Talk:Jose Guerena shooting

Questions?

1) Why was Guerena taken in his own home? This is the most dangerous place, as any "suspect" can barricade himself. Why not at work? He worked at the ASARCO mine, security is tight there (they stock/use explosives). He would have had to pass a background check just to work there, so I think Guerena is innocent.

2) Guerena was a vet marine, Very familiar with an M-16, which is almost identical to the AR-15 reported that he was armed with. He Must have known he had it on safe, and, deliberately, and not been willing to take the first shot. And, being an ex-Marine, he was probably very disciplined. If innocent, why challenge the cops at all? He must not have know who they were--they must not have identified themself, as "they " claimed. EDIT: Video shows no "identification" or "sirens" until Guerena was shot...it's on Tape.

3) Why would a "suspect" carefully secrete his family, then challenge the intruders with something like:"I've got something for you" ? This makes No Sense. Anyone facing intruders woukld simply open fire or say, like; "Drop it" or "Get Out".

4) Why the conflicting stories?: Was he crouched in the doorway (a sniping position), or, was he standing in the hall (defensively)?

5) One report says Money in house, one doesn't . So, there was Money in the house, so what? How much? EDIT: Just some housekeeping money...a few tax receipts, lotto tickets. Again, PCS is trying to make a mountain of a molehill.

6) SWAT team reported:"weapons, body armor". So, What? I see body armor and automatic machine guns, short rifles and shotguns, etc, for sale openly at AZ gun shows. EDIT: The "weapons" found was an old Police .38---hardly illegal and a "cache".

7) Dupnik gag-ordered this. Yey, some members of SWAT tream are coming forward. They risk their jobs doing this, so they have something to say.EDIT: some dovcuments are now unseled. They still say nothing--that some of Guerena's relatives were involved in Drugs? So? This is not "probable cause"--see the interview I will post.

8)So, search warrants were served in other "houses in vicinity". So, What? This doesn't necessarily imply guilt.

9) Guerena was denied medical attention One Hour. Chester Manning, Republican candidate for new Pima County Sheriff, and others agree a scene is "secured in 5 minutes, unless bomb squad needs be brought in"..which it Wasn't. This delay is inexcusable. The area was :"secure" when Guerena was down and his rifle taken--5 minutes on the outside.

10) This is just another example of Pima County and/or TPD concentrating on "small fry" to make it look like they are doing their job when they can't get a grasp on the Real Problems--drug cartels from Mexico. And, not caring how many lives they destroy--they "rationalize" it with "erring on the side of safety" (Sheriff Apaio of Maricopa County) or;"How many cops are shot in NYC last year", and other irrelevant garbage.

11) Such overreaction might imply Steroid use--were the men later drug-tested?

12) A SWAT team for a home invasion suspect? Maybe for a big Drug seller or mfgr, but Home Invasion? Get Real! Beat cops can take a situation like this.

EDIT: Former SWAT team member (will post link) said they were "very unprofessional...no better than street cops, panicing". He also said, SWAT means: "Special weapons, and Tactics". They are trained to be cool in a situation, not Play the FM radio, not Mill about (as in the video), but form a highly structured formation. Not to setand outside and lose all their night vision--they wouldn't be ables to see inside a darkened room for a few seconds (that's all it takes to make a wrong decision.) Also, Not to knock and wait only 7 seconds--this isn't a reasonable time for Anyone to answer.(I've had to wait two minutes--!)Not stand framed and exposed in doorways, either. Or, fire first shot, necessarily. They should be Trained not to open fire just because someone in their Own Home has a gun--this is an expected situation they Should Be trained for. And, going cyclic is the Last Move--even the Army only uses this as a last resort. One fired under another's armpit--this will deafen and temporarily blind members . They Had flash-grenades and tear gas.... Now that their guns are empoty, what if Another assailant came? They would be defensely--sheer stupidity.

13) This time they have gone too far--a decorated ex-marine, good job, familty, two tours in Iraq--they won't get away with it and the entire State will face a class-action suit. Apaiapo and Dupnik and TPD's police chief won't be able to flip burgers in Douglas when the smoke clears. 'Bout time!68.231.184.217 (talk) 12:43, 28 May 2011 (UTC)

14)How can we get the federal government to investigate this incident? I understand that this is not the only serious error on the side of caution.

15)Can we start a petition to get the feds to look into this? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Krissylynny (talk • contribs) 16:37, 29 May 2011 (UTC)

Questions asked by WP:reliable sources - in either opinion pieces or by quoting other sources - can be introduced, if done in appropriate encyclopedic fashion. CarolMooreDC (talk) 01:51, 31 May 2011 (UTC)

Number of times shot

I've made the change to reflect the latest news. Jose Guerena was shot 22 times, not 60 as erroneously reported earlier: http://azstarnet.com/news/local/crime/article_d92dd346-f13a-5332-8981-cefd04d9fd54.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.5.252.228 (talk) 09:27, 1 June 2011 (UTC)

Warrants Released

Some of the warrants have been released, though there is some level of censorship to protect the confidential informant. Here they are in PDF format: http://www.kvoa.com/files/Scanned%20Document0582_000.pdf So, question... if I post information from these warrants, is that considered original research? Thanks for answering, I'm not well versed in the limitations of OR, as I'm relatively new to wiki editing. Thanks again. Zenmastervex (talk) 08:28, 4 June 2011 (UTC)

Sourcing policy states that such primary sources should be used only with due care. Chances are that the information most pertinent to this article in the warrants has been mentioned in secondary sources, which we would prefer to use. Nevard (talk) 02:27, 5 June 2011 (UTC)