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A target article, bolded in text, is the focus of the story. Each blurb must have at least one such article, but you may also link non-target articles.
Articles in the Ongoing line describe events getting continuous coverage.
The Recent deaths (RD) line includes any living thing whose death was recently announced. Consensus may decide to create a blurb for a recent death.
All articles linked in the ITN template must pass our standards of review. They should be up-to-date, demonstrate relevance via good sourcing and have at least an acceptable quality.
Nomination steps
Make sure the item you want to nominate has an article that meets our minimum requirements and contains reliable coverage of a current event you want to create a blurb about. We will not post about events described in an article that fails our quality standards.
Find the correct section below for the date of the event (not the date nominated). Do not add sections for new dates manually – a bot does that for us each day at midnight (UTC).
Create a level 4 header with the article name (==== Your article here ====). Add (RD) or (Ongoing) if appropriate.
Then paste the {{ITN candidate}} template with its parameters and fill them in. The news source should be reliable, support your nomination and be in the article. Write your blurb in simple present tense. Below the template, briefly explain why we should post that event. After that, save your edit. Your nomination is ready!
You may add {{ITN note}} to the target article's talk page to let editors know about your nomination.
The better your article's quality, the better it covers the event and the wider its perceived significance (see WP:ITNSIGNIF for details), the better your chances of getting the blurb posted.
When the article is ready, updated and there is consensus to post, you can mark the item as (Ready). Remove that wording if you feel the article fails any of these necessary criteria.
Admins should always separately verify whether these criteria are met before posting blurbs marked (Ready). For more guidance, check WP:ITN/A.
If satisfied, change the header to (Posted).
Where there is no consensus, or the article's quality remains poor, change the header to (Closed) or (Not posted).
Sometimes, editors ask to retract an already-posted nomination because of a fundamental error or because consensus changed. If you feel the community supports this, remove the item and mark the item as (Pulled).
Voicing an opinion on an item
Format your comment to contain "support" or "oppose", and include a rationale for your choice. In particular, address the notability of the event, the quality of the article, and whether it has been updated.
Pick an older item to review near the bottom of this page, before the eligibility runs out and the item scrolls off the page and gets abandoned in the archive, unused and forgotten.
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Tell about problems in articles if you see them. Be bold and fix them yourself if you know how, or tell others if it's not possible.
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Oppose an item just because the event is only relating to a single country, or failing to relate to one. We post a lot of such content, so these comments are generally unproductive.
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Comment on a story without first reading the relevant article(s).
Apple Inc. releases its sales report for the iPhone 4Ssmartphone, which has reportedly sold over 4 million units worldwide in under four days, breaking company sales records. (Computer World)
2011 Yemeni protests: At least six people are killed in the Yemeni capital Sana'a after government troops open fire on protesters. These killings constitute the second incident of fatal protest violence in Sana'a in under 48 hours. (MarketWatch)
A ceremony is held to officially re-name the English town of Wootton Bassett with the prefix "Royal" in honour of its role in the repatriation of British military personnel killed in action in Iraq and Afghanistan. It is the first town to receive such an honour since 1909. (BBC)
In Indycar, fifteen cars were involved in a wreck at Las Vegas Motor Speedway in the final race of the season. Dan Wheldon, who was involved in the wreck, was transported to a nearby hospital and pronounced dead while the race was red-flagged. The wreck happened on lap 11, and the remaining 188 laps were not raced.
Nominator's comments: We actually have another ITNR motorsport candidate for today in that the F1 Constructor's championship was decided. However, I don't anticipate the appetite for two stories up at once so I figure this one probably trumps the F1 crown. Crispmuncher (talk) 22:23, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support I'd like to see a more substantial update to his article, but he was an unquestionably famous (and popular) athlete, a former series champion, and the current Indy 500 champion. The story is the current top headline on ESPN, the New York Times, and CNN, and it's the second story/top sports story on BBC. A mention of his passing on ITN, for me, is a no-brainer. (Note that I'm not a racing fan, but I definitely understand Wheldon's importance.) -- Mike(Kicking222)23:08, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support I also agree a better update, but this is the most notable racing death since Dale Earnhardt, obvious notability, and should lead to changes in the sport, as drivers were complaining about the speed of the racetrack before the race. Secretaccount23:13, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Strong support - The loss of Wheldon has hurt the racing community (for which I am a part), among NASCAR, the IndyCarSeries, the NHRA and on. I'd also like to offer that it be expanded to: "Racing driver Dan Wheldon is killed in an IndyCar race due to injuries sustained at a crash at Las Vegas Motor Speedway.) This should be honored. And as a fan, I have had the hard time of being able to think of comments but my in real life mouth is quiet. Mitch32(Never support thosewho think in the box)23:31, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Neutral. Very sad and quite possibly ITN-worthy, but four of five current ITN stories are US-related. Could we maybe make an effort to diversify? --FormerIP (talk) 23:37, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support especially per Mike and Secret. I was going to post but if I'm reading Mitch's post right he wants to be the one to post. Ks0stm(T•C•G•E)00:16, 17 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Comment With there being complaints that there are too many US stories on ITN, and also a common complaint that there is too much sport on ITN, I'd like to note that this item is not a particularly major headline in the US press, let alone the world. It's the death of what at the end of the day was a minor celebrity few people had heard of earlier.--Johnsemlak (talk) 02:02, 17 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
A lot of things are on the front page of all those websites. Should every item be posted to ITN? The BBC website also had the All Blacks winning their semifinal in a higher position. It's not the top headline anywhere I've seen.--Johnsemlak (talk) 02:13, 17 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
It's not a particularly major headline. It's not the lead anywhere or the 2nd or 3rd story, and the events that are in those positions haven't been posted. ITN generally posts 1 or maybe two stories a day. It's not that big of a headline. Plus, this story is just confirming two the the major biases ITN has--sports and US centrism.--Johnsemlak (talk) 02:35, 17 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
May I suggest switching this around to focus on the fact that the overall incident was a major crash at the event, which did result in the death of Dan along with (as I'm reading) three other injuries and a premature cancellation of the race. Dan's still the key article for this, but the event article probably needs updating too. --MASEM (t) 02:26, 17 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support This is not about being nationalistic or anything like that at all. This open wheel race car driver won two of the most high profile races and he won it this year by the way. Plus, he died in his chosen field as well, which makes this even more ITN worthy in the first place. This is the first death in the sport of IndyCar since 2006 when Paul Dana lost his life, which he was not even remotely close to this race car drivers noteworthiness. This story has made national and international news, so it needs to go up.The Gypsy Vagabond Man (talk) 02:26, 17 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. I'm not sure you've explained why this event is especially significant. Kenyan troops crossing into Somalia does not seem to be all that unusual, as can be seen from these news stories from earlier this year: [2][3]. --FormerIP (talk) 14:31, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support - military incursions into foreign countries are generally notable. The backstory with militants kidnapping foreigners is also internationally significant. Thue | talk15:16, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: Do we know if this has the approval of the TFG government (who is recognized by many countries as the legit govt)? I ask this because the TFG government has already authorised the CTF-150, Russia and India to enter Somalian territory in pursuit of terrorists/pirates. While I agree foreign boots on the ground within any country is generally notable, it may be of limited significance given examples quoted by Former IP and if it has TFG approval. Chocolate Horlicks (talk) 16:46, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
According to the BBC (not up for deletion), the Somali government is claiming that Kenya is providing logistical support to a Somali-led operation. I'm not saying, BTW, that this is an unpostable story. But we should understand it, update the article and then post, in that order. --FormerIP (talk) 19:10, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Of course it is up for deletion. Wikipedia articles about contemporary events covered by the media are almost always ambushed by the usual petty trolls and put up for deletion. DeterenceTalk20:23, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's comments: The monument was originally opened on 22 August was was to be dedicated with appearances by Barack Obama and an estimated crowd of 250,000. The dedication was delayed by the hurricane and will happen today with appearances by Aretha Franklin, Sheryl Crow, and others.--Johnsemlak (talk) 10:58, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
To try to put some perspective on this, the scale and position of this federally sanctioned memorial are normally reserved for former US presidents; this memorial is positioned among the memorials to FDR, Thomas Jefferson, and Abraham Lincoln. It's nearly 2 Hectares large. It's an extremely powerful recognition of MLK's place in history.--Johnsemlak (talk) 10:23, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support. Agree that the article is good enough - one of those occasions where a sentence might constitute enough of an update. --FormerIP (talk) 15:01, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support. This is a good article and an event that is likely to attract diverse interest. However, the "Dedication" section of the article will need to be updated to reflect what actually happened at the dedication. --Orlady (talk) 17:12, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Not ready The Dedication section is not updated. It hasn't even been put into past tense. As Orlady said, the article should mention what actually happened at the dedication, not that a dedication will happen. -- tariqabjotu19:45, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
To be honest, I'm a bit surprised myself. Everyone seemed to gloss over the fact that it's been open for two months. This dedication better be good. -- tariqabjotu21:01, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
It's been open for two months but after the dedication was delayed by Hurricane Irene I waited until now to nominate it. It certainly did not become less notable during that time. As to people saying 'it's just a statue', well, it's not just a statue. It's a 2 hectare national monument and it's put in an extremely reserved position, as noted above, between the Lincoln Memorial and the Jefferson Memorial. This level of recognition had only been given to the most famous US presidents. The statue was sculpted by renowned Chinese artist Lei Yixin. I'd put this on par with the renovation of the Louvre museum. This has to be one of the most significant statues or monuments built in the last decade.--Johnsemlak (talk) 01:24, 17 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Weak support. I'm hesitant about posting anything that is purely celebratory, even though this is getting a lot of attention. But we haven't posted anything remotely similar for months, so I'll support for diversity's sake. JimSukwutput21:28, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Okay, but the Iran story and the LRA story are very much international stories, and the nationality of Ritchie is of perhaps tertiary importance to the story. Personally, I think that lessens the issue. -- tariqabjotu23:52, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Very much international stories that just so happen to be particularly significant from a US perspective. I'm not suggesting anything can be done except making Wikipedians less parochial by an act of will. Just making a point, really. --FormerIP (talk) 00:26, 17 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. Top U.S. story right now is the crash above. This might not even be second, the alleged plot and Wall Street are still popular. Very much western story. On the other side of the world, this barely make the news. ... (talk) 02:44, 17 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
2011 Yemeni protests: At least nine people are killed and dozens injured in the Yemeni capital Sana'a after security forces use tear gas and live ammunition to disperse anti-government protesters. (VoA)(BBC)
The United StatesDepartment of Commerce reports that U.S. retail sales rose at their fastest rate for seven months in September, having risen by 1.1% over the previous month. (BBC)
Riot police clash with protesters in Rome, with at least 70 people reportedly injured after masked rioters infiltrate the peaceful protests and attack property in the city. (BBC)
Nominator's comments: It is a relative big event and as said in the blurb, it is the first time since the first event that a European nation wins the cup. --Styath (talk) 09:42, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. I'm not sure on the rules with these tournament articles, but it looks like you may need a bit more prose. Other than that, it's ready to go. Nightw09:58, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose--The top International Baseball championship is the World Baseball Classic. The level of play of this tournament was very low; most of the tournament's top players don't even have articles; Japan and the US clearly sent severely weakened teams.--Johnsemlak (talk) 10:01, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
OK, I'll go along with that. The earlier post made it sound like the Netherlands' win wasn't important because the USA sent a weak team. ITN/R is important. HiLo48 (talk) 10:21, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose - This tournament is not nearly as significant as the World Baseball Classic, and we do have to be somewhat selective about what we post in terms of sporting events. Despite its name, this really doesn't come close to making the cut. To put things into perspective, in this tournament, 73 games were played, and the total attendance was only 156,046. This number is completely dwarfed by the five-game 2010 World Series (243,607) and the 39-game 2009 World Baseball Classic (801,408). Swarm10:28, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Crowds should not count. A tournament in the USA is guaranteed to have larger crowds than one in the Netherlands. That doesn't make it more important. There are far too many claims made here based primarily on the fact that the USA has a lot of people in it. HiLo48 (talk) 19:34, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
I wasn't attempting to relate the attendance figures to the importance, I was just trying to provide perspective on how very minor this baseball tournament is compared to some other ones. Swarm20:11, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support - Definitely a headline of Saturday and article content updated. Should be published ASAP as yesterdays news is what we should not have I guess? (although its frequesntly the case here, unfortunatelly)--Kozuch (talk) 22:43, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose Article is almost entirely made up of primary sources - most directly cited from OWS websites. Need some real sources documenting actual protests in "hundreds" of cities. WikifanBe nice23:04, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose unless article is radically expanded. This is still pretty much same as last weekend, with number of events and attendance mostly pulled from Facebook. Also, Rome, Athens, London and Madrid each have such demonstrations on a daily basis. --hydrox (talk) 23:14, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. The protests are still extremely small in-scale, with some riots going on in Rome and a few hundred copycat protesters in London (who have been protesting since two years ago). And all the protests are limited to a few wealthy developed countries, so it is quite silly to call this phenomenon "worldwide". JimSukwutput23:43, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Grammar pedant comment In the blurb, "100's" is horrible! Please say "hundreds". It's only two more key strokes. (I counted one for the Shift key.) HiLo48 (talk) 23:53, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
While I agree with you, I am now on the edge of my seat waiting for a mathematics pedant comment in response to your count of the number of key strokes ;-) DeterenceTalk00:17, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
As a European pedant, I offer the comment that the Occupy Wall Street protest was inspired by the "Indignant" protests in Madrid, which are amongst those that have been held today. So "inspired by Occupy Wall Street" would be totalmente inadecuado. --FormerIP (talk) 00:33, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Sorry for the "horrible blurb", I'm crying anon tears now. The article I posted said "Rallies were held in more than 900 cities in Europe, Africa and Asia" so I guess it was also quite silly to click the link and read all the way down to the second paragraph. Withdrawn. You people are ridiculous. --108.132.169.195 (talk) 02:48, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
As a standalone, the October 15 protests were not noteworthy with the possible exceptions of Rome and Madrid, where they were fueled by something rather different than the Occupy Wall Street 1%/99% and background foreclosure/bank bailout uneasiness. Hundreds of cities may be a vast, vast overstatement. Honestly, as it stands, I do not think a significant OWS protest will survive the winter -- but then again, the movement has already survived a couple of weeks longer than I originally thought it would. Still, for a possibly different ITN article, IF there is a tipping point into noteworthiness, how to recognise it? The Arab Spring took so many different forms, but one commonality was that the protests intensified after people died, the goal to be reached at all costs. Currently, although I can see frustration and also the only outcome that could really relieve that frustration, I do not see that same determination here. At the same time, no one died in the Tea Party protests, and those did reach the point that they were considered ITN noteworthy (and that before the Tea Party became a significant faction of the GOP). If we consider ourselves capable of making the judgement, we should also be able to answer what would constitute sufficient noteworthiness in this case. - Tenebris 07:16, 16 October 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.254.157.247 (talk)
[Posted] US sends 100 troops to battle the Lord's Resistence Army
Nominator's comments: The soldiers “will not themselves engage LRA forces unless necessary for self-defense.” But I still consider it notable that the US is becoming involved in what is effectively a war. Thue
comment If this is going to be posted, it should say "Obama notifies Congress" he is sending troops. Not "America". He is acting on his own without authority. μηδείς (talk) 23:08, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Well, he is the executive branch of the US government, so it is not unreasonable to say "the US does", when it is Obama who gives the order. Also, he does cite the Lord's Resistance Army Disarmament and Northern Uganda Recovery Act which authorizes the "increased, comprehensive U.S. efforts to help mitigate and eliminate the threat posed by the LRA to civilians and regional stability" according to the NYT article. Without looking into it more deeply, that sentense does arguably give him the authority from Congress to send military advisers. Thue | talk23:22, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
A quote from the law passed by Congress, my bolding: providing political, economic, military, and intelligence support for viable multilateral efforts to protect civilians from the Lord’s Resistance Army, to apprehend or remove Joseph Kony and his top commanders from the battlefield in the continued absence of a negotiated solution, and to disarm and demobilize the remaining Lord’s Resistance Army fighters. Thue | talk23:41, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
I doubt that the target group will be worried about the internal US politics that bothers Medeis. They will just see Americans with guns. HiLo48 (talk) 23:46, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. Fighting has been going on for decades, with hundreds of African troops dead. The U.S. sending a few advisers that won't actually be fighting anybody is not a significant development in this story. Nightw12:45, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
LRA has been supported by Sudan, but now that South Sudan has split off, perhaps the LRA will be more vulnerable. So there is a good chance that fighting will not continue for decades more. Perhaps the sending of the military advisers is happening now because the LRA is vulnerable? Thue | talk19:00, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support - it's easy to underestimate the impact of military advisers. What many of the government forces in central African states need is qualified leadership, and the U.S. troops are a great contribution to this scarcity. Besides, sending military advisers is often a prelude to sending actual troops, as countless wars in the past (e.g. Vietnam) have taught us. JimSukwutput16:12, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Vietnam was not invaded; it was under a civil war that Eisenhower and JFK chose to intervene upon by sending military advisers (at first). The combat troops came after that. JimSukwutput23:40, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Sticking to the topic, I'm saying that when "actual troops", "combat troops", etc are sent, that might be notable. This is not. Nightw08:41, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Missed the point completely. This IS notable precisely because the Vietnam debacle began with military advisers. Some of us can remember and have learnt from history. HiLo48 (talk) 10:02, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
You're speculating about why the event might become notable in the future. That the Vietnam war begun with a deployment of military advisers does not then mean that all subsequent deployments of military advisers to other places are notable or that they will have the same results. Nightw14:24, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
I didn't say "all" - I said "often". And if you look at the historical evidence, that's a perfectly valid and verifiable statement, so it has nothing to do with WP:SPECULATION (a better term would be expectation, which there is no reason not to take into account on ITN). JimSukwutput19:00, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support per Sukwutput. The presence of American troops - regardless of their role - changes the military landscape significantly and comes substantial political symbolism. And as Sukwutput has noted, historically, such deployments have regularly led to more decisive developments. DeterenceTalk22:29, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Sukwutput may have "noted" that, but it is incorrect. The vast vast majority of advisor deployments don't result in any further U.S. military involvement. Geeze, do a little research every now and then, save yourself the embarassment. 24.159.22.26 (talk) 18:06, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose-ish Comment: The US has deployed its military in 150 countries, so I am not sure how significant the deployment alone is. As pointed out above, speculations that this might be prelude to something bigger are well, just speculations. So the arguments put forth so far aren't exactly convincing. But that said, I must concede that I am not entirely aware of the military equation on the ground and therefore, wouldn't comment on how decisive the presence of 100 advisors would be. Chocolate Horlicks (talk) 17:36, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
According to the linked article, only two of those deployments are listed as "combat zones" (though Pakistan and Columbia should arguably also be listed as a combat zone). Since this deployment is to an area with an active war, then I argue that it is exceptional enough to be mentioned ITN. Thue | talk18:16, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, I was just going to say, there's a big difference between having troops deployed (i.e. stationed in bases) in, for example, Germany, and sending in a fully combat-equipped force to become decidedly involved in an ongoing armed conflict, even if it's in an advisory role. Something like that is distinctly uncommon. Swarm18:21, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Thousands of Qantas passengers in Australia face further disruption and cancellation of flights as the airline's maintenance engineers go on strike. (SBS)
Nominator's comments: We posted some relatively minor stuff about Apple blocking sales of some unpopular tablet computers in the past. iPhone is Apple's biggest revenue generator and this launch is expected by some to be one of Apple's biggest product launches ever. Side note: how much longer until we get a featured picture on an iPhone? [4]? --MarcusQwertyus13:55, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. If all we can say is that Apple launches an updated version of an existing product line, then I don't think it rises to anywhere near ITN level. If it were the biggest launch ever for the company (or something like that) then I would reconsider. Dragons flight (talk) 14:06, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose - it's already out over here (Australia) so announcing it now a) sounds like an advert and b) is a bit US-centric (or anti-Australia, who cares). — Joseph Fox15:08, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
That's not true IMO. It was almost 100% clear that the iPad would at least be popular at its launch. It wasn't posted because many editors didn't want to post a product launch. I'm in favor of posting launches of potentially ground-breaking products but previous nominations have showed that consensus is against such items as they are seen as promotional; I wanted to nominate the Kindle Fire but didn't based on previous discussions.--Johnsemlak (talk) 10:29, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose It would have to be a truly exceptional new product to justify including a product-launch in the ITN - something along the lines of Ford starts selling jetpacks its alongside cars. Version X.0 of a product that has been around for years has WP:SNOW chance. DeterenceTalk18:35, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Comment I think people underestimate the impact of commercial technology. I'm no Apple fanboy, but the change in people's lives around the world because of smartphones like iPhone has been tremendous. The launch of the latest generation in this series is certainly more notable than the discovery of a piece of poetry or an obscure old athlete passing away. JimSukwutput18:51, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Agreed (ish), but I'm afraid I take a slightly more, well old school paternalistic view. Wikipedia has no commercial position in relation to our content per WP:NPOV. The purpose of Wikipedia, as a reference work, is presumably educational. The main body of the work is as an encyclopedia. The front page serves to attract readers to articles. Given that we have no commercial bias to promoting our work on apple phones or 14th century poets one could argue we should add more weight to obscure old athletes rather than an event that it being currently covered across numerous websites .... and to which Wikipedia will add no current value to the reader in terms of content. I'd also note, Jim, that if additional verses of Sir Gawain and the Green Knight or anything by Chaucer, let alone The Bard turned up you'd be looking rather silly with your above comments..... Pedro : Chat 20:03, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
This will be the last ITN nomination from me, hopefully for a very, very long time. I add it because there are new developments, and the story as a whole has been severely underreported relative to the human cost. - Tenebris 11:38, 14 October 2011 (UTC)
Oppose. Your report is almost a month old, and I don't see any recent news coverage to justify publishing this on ITN at this point. This news is too stale. Dragons flight (talk) 14:29, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oops. I doubled the line to put two sources, one blisteringly new (about the torrential rains), but only the older contextual one showed up in the template. I removed it for clarity and replaced the other one with something two weeks old but quite a bit broader. Btw - can I point out that this very much is still a news item, even a front page news item in most parts of the world? The story may not be a clean-cut single event such as "new iPhone released", but things are still getting significantly worse, not better. After all, over 60,000 children have already died, and continue to die at a rate of about six children every minute. Is this noteworthy enough? If you want to see coverage, just type "Horn of Africa" into your average Google news search and see how much comes up -- but clear your cookies first. Google now shows you news stories according to your past preferences, so if you have not clicked on this kind of story in a while, it won't come up at all now. - Tenebris 04:17, 15 October 2011 (UTC)
For once, something that already exists on Wikipedia. Note that there should be other names in that template (eg. people who worked on the European debt crisis article), but I don't know which ones would be appropriate. Also recommend that the European debt crisis be made an ITN sticky, probably through the rest of this month at a minimum. - Tenebris 02:13, 14 October 2011 (UTC)
Oops, I did that wrong. Here is the correct article link. - Tenebris 06:04, 14 October 2011 (UTC)
Support - Pending an update for the article (I don't see any as of this time.) May have to reword the blurb a bit, and I'd bold the 'European Debt Crisis' link to indicate the article in question, but I agree with this nomination as important and noteworthy for ITN. This is another big step downward for this crisis, in my view, and has serious implications for the global economy. Jusdafax06:10, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support after update - The European financial crisis is significant, and this is especially interesting because of Spain's past default. Mamyles (talk) 12:21, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. The European debt crisis is notable; the downgrading of one country's debt by one specific credit agency is not. This is clearly not comparable to the U.S.'s downgrading - the U.S. debt was long seen as completely risk-free, and was also much, much larger in size than Spain's (around 14 trillion vs. 0.8 trillion). 128.151.150.1 (talk) 17:37, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support While this is obviously not as notable as the credit downgrading of the USA, this is a significant milestone in the European Debt Crisis. Of course, we'll have to be rather more selective if the domino effect kicks-in upon the European countries. DeterenceTalk18:47, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
As Hut 8.5 said, this isn't really the first case. Spain and Italy were downgraded just last week by an equally notable credit agency. And all the countries at the periphery of the Eurozone has been receiving periodical downgrades since three years ago. Remember that there are more than ten different credit ratings for each agency. S&P has around 15. If you imagine there is a "point" system, this is something like going from 12 points to 11 points, in S&P's subjective point of view. If you think of it that way, this isn't really all that exciting.
Yes -- and the ITN silence at that time was deafening. Maybe the real question is, how many Eurozone country downgrades does it take to equal a single United States downgrade in noteworthiness? - Tenebris 04:15, 15 October 2011 (UTC)
There's a good way to see if this is actually consequential on its own (rather than purely symbolic) - judging the stock market reactions. IBEX shows that the Spanish stock exchange actually rose slightly today. JimSukwutput18:58, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Looking at the stockmarket is not a reliable way to judge the impact of an expected event. If the stockmarket knew it was coming (and they probably did), then the action was already priced into the stockmarket. For the same reason, you sometimes see the stockmarket rise after a company announces a yearly loss, because the stockmarket had expect the loss to be even worse, and had already priced the worse news in. Thue | talk19:17, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Precisely. If it was expected (which I claim it was) then there is no or little reaction. And the fact that it is expected tells us something about its noteworthiness. Of course, there are events that are expected which deserve posting, for example if they are the culmination of a long process and we haven't yet posted anything about such a process. But that isn't the case here. This is just a small symbolic part of the general fiscal crisis in the Eurozone. JimSukwutput01:25, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
The fact that it was expected by banking insiders tells us little about its noteworthiness; as you argue, unexpectedness is not really an ITN criteria. Using credit rating downgrades as reportable milestones makes sense; when else should we report a steady erosion of finances? I would say that credit ratings are a very central part of the sovereign debt crisis; the problem is unsustainable sovereign debt, and credit ratings are the way to measure them. Spain and Italy are the central countries in this crisis, because they are by far the biggest countries in trouble, and the hardest to bail out because of their size. So featuring their downgrades ITN especially makes sense. Thue | talk01:52, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
(cough) Besides, many of us also saw the United States rating downgrade coming. That did not seem to get in the way of its ITN noteworthiness. - Tenebris 04:15, 15 October 2011 (UTC)
But these aren't really milestones. As I said, there are multiple credit rating agencies (3 major ones) and each one has more than 10 different possible ratings. If we post each downgrade for the major economies in crisis (Spain, Italy, Greece, and other peripheral nations in the Eurozone), that would make up half the entries on ITN. JimSukwutput05:05, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
I agree that we shouldn't post downgrades from each of the three rating agencies, and we should mostly only post for the big, significant countries. Bit I would still like to post some of them. Since we didn't post Moody's downgrade, then perhaps we can post this one. Thue | talk20:30, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Usually (but not always), the first of any given kind is a psychological threshold, making it easier for others to follow suit. If a notable first is somehow missed on ITN and the notability is sustained, I would suggest that noting the next major threshold might be appropriate. By the way, several of the European Wikis have the Euro economic crisis as an ITN sticky. Considering its continuing considerable impact on stock markets worldwide and the IMF's world recessionary outlook on the same basis, the same might be appropriate here. - Tenebris 06:32, 16 October 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.254.157.247 (talk)
I'd agree with a sticky, though I think the article needs some significant improvement before we put it on the main page. For example: "there has also been a sense of unjust crisis management which mostly stems from the notion that, as a direct consequence of the financial crisis, the working population should not be held responsible for the economic mismanagement errors of economists, investors, and bankers...". The citation was a BBC News report, which said nothing of this sort and merely mentioned the grievances of a few interviewed protestors. The rest is completely made up by whoever wrote that. I have no comment on whether I agree or disagree with the assessment, but we need actual evidence before we attribute these ideas to all the disaffected populations of these countries. This may sound like nitpicking, but it's one of the many OR/NPOV problems with the article. JimSukwutput18:54, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Just, say, two or three more nominations after this, and then I fade back into the woodwork. I only aim here to suggest major story directions for what was looking increasingly to be a stagnant ITN section. A bit amazed that no one has nominated this story yet. - Tenebris 01:29, 14 October 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.254.156.169 (talk)
Updated the template with the broader article, in part because I suspect both won't survive independently on English Wikipedia. - Tenebris 05:58, 14 October 2011 (UTC)
Comment - two things - Please don't use a username you're not editing as, and please ensure a suitable article actually exists before you nominate stuff here. (I note you have linked to another since I typed this.) — Joseph Fox06:00, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Second point first, I did not understand that when I started. This is new to me, and you will notice I have been remedying. As to the first point, I don't have and will not have a Wikipedia account, for reasons you will be familiar with if you follow the main page talk page. This is the only user name I edit with. You will also see me on other article talk pages under the same name. New articles are, however, off limits to me. As a determined IP (but nevertheless not an anonymous IP), I can only correlate and improve, never create from scratch. - Tenebris 06:09, 14 October 2011 (UTC)
In fact, you can create from scratch - but you will be forced to use the articles for creation process. However, the sheer volume of your nominations to this page makes it a little strange to me that you would not create an account; it would certainly make backing up your nominations with articles (as is necessary for this section) a hell of a lot easier. — Joseph Fox07:16, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Aw man, I just welcomed the user not realizing that it was an IP address. And the user actually exists (created back in 2006), so I didn't realize it was a different user. Can we manually replace the user name with the IP address so that people don't get confused? hbdragon88 (talk) 07:25, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry to have caused confusion, Hbdragon88. Further confusion -- I too have been around Wikipedia for far too many years. (I consider it one of the Internet's most hopeful projects.) Yet further confusion -- my IP changes. (Ye Olde Dial-up, plus multiple different computers. At one point, I even overlapped with a banned user.) I do promise that if I comment on a talk page, it will always be by this name, followed by the five tildes which give time and date. I also read the relevant IP page -- but honestly, user talk pages are one of the things I don't like so much about Wikipedia.
Thank you for the information on how to create articles, Joseph Fox -- I may just take advantage of that one at some point! (But probably not soon. Currently, nearly all of my available Wiki time is spent cleaning up and expanding existing articles.) I placed my name into the template by way of accepting responsibility for the nomination, not for credit. The current volume here is simply due to my frustration at watching the ITN page stagnate for so many days, while so much is happening in the way of significant and notable news. I have never done this before, and I truly hope never to have to do this again! As to creating an account to back up a nomination -- that cuts right to the heart of why I remain a determined IP without an account. It is one of Wikipedia's principles to allow open editing in nearly all things. Given that principle, should not nominations be judged solely by content, not by whether or not the nominator has a Wikipedia account? - Tenebris 07:57, 14 October 2011 (UTC)
Without willing to stretch this conversation out too far, I will admit I am of the opinion that those with accounts are generally more constructive and loyal to the website overall; I would wager that you, Tenebris, are among a very, very small percentage of constructive IPs on Wikipedia. The number of benefits that being a user gives you is, as you've been told, very long and most of them I believe you will find useful (for instance, receiving messages would be a hundred times easier on a fixed talk page, I'm sure, and the ability to track pages you're working on or interested in is a major plus) and, of course, the power to actually write articles is always a good one to have, especially if contributing to this page, one which often requires articles to be made from scratch. I won't lecture you any further; the work you're doing here is great, and I really, really hope that you elect to put these contributions under a handle in order to get the recognition they deserve. — Joseph Fox10:03, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Article updated The nominated event is listed on WP:ITN/R, so each occurrence is presumed to be important enough to post. Comments should focus on whether the quality of the article and update meet WP:ITNCRIT, not the significance.
support for such reasons as ITNR, MINority topic ad precednce as we cant be POV in the interest of globalising. (eve though the first addition was a crap chpice)Lihaas (talk) 00:53, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support. Article about the wedding seems good, but I'm not sure if I like the word "commoner" in the blurb (not that I have any better, alternate suggestions either). SpencerT♦C01:03, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Ready per ITN/R (note: I couldn't find this in the ITN/R list, could the nominator indicate where it is?). The article itself is clear and concise, which makes a nice change from most of the ITN/Rs we've seen lately. DeterenceTalk01:27, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support Article looks good, underrepresented area, I had heard about this young modernizing king before so maybe other reader will have too (and would be interested to hear of his marriage). Calliopejen1 (talk) 03:11, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Comment I know our policy on pics is kinda dependent on what is available but I'm not wild about the pic only having the groom in it, given that the event was a wedding. I'd rather have a pic related to another blurb for now.--Johnsemlak (talk) 14:18, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
I strongly agree with Johnsemlak regarding the picture. A wedding picture with just the groom seems inappropriate to the point of being disrespectful. DeterenceTalk18:48, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
I agree that the word 'commoner' may be dropped. If we have a suitable pic with the couple together, we can put that in ... but to me even otherwise, the current pic is fine: the news is after all about the King getting married - if he had married some other chick, thats still news. If Jetsun Pema married some other dude, it would not make the news (on the assumption that said dude is not a head-of-state equivalent) ... but yes, if we have a better pic with the two, then that should be posted instead of this. Chocolate Horlicks (talk) 19:15, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose - This is not significant enough to me, and I live in the United States. I don't believe it's internationally significant, especially since the outbreak has now ended and there were no exports. Mamyles (talk) 12:31, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose Agreed with Mamyles. 23 people after three months is hardly significant - consider the thousands succumbing to easily curable diseases in East Africa every day. It's not even the deadliest listeria outbreak in the U.S., and the U.S. is an extraordinarily safe country when it comes to food-borne illnesses. JimSukwutput
Support In the context of white-collar crime, this is a significant record. This story has enjoyed widespread media coverage. It is also rather noteworthy that "the longest sentence ever handed out for insider trading" is only 11 years. The article needs some work - there are only a couple of sentences about the conviction and the sentence. DeterenceTalk01:19, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Updated with a couple of extra sentences, including the other sentences in the case. - Tenebris 11:15, 14 October 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.254.157.129 (talk)
Posted I don't think the update is particularly stellar, but the timer is red and there is a decent level of background on the case (which should be under some consideration, due to the new guidelines), so I'm going with it. -- tariqabjotu23:19, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
I don't normally do this, but the global news has been much more intense than it would seem by the ITN section. So I will add a few stories, both from the anglosphere and around the world, let the consensus go as it will. Please forgive if I slip up on the template structure -- somewhat new at this. - Tenebris 19:51, 13 October 2011 (UTC)
Thank you. (And for future reference -- where was it?) - Tenebris 20:53, 13 October 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.254.156.239 (talk)
Oppose when local governments in the US enter receivership, they are run financially by a federal Judge, which is very rarely substantially different than how they were being run, except for some layoffs and extra work for those who remain. Dualus (talk) 20:36, 13 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, just a single brief comment. As a simple civic bankruptcy, this is not an exceptional story. Symbolically, however, the fact that Harrisburg happens to be a United States state capital crosses a significant line. There won't be an equivalent bankruptcy moment until a world-class city or an entire state or country goes bankrupt, if one does at all. (I would say keep an eye on Greece, but WP:CRYSTAL.) - Tenebris 21:09, 13 October 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.254.156.239 (talk)
How often does something like this occur? It didn't show up on the front page on Drudge (and before you berate me for using that as a news source, the primary reason I use it is as a litmus test on how sensational a news story is).--WaltCip (talk) 22:49, 13 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
CommentChapter 9 has a partial list of municipal bankruptcies. I agree that Harrisburg being the capital of Pennsylvania makes this a much bigger deal, as most of the cities listed are not capitols. However, would we just update the Harrisburg page or create a separate Bankruptcy of Harrisburg article? "Bankruptcy of" articles are very uncommon; I only see two, that of Lehman Brothers and General Motorshbdragon88 (talk) 02:02, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose "Old man dies of old age" isn't exactly striking. Very limited interest subject, and something akin to the death of Al Davis earlier this week. That notable people occasionally die is not remarkable in and of itself. Resolute13:05, 13 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support If you had to make a list of the ten most influential computer programmers Ritchie would surely be on that list. Although most sources credit Unix primarily to Thompson there is no doubt as to Ritchie's contribution to it and yes he was the main player for C. This is a figure who created what is still a maajor programming language. Newer languages deliberately copy much of C (C++, Java, PHP etc): if you include those Ritchie-influenced languages account for well over 90% of current software development. He was instrumental in building a research operating system that was the first to showcase many new ideas and is still a major player over 40 years after its first release. He is LILP listed, and all this more than meets the second death criteria for posting. As for the comments that computer science is a narrow, fringe field: I doubt it is as fringe as suggested, and in any case that is not a criteria. If it was we wouldn't post anyone except popstars, actors and politicians. Where was this argument when we posted Steve Jobs? In the long term Ritchie's contribution will doubtless be assessed as much greater. Crispmuncher (talk) 13:59, 13 October 2011 (UTC).[reply]
Support. Per Crispmucher. Though the death was due to old age, while alive, he was one of the most notable and respected computer programmers. Lynch714:21, 13 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support perhaps being in computer field i'm biased but C is basically the building block of computers as we know it so he is definitly one of the most notable people in his field of exptertise. He may not generate the amount of media frenzy that Steve Jobs did but that might be one of the reason he is better suited for ITN. -- Ashish-g5514:37, 13 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support - As mentioned above, C is the building blocks of modern computers. Every system, including Linux, Windows, and Mac, primarily uses C. While his death isn't surprising, it is notable enough to be mentioned. Mamyles (talk) 14:41, 13 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support per above. Contributing to the creation of C programming language, that marked a revolution in the computer science, is a very big deal. Probably not everyone has heard about him, but C with its upgrades is something scattered deeply in the other circles of knowledge.--Kiril Simeonovski (talk) 15:46, 13 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Why? Think on the answer from the viewpoint of a reader. Odds are that only a tiny minority will have any idea who he is, and this is a guy whose death will be front page news absolutely nowhere. Resolute15:56, 13 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose someone above made an "apples to oranges" comparison to Al Davis above. But let's compare to Steve Jobs as both are "tech guys." Jobs' death caused a pretty big public reaction and was news everywhere. Ritchie's hasn't and isn't getting much coverage. Hot Stoptalk-contribs15:58, 13 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose as while a significant person to the tech field, dying of old age is not necessary newsworthy unless he was a much more significant public figure. --MASEM (t) 16:15, 13 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
I don't see that myself. It is possibly a bit light on personal life but ultimately that is not of interest to most readers. The article is a good summary of what he is actually known for. Crispmuncher (talk) 16:36, 13 October 2011 (UTC).[reply]
Support A creator of the most widely used computer language of the last 50 years and Unix, widely used in may forms for decades. Far more worthy than Steve Jobs or Bill Gates (when he dies) Torqueing (talk) 16:46, 13 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose: the importance of an invention is not necessarily in proportion to biographical significance of the inventor. This is one of the cases where that lack of correlation means that the death of the individual is simply not a major news story. Kevin McE (talk) 16:54, 13 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
I agree he qualifies as a significant figure in the field, but the article is currently in bad shape, barely more than a stub nothing much about his death, and half the article sources are to an unencyclopedic "quotes" section. This article needs to gets fixed before posting in ITN. Secretaccount17:06, 13 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose - Significant person, but as Kevin said "importance of an invention is not necessarily in proportion to biographical significance of the inventor." Neutralitytalk17:48, 13 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Strong Support. Creator of the C language and co-creator of Unix, the lingua franca of computing. A computing pioneer, his influence is hard to overstate. -Halo (talk) 18:45, 13 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support Unix and C are seriously big deals in computing. Unix is the basis for the Mac, iPhone, Android as well as every Linux/Unix server in the business world (yes Linux isn't technically descended from Unix, but it uses the same ideas) - and C is one of the most influential programming languages in existence and it runs on almost every platform and other languages such as Java, C++ C# and Objective C - which, along with C, are used by a huge percentage of the worlds applications are descended from C.
With regards to Kevin's comment I thought ITN wasn't a breaking news service - but for those people who are fans of that idea I saw it posted on the BBC. -- Eraserhead1 <talk> 19:49, 13 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
I would not consider he second story on the Technology page, behind announcement if the date in 12 months time on which analogue TV broadcasting will finish in N Ireland, to be evidence of a major news story. Kevin McE (talk) 06:35, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Probably we looked at the page at different times and/or are from different places - the BBC changes its content regularly. Stating that I saw it linked from the front page does not mean that you were lying to advance your case - and not what I was saying at all. -- Eraserhead1 <talk> 15:22, 16 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
As above, only if you want proof that it is lower news priority that the switch off date for Northern Ireland's analogue TV signal (24 October next year, fwiw) Kevin McE (talk) 06:41, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
I thought the whole point of ITN was to cover news stories that haven't made as many global headlines. That I'm sure was the argument trotted out (probably by the same people who opposed this) when Amanda Knox was released from jail and made the front page of every news source in the world and got over 1.5 million views as it has been with every high profile event in the past. There is no reason ITN can't post high profile events like Amanda Knox' release from jail or Jobs' death, but if people are going to argue against them using the argument that coverage doesn't matter to turn around and say its super important for something else is poor form. -- Eraserhead1 <talk> 09:15, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Comment--people saying that Richie is more significant than Jobs need to take a step back I think. I'm not opposing on notability grounds but the notion that 'Jobs was posted, and this guy was more significant' doesn't work for me. Leaving out two key factors--Jobs' role in creating Pixar and the fact that he died just after the pinnacle of his career--Jobs was able to take all the bits and parts and made them into devices which influenced people's lives. He changed how people listen to music; he changed how people interface their computers, not to mention his impact on the animated film industry. His influence extends beyond the tech world into music, film, design, and people's lifestyles. I am not an apple fanboy--I've owned 6 mp3 players and not one Ipod; I've never owned a Mac or an Iphone. But I recognize the guy's influence. Again I'm not opposing on notability grounds; just saying that Jobs was more significant. I do oppose on article quality and update for the moment.--Johnsemlak (talk) 14:10, 14 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Frankly that argument seem not to appreciate Ritchie's achievements and contributions. OS X is derived from a system Ritchie created. The firmware of all Apple products are written in a language created by Ritchie or derived from it, as is Windows, MS Office etc. Jobs by his very nature was more high profile but at the end of the day his contribution was telling engineers what to make, and marketroids how to sell what had been made: his technical contributions were nil. Ritchie did not become a household name but that is not reason to underestimate his contribution: from a purely technical standpoint his contributions to Apple's own products was far greater than Jobs's ever was despite never having worked there. Quantumsilverfish (talk) 02:31, 15 October 2011 (UTC).[reply]
The article is not updated. The update is entirely unnotable specifics of his death, and a ridiculous line His death, which came a week after the death of Steve Jobs, did not receive as much media coverage. The update needs to contain substantial information beyond what the blurb would contain. If there's nothing to add, then perhaps it shouldn't be posted. I agree that there is a rough consensus here that he's notable enough but I recommend the 'ready' tag be removed until there's a suitable update.--Johnsemlak (talk) 05:18, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Token Oppose I know this is unlikely to change anything, but this discussion here shows how out of touch Wikipedians are. Yeah, maybe in the computer-saavy, nerdy bubble in which Wikipedia and Wikipedians reside, this guy and his innovations were earth-shattering, but the vast majority of people don't even know what C is, let alone who this guy is. C may be an important advancement in computer science, but Dennis Richie is not particularly notable on his own; after all, look at the size and nature of his article. I feel so strongly in this regard that I refuse to put this up on ITN myself. -- tariqabjotu20:34, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
I think his obituary was the most-read article on the New York Times the day he died, so he wasn't that obscure. Also, IMO we should discriminate between people like pop stars, who are just famous, and people who actually made a major technical contribution to society but are less famous. Thue | talk22:00, 15 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Quite. We need to be clear regarding the distinction between celebrity and notability - the former is not a consideration but the latter certainly is. In the case of pop stars, actors and even things like politics it is impossible to be successful without attracting fame and celebrity. In most other walks of life you can rise to the very top of that field and still remain fairly anonymous if that is what you choose, or you can choose a more media-facing role and gain a higher profile. Not choosing the latter path does not equate to a lack of notability. You only need to look at the number of comments on this story to gauge the level of interest: few stories gain so much interest. That itself is a demonstration of notability. I also question why Tariq felt the need to post this comment as to why he was not posting the story. Admins are volunteers and ultimately have not duty to do anything. However, to post a comment to the effect of "I can see the consensus on this one, but I don't like it and am not going to post it" strikes me as a bad attitude. If that's the way you feel you comment as a user or you shut up about the issue. You don't do something like that which could easily influence the next admin to come along. Crispmuncher (talk) 22:21, 15 October 2011 (UTC).[reply]
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