disability or learning difficulty. These are probably best dealt with in the articles on those conditions. Dahliarose (talk) 16:22, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

A few further thoughts. I've just found that OFSTED has a whole section of reports on special educational needs here [1]. There is a report on "Inclusion: does it matter where pupils are taught". It defines the main settings in the UK as: (1) mainstream schools; (2) resourced provision, units & special classes in mainstream schools; (3)special schools (both state and private); (4) other categories include: early years settings; hospital schools; pupil referral units; education otherwise out of school and; awaiting provision. This all makes sense from a UK perspective. Can you see how this can be fitted in with the complicated American system as described in the special education article as it currently stands? Can you make any sense of what they mean by mainstreaming and how it differs from partial inclusion? Dahliarose (talk) 21:23, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

I hope the motor neurone project goes well. Perhaps by the time you return some sense will have been restored to the special education project page!

Thanks for your reply to my question on the Talk:Special education. I thought it was easier to reply here as the talk page on that article is getting somewhat out of hand. You make a very good point about the terminology in the UK changing over time. I was struck looking the other day at an old report by the use of the word "handicapped" throughout whereas today this term is rarely used. I don't know if you noticed but I also had to update the UK section to link to what is now known as the Department of Education. I think this is about the third change in title in the last ten years! Even the US editors can't seem to agree on the meaning of the words in their own country. The challenge is trying to find a common vocabulary that we can all understand. I was hoping that we might find editors from other countries who could contribute to the article and add a different perspective. Unfortunately at the moment we are not really making any progress. It doesn't help when you have to engage in long discussions just to prove something basic like the fact that resource room has different meanings in the US and the UK. I just wish I'd thought of looking at the OED sooner! Unfortunately the OED doesn't help with a lot of the other terminology. Dahliarose (talk) 11:12, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

Thank you for the extensive list of citations.

I'll be checking the citations lists you have kindly provided as I keep researching on dyslexia. I see one of your interests as you read the literature is dyslexia as a cross-cultural phenomenon. That is one of my interests too, as a native speaker of English who has become fully literate in Chinese, with a less practiced ability to read in several other languages, including Hebrew and Japanese. Because you have shared so many references I'll have quite a lot of reading to do. Keep up the good work.

		The Guidance Barnstar
		for providing many references related to the Dyslexia article. Thanks. WeijiBaikeBianji (talk) 19:47, 2 July 2010 (UTC)