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Nice guy

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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by KewlioMZX (talk | contribs) at 23:45, 19 December 2010 (→The "nice guys finish last" view: Added brief info about Tony Clink to resolve "who?", as per reference at the end of below blockquote). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Nice guy is a term in the general public discourse and in popular culture describing an adult male with friendly yet unassertive personality traits in the context of a relationship with a woman.[1] A typical "nice guy" puts the needs of others before his own, avoids confrontations, does favors, gives emotional support, and generally acts nicely towards women.[2] There is an active debate about whether the nice-guy personality profile may actually make a man less desirable to women sexually. Part of this debate includes speculation about possible hypocrisy among women in the dating world: that women may say they want a nice guy but won't have sex with him, and rather subconsciously prefer men who are more confident and assertive but less considerate.

The "nice guys finish last" view

A common aphorism is that "nice guys finish last."[3] The phrase is attributed to baseball manager Leo Durocher in 1939,[4] though Durocher was originally referring to the opposing team rather than to male/female relationship dynamics. The full quote is, "Take a look at them. They're all nice guys, but they'll finish last. Nice guys. Finish last."[5]

The "nice guys finish last" phrase is also said to be coined by American biologist Garrett Hardin to sum up the selfish gene concept of life and evolution. This was disputed by Richard Dawkins, who wrote the book The Selfish Gene. Dawkins was misinterpreted by many as confirming the "nice guy finishing last" view, but refuted the claims in the BBC documentary Nice Guys Finish First.

The "nice guys finish last" view is that there is a discrepancy between women's stated preferences and their actual choices in men. In other words, women say that they want nice guys, but really go for men who are "jerks" or "bad boys" in the end. Desrochers (1995) claims that many "sensitive" men do not believe that women want "nice guys" due to their personal experiences.[6]

According to McDaniel (2005), popular culture and dating advice "suggest that women claim they want a 'nice guy' because they believe that is what is expected of them when, in reality, they want the so-called 'challenge' that comes with dating a not-so-nice guy."

Urbaniak & Kilmann (2003) write that:

"Although women often portray themselves as wanting to date kind, sensitive, and emotionally expressive men, the nice guy stereotype contends that, when actually presented with a choice between such a 'nice guy' and an unkind, insensitive, emotionally-closed, 'macho man' or 'jerk,' they invariably reject the nice guy in favor of his 'so-called' macho competitor."

Another perspective is that women do want "nice guys", at least when they are looking for romantic relationship. Desrochers (1995) suggests that "it still seems popular to believe that women in contemporary America prefer men who are 'sensitive,' or have feminine personality traits." Women have differing opinions about whether "nice guys finish last" sexually or not.

Herold & Milhausen (1999) found that 56% of 165 university women claimed to agree with the statement: "You may have heard the expression, 'Nice guys finish last.' In terms of dating, and sex, do you think women are less likely to have sex with men who are 'nice' than men who are 'not nice'?" A third view is that while "nice guys" may not be as successful at attracting women sexually, they may be sought after by women looking for long-term romantic relationships.

Herold and Milhausen (1999) claim that "while nice guys may not be competitive in terms of numbers of sexual partners, they tend to be more successful with respect to longer-term, committed relationships."

Another study [1] indicates that "for brief affairs, women tend to prefer a dominating, powerful and promiscuous man". Further evidence appears in a 2005 study in Prague - "Since women can always get a man for a one-night stand, they gain an advantage if they find partners for child-rearing".[7]

In 2003, Dr. Robert Glover published a book called, No More Mr. Nice Guy: A Proven Plan for Getting What you want in Love, Sex, and Life. Glover, a psychotherapist in Bellevue, WA, based his book on experience with his clients and his own life. His book traces the society and family origins of the "nice guy syndrome".

Tony Clink, author of a book named The Layguide, offers an explanation for why many women are attracted to the jerk rather than the nice guy:

"It's not because women like jerks. Women prefer polite over rude, and attentive over distracted. The problem is the way nice guys present these positive characteristics. In order to appear friendly and romantic, these 'nice guys' think they have to turn off their sexuality. They hide their desires in order not to offend, presenting an androgynous, asexual persona. The first impression they give is one of emasculation, weakness, and lack of desire. At best, they confuse the woman as to whether they even find her attractive. That's what jerks offer women that nice guys don't: they're not afraid to be sexual."[8][9]

Research

Researchers are also interested in the "nice guy" phenomenon (McDaniel 2005). Empirical research exists on studying perceptions of the "nice guy" phenomenon (some of which is cited above), women's self-reports or behavior, and comparisons of men's personality traits with their sexual or romantic success. Studies that explicitly use the term "nice guy" also cite empirical research that doesn't use that term, but which addresses qualities that are often associated with "niceness". Results of research are mixed and inconsistent (Herold & Milhausen 1998). Herold & Milhausen conclude that "the answer to the question 'Do nice guys finish last?' is complicated in that it is influenced both by the measurement instruments used and by subject characteristics."

The "nice guy" construct

One difficulty in studying the "nice guy" phenomenon is due to the ambiguity of the "nice guy" construct. Participants in studies interpret "nice guy" to mean different things. In their qualitative analysis, Herold & Milhausen (1998) found that women associate different qualities with the "nice guy" label: "Some women offered flattering interpretations of the nice guy, characterizing him as committed, caring, and respectful of women. Some women, however, emphasized more negative aspects, considering the nice guy to be boring, lacking confidence, and unattractive."

There is also a negative phenomenon associated with the "nice girl" in the same respect. She may be considered to be a prude, boring and overly submissive.

The bad boys were also divided into two categories, "as either confident, attractive, sexy, and exciting or as manipulative, unfaithful, disrespectful of women, and interested only in sex." Researchers have operationalized the "nice guy" and "jerk" constructs in different ways, some of which are outlined below (McDaniel 2005).

Results of research

Various studies explicitly try to elucidate the success, or lack thereof, of "nice guys" with women (Jensen-Campbell et. al. 1995,[10] Herold & Milhausen 1998, Urbaniak 2003, McDaniel 2005).

  • Jensen-Campbell et. al. (1995) operationalized "niceness" as prosocial behavior, which included agreeableness and altruism. They found that female attraction was a result of an interaction of both dominance and prosocial tendency. They suggest that altruism may be attractive to women when it is perceived as a form of agentic[clarification needed] behavior.
  • Herold & Milhausen (1998) asked a sample of undergraduate women "You meet two men. One, John, is nice but somewhat shy. He has not had any sexual experience. The other, Mike, is attractive, a lot of fun, and has had intercourse with 10 women. Both wish to date you. Whom do you choose?" 54% reported a preference for "John," 18% preferred "Mike," and the rest had no preference.
  • Urbaniak & Killman (2003) constructed vignettes of four hypothetical dating show contestants: "Nice Todd" vs. "Neutral Todd" vs. "Jerk Todd" vs. "Michael", who was created to be a control. "Nice Todd" described a "real man" as "in touch with his feelings", kind and attentive, non-macho, and interested in putting his partner's pleasure first. "Neutral Todd" described a "real man" as someone who "knows what he wants and knows how to get it", and who is good to the woman he loves. "Jerk Todd" described a "real man" as someone "knows what he wants and knows how to get it", who keeps everyone else on their toes, and avoids "touch-feely" stuff. "Michael" described a "real man" as relaxed and positive. In two studies, Urbaniak & Kilmann found that women claimed to prefer "Nice Todd" over "Neutral" over "Jerk Todd", relative to "Michael" even at differing levels of physical attractiveness. They also found that for purely sexual relationships, "niceness appeared relatively less influential than physical attractiveness." After acknowledging that women's preference for "niceness" could be inflated by the social desirability bias, especially due to their use of verbal scripts, they conclude that "our overall results did not favor the nice guy stereotype."
  • McDaniel (2005) constructed vignettes of dates with a stereotypical "nice guy" vs. a stereotypical "fun/sexy guy", and attempted to make them both sound positive. Participants reported a greater likelihood of wanting a second date with the "nice guy" rather than with the "fun/sexy guy."
  • A study at New Mexico State University in Las Cruces (2008) showed that nice guys claim to have significantly less sexual partners than bad boys.[11][12]

These studies also cite other research on heterosexual attraction that doesn't mention the "nice guy" term. They interpret various studies on female attraction to various traits in men (e.g. dominance, agreeableness, physical attractiveness, wealth, etc.), and on the sexual success of men with different personality traits, to shed light on the "nice guy" phenomenon.

  • Sadalla, Kenrick, & Vershure (1985)[13] found that women were sexually attracted to dominance in men (though dominance did not make men likable to women), and that dominance in women had no effect on men.
  • Bogaert & Fisher (1995)[14] studied the relationships between the personalities of university men and their number of sexual partners. They found a correlation between a man's number of sexual partners, and the traits of sensation-seeking, hypermasculinity, physical attractiveness, and testosterone levels. They also discovered a correlation between maximum monthly number of partners, and the traits of dominance and psychoticism. Bogaert & Fisher suggest that an underlying construct labelled "disinhibition" could be used to explain most of these differences. They suggest that disinhibition would correlate negatively with "agreeableness" and "conscientiousness" from the Big Five personality model.
  • Botwin, Buss & Shackelford (1997)[15] found that women had a higher preference for surgency and dominance in their mates than men did, in a study of dating couples and newlyweds. Shackelford has been criticized for this with some mockingly referring to him as "Todd the Texas sharpshooter fallacy."

Other viewpoints on the "nice guy"

There are a number of different opinions about the "niceness" that "nice guys" claim to exhibit and how this quality relates to a man's desirability, or lack thereof. A sampling of these opinions follows.

Nice guys, who aren't actually nice

In early 2002, the website Heartless Bitches International (HBI), which "employs irony as a strategy to offer humorous explorations of contemporary gender relations"[16] published several short essays (which they labelled "rants") on the concept of the "nice guy". Central to the theme of these essays is that a genuinely nice male is desirable, but that many people purporting to be, or believing themselves to be a "nice guy" are actually clingy, self-abasing, and insecure to such an extent that their attempts to be nice and desire to be loved, make them neither nice nor loveable. The worst examples of such behavior are caricatures of behaviors that would be more desirable in moderation.[17][18]

On 21 July 2002, a link to HBI was posted on Fark.[19][20] This triggered many angry e-mails from men self-identifying as "nice guys" as well as praise and new contributions from both women and men who could identify with the site, a number of men claiming that the site had helped them to see their own "nice guy" behavior in a new light.[21]

The HBI essays have become mildly popular as a stock reply on some romantic help forums, message boards and answer sites. It is less than universally popular however, as readers who self-identify as "nice guys" often take umbrage with the suggestion that they are at fault.[22]

The disease to please

A condition very similar to the "nice guy syndrome" was described by the late Harriet Braiker in her 2001 bestselling book The Disease to Please - Curing the People-Pleasing Syndrome.[23] Like the "nice guy", the "people pleaser" will suppress his own needs in order to satisfy the perceived needs of others. However, while the nice guy syndrome was clearly elaborated as a men-only problem, the "disease to please" focuses more on women who can have very similar behavior patterns.

See also

References

  1. ^ McDaniel, A.K. (2005).
  2. ^ Glover, Dr. Robert, http://nomoremrniceguy.com
  3. ^ Urbaniak, G.C. & Kilmann, P.R. (2003). Physical attractiveness and the "nice guy paradox:" Do nice guys really finish last. Sex Roles, 49, 413-426.
  4. ^ Phrases.org.uk. .http://www.phrases.org.uk/bulletin_board/30/messages/1838.html
  5. ^ Boller, Jr., Paul F. (1989). They Never Said It: A Book of Fake Quotes, Misquotes, and Misleading Attributions. New York: Oxford University Press. ISBN 0-19-505541-1. {{cite book}}: Unknown parameter |coauthors= ignored (|author= suggested) (help)
  6. ^ Desrochers, S. (1995). What types of men are most attractive and most repulsive to women. Sex Roles, 32, 375-391.
  7. ^ Reynolds, Matt (7 August 2005). "Why women cheat / Birds stray the nest and so do many of our human females". The San Francisco Chronicle.
  8. ^ Clink, Tony. The Layguide. p. 13. ISBN 0-8065-2602-5.
  9. ^ Resource not returned
  10. ^ Jensen-Campbell, L.A., Graziano, W.G., & West, S.G. (1995). Dominance, prosocial orientation, and female preferences: Do nice guys really finish last? Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, 68, 427–440.
  11. ^ ABC News: Why Nice Guys Finish Last
  12. ^ New Scientist: Bad guys really do get the most girls
  13. ^ Sadalla, E.K., Kenrick, D.T., & Venshure, B. (1987). Dominance and heterosexual attraction. Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, 52, 730–738.
  14. ^ Bogaert, A.F., & Fisher, W.A. (1995). Predictors of university men's number of sexual partners. Journal of Sex Research, 32, 119–130.
  15. ^ Botwin, M.D., Buss, D.M., & Shackelford, T.K. (1997). Personality and mate preferences: Five factors in mate selection and marital satisfaction. Journal of Personality, 65, 107–136.
  16. ^ Whittaker, Jason (2004). The cyberspace handbook. Routledge. pp. 186–187. ISBN 041516835X. Retrieved 2009-11-21.
  17. ^ HBI - Why "Nice Guys" are often such LOSERS
  18. ^ HBI - Nice guys we can do without
  19. ^ HBI comments July 2002
  20. ^ http://www.fark.com/cgi/comments.pl?IDLink=243921 Original Fark forum posting linking to Heartless Bitches International
  21. ^ HBI - Letter from a Reformed Nice Guy
  22. ^ HBI comments July 2002
  23. ^ Harriet B. Braiker: The Disease to Please. Curing the People-Pleasing Syndrome. McGraw-Hill, ISBN 0-07-138564-9
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