Talk:Irom Chanu Sharmila

Serious problems with citations

There are some huge POV lines with citations needed tags. It's been 4 months. Though the pollicy is for immediate removal of such content, especially from bio pages, I am leaving it there for now since user My Wikidness seems to be impassioned about IS. Please use credible sources to obviate further edits. Thanks Nshuks7 (talk) 11:11, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

I've attempted to remove all unsourced material and source everything that's left, but I'll be glad to have my work checked, redone, etc. if I've removed anything in error. -- Khazar (talk) 00:30, 9 May 2011 (UTC)

For some time Sharmila and I have agreed to marry and she has appointed me her spokesman. Beyond that I have no axe to grind. Sometimes I get blocked sometimes what I say is printed. I have pretty much posted what I feel should be said on various blogs and pages. I am not that certain what difference it makes. It should be easy enough to verify. Wiki always had good basic information on Sharmila but it never seemed to get updated. As you are volunteers and probably have no deep concern with Sharmila all well and good and there does not appear to be any obvious misinformation here though obviously you can't sum up a life in a few pages. I am Yoko Ono. Nobody just listened to Yoko if they wanted to know about the Beatles. If the truth matters sure check out stuff and keep updating. So yeah if you keep the stuff all well and good and if not. Depends what wiki is about. If people want to find out stuff they just have to look more carefully. If you want me to dig around for references and if you can support pdf files I have letters from various officials I could download to you, if you think it matters. (Desi) — Preceding unsigned comment added by DesmondCoutinho (talk • contribs) 04:26, 6 August 2011 (UTC)

Well looks like that Khazar chappie is no longer posting. That's the way with doing work where everyone blames you for everything and no one gives you any credit. If they pay you it's not very much either. From what I could tell you did a good job editing. I put down what I have to say but I am not that convinced by the power of words any more. If you think editing is frustrating try actual campaigning for one person you really care about. I am not going to tell you to come back. But you did a good job and I hope good things come to you too now also. desi don't really understand the four tilda thing I was going to type four tildas but that can't be right and young people can be cruel. desi — Preceding unsigned comment added by DesmondCoutinho (talk • contribs) 10:26, 6 August 2011 (UTC)

Yeah yeah what is the purpose of a wiki biography. It gives basic info and people have to start somewhere. I can provide you with direct quotes from her letters stating what she believes in, that her way of being is one of extreme non-violence, ie lasting change which comes through non-confrontation, respect and love for adversaries. I can quote you her words and her metaphors. You will know it is hers by the folk english indian grammar and the gentleness of her style. But if Wiki won't allow Irom Sharmila's words to appear on Irom Sharmila's biography page then it is Wiki that misses out. I appreciate the fact that the editors have no personal knowledge of Sharmila grants them greater objectivity but merely deleting her words when they are offered is short sighted vandalism. Having said that the internet is a big place and her words are like weeds other sites agreed to publish I have fulfilled her request. Pity that Khazar chappie left he got fed up with constant criticism from both wiki and the world I hope he has moved on to happier things. I am off on another 3 week noble silent retreat soon and I know that is more effective then offering updates here. But if it is your wish to have the bare bones of lists of awards and dates it's a good place for researchers to start looking to learn more. The best way is to meet her yourselves. One day soon I hope she will be free and you can do so. If anonymous users delete my entries unnecessarily I hope they are undone. If someone wants to take credit for changes fair enough if people agree with them. I actually know her and have been appointed her spokesman but this is neither an official nor authorized biographical site so I accept it has wiki rules and wiki conventions. Not sure why you removed the verifiable sources confirming her choice in life partner. It has caused her some discomfort the reports have been suppressed within Manipur. One would have hoped the internet and wiki would allow free expression of a verifiable fact the journalist concerned is Sonia Sharka of the Calcutta Herald I believe it's name. She had her reasons for breaking the story and I don't think she wants to annoy any one in manipur by pushing it too hard now but she broke it and you can't unring a bell. Time will tell. But if the rules are about verification then they seem to be arbitrarily used now a keen editor has gone. — Preceding unsigned comment added by DesmondCoutinho (talk • contribs) 04:28, 28 August 2011 (UTC)

Hey there Ericbo1 i am sure you are a fine subeditor but until you have worked out hte importance of bollywood to Indian politics maybe cool your jets. It's an important addition for those who want info it's a pity that subediting is done by people so ignorant of the subject matter some knowledge is necessary in order to the job beyond that of wiki conventions because I can't be bothered to learn them for wiki but we all have our foibles Superman had kryptonite I have a refusal to consent to standardized referencing systems like Harvard or Wiki. I've survived life this long too late for me to learn now. ciao bello I'll present my evidence elsewhere from now on. — Preceding unsigned comment added by DesmondCoutinho (talk • contribs) 04:21, 29 August 2011 (UTC)

I've replied on your talk page... hopefully you were able to read it before you left. _EricLeb⁰¹ (Page | Talk) 04:33, 29 August 2011 (UTC)

Irom Chanu Sharmila

The English language has an excellent piece of advice: One should not blow one's own horn!

Irom Chanu is a Meitei woman, a citizen of Manipur. Whether Manipuris are or are not Indian subjects is not something that belongs here. The Indian State is not God; states come and go, nations - or ethnic groups - outlive states. The ethnic groups of Manipur have been around for considerably longer than the Indian State, and for hundreds of years, the ancestors of today's Manipuris were blissfully ignorant of so momentous a "truth" that they were "Indians"!

It is beyond controversy that the Indian State used brute force to terrorize various peoples and states to merge themselves into the Indian Union. That was the work of Sardar Patel and Jawaharlal Nehru, both of them criminals of the first order.

It is beyond controversy that Manipur is not a historical part of the South Asian ethno-cultural continuum.

It is beyond controversy that the King of Manipur was forced to "merge" his Kingdom into India at gunpoint, an act that, due to duress, is illegal, null and void of its own nature.

There is nothing "POV" about calling a spade a spade, or calling a draconian "law" a draconian "law".

But what urges our vandal to whitewash or rather suppress such vital - and embarassing - information that the AFSPA "empowers" Indian military personnel to "to arrest citizens; search or destroy property without warrant; to shoot – and even to kill – on suspicion alone, and moreover gives the armed forces near-total immunity against any judicial action"? Is it moral cowardice?

AFSPA is a "legal charter" for State Terrorism.

The Indian State does not care a damn whether Irom Chanu dies or not; it objects to what it considers "blackmail" against its acts of terrorism and as attempts to curtail its "rights" to perpetrate State Terrorism, and so it indulges in brute force against one unarmed girl under the pretence of "preventing suicide"! This is moral hypocrisy of the highest order, besides being gross misuse of powers, exposing the Indian State for exactly what it is - totally bereft of any concept of morality or acquaintance with any such notion as "conscience".

My Wikidness 17:09, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

I am afraid that all of the things you say, while possibly true, are not agreed with by many people; I urge you to consider the fact that someone will come along soon and, if they see your words on the article, change it to a version completely opposed to yours. Please consider instead accepting an version of the article that will not annoy either of you enough to click the edit button. Hornplease 15:35, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

---

I can accept a truly "neutral" version of the entry. Points which need to be stressed:

1. While Manipur is de facto governed by India, there remains legitimate reasons to doubt that this is legal and morally so. The people who are fighting for Manipur's independence have as much a right to the respect of their fellow-men as do the Indians, and, very probably, a greater right indeed, given that India's occupation is very questionable. I cannot accept that India's monopoly on viewpoint is either moral or "NPOV"!

1. There are no reasons to whitewash or suppress vital information concerning the nature of the AFSPA and which make it so objectionable to the peoples of Manipur, even those who are, like Irom Chanu herself, very probably favorable towards India.

Etc.

Kind regards,

My Wikidness 15:51, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Thank you for your prompt response. I agree that alternative POvs belong on WP. Howeverr, the kind of detailed discussion of Manipur's independence movements and the nature of the Act that you wish to include should belong on the Manipur and Armed Forces Act page, which are linked from this one; the interested reader will follow the links. Please do consider editing there. Thanks, and happy editing! Hornplease 16:20, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Anonymous 1:13, 11 December(IST)

A detailed discussion on AFSPA in this article is to answer why Sharmila is fasting. That is not a day's fast for some religious act but a 9 year and ongoing for a cause that pervades terror to more than 2300000 people everyday. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.46.55.31 (talk) 19:49, 10 December 2009 (UTC)

Agreeing with the above opinions, AFSPA has its own detailed page, and internal linking to relevant parts is a better option. I have removed the lengthy discussion from this page and added a See Also to the end of the article. If you have material (not discussions) on AFSPA, please add to the relevant page. If you have material that directly involves IS, please add to this page. If there's any confusion, please solicit advice here, on the talk page. Nshuks7 (talk) 11:00, 4 February 2011 (UTC)