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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by R-41 (talk | contribs) at 18:58, 3 April 2012 (→You have been reported to a sock puppet investigation). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Moral universalism

Hi. I notice you made quite a few changes to the above article. WP has a settled policy against original research and for citing sources, and your changes make a number of contentious and unsupported claims (the suggestion that the UN declaration of human rights is really the opposite of moral universalism is both startling, and completely outside normal usage of the term, for instance). I've therefore reverted for the moment, but I'm happy to discuss at the article's talk page, if you like. Cheers, Sam Clark 13:50, 26 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Original research

This articles recent edits are original research and not connected to the subject by references or reliable sources [1] - Non-market economics. If you are interested in this subject please go to the discussion page for suggestions and ideas. Thanks. skip sievert (talk) 16:30, 21 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Economic freedom

Hello-I reverted your addition to the intro of Economic freedom. That article has seen a lot of contention, and so the material in it is (or should be) carefully referenced. So, if you want to add something on the socialist tradition of economic freedom, it should also be carefully referenced. CRETOG8(t/c) 15:42, 24 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Economics sidebar

Following discussion on the talk pages of the economics project, the sidebar does not have mention of economic systems/ideologies/schools. IMHO, it is too difficult to get consensus on inclusion criteria, as I noted in my edit summary reverting your good-faith edit. You should feel free to create a self-standing template of ideologies/schools/systems, if you'd like; I would encourage you to run such templates by the Economics Project talk page, for feedback.

Best regards,  Kiefer.Wolfowitz 23:43, 15 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Socialism Definition

Hi. I replied to your comment in the discussion on socialism. The distinction lies in whether we are discussing an "economic system" or an "economic theory." Same thing with how capitalism is treated. As is, the definition is of an economic system, implying that it actually exists. I know Marxist purists want to keep "socialism" as a term for themselves, but this is socialism as a theory described by Marx. Socialism as an economic theory and as term coined by Marx is already noted in the bullet/header of the article and has a link to that article. -Nelbev (talk) 16:20, 12 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hello Nelbev. I think you are confused about the definition of socialism; first of all, Marx never clearly defined socialism, he only recognized certain parameters that would distinguish socialism from capitalism (any system structured around the accumulation of capital, profit and private property). The fundamental distinction, shared by all socialists save for modern social democrats and some confused proponents of market socialism, is that socialism entails some form of co-operative property structure and production is carried out for use directly. This is by no means a narrow definition, as there is literally hundreds of different institutional configurations socialism can take given these parameters (just as we see many different variations of capitalism under the parameters I noted above). However, if you are looking for a definition of socialism as an economic system that already exists, you would have to go with the neoclassical and Austrian definition of socialism, which defines it primarily as an economic system where economic planning displaces market coordination in the allocation of economic inputs and capital. Under this definition, socialism refers specifically to the economies of the Soviet Union and its satellite states (because no other modern economies have substituted market allocation with planning, although some Western mixed economies complement market allocation with indirect planning). But if you examine the definitions closely, you will notice that the neoclassical / Austrian definition actually refers to a slightly different (and far more specific) concept than the socialist, anarchist and Marxist definition of socialism. Both deserve mention. Battlecry (talk) 22:14, 14 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]
I posted a response to your comment in that section. Here is a copy of what I posted: You are confusing socialist politics (a political ideology and movement) with socialist economics (a group of theoretical or hypothetical future economic systems). First off, Sweden and Norway have been governed by social democratic parties and have implemented a range of policies to benefit their constituents. Granted, some believed these reforms would eventually and gradually pave the way toward a socialist system, while democratic socialists tended to believe they could not achieve socialism by themselves but were worth supporting in the interim. Regardless of ones position, these policies are not the same thing as socialism (which has a specific, technical definition); for example, when the Republicans come to power in the United States, their policies do not (and rightly so) define Republicanism. Furthermore, different socialist political movements have different strategies for achieving socialism - had a Leninist Communist or an anarcho-syndicalist party taken power in Sweden, their path to building socialism would have been radically different from the social democrats. Their policies, again, would not define socialism as an economic system. Secondly, you claim that the following line implies Marx's labor theory of value: "accounting is based on physical quantities of resources, some physical magnitude, or a direct measure of labor-time". This is incorrect; there is a list of three different means for quantifying resources and use-values, the last of which is the (mis)application of Marx's concept socially-necessary labor time to a hypothetical socialist economy. While personally I don't agree with that particular position, it is worth mentioning along with the other accounting mechanisms because it is and has been a major proposal for socialist economic systems, particularly by anarchists, cooperative market socialists and syndicalists. Thirdly, you are correct in claiming that the lead clearly defines the property-rights structure of socialism. Again, it lists a range of different possible configurations property rights over the MoP can take under socialism: public (state) ownership, common ownership (free access) and independent cooperatives. All of these configurations are very different from each other, and aside from common ownership, cooperatives and public enterprises do not in any way exclude market coordination. The various proposals for market socialism typically includes a mixture of cooperatives and public enterprises operating in a free-market economy - so your point that the given definition excludes market socialism or market coordination is moot. Fourth, the reason why the given definition does not appear to exist in reality is precisely because socialism has not yet existed on a large scale. All of the world's economies operate under the laws of capital accumulation and seek to generate a financial profit; most are dominated by private enterprises. Unless you are defining socialism as the system that existed in the Soviet Union and other Communist-run states, which is debatable itself, socialism has not existed on a large scale to date. As per capitalism, the United States (and Sweden for that matter) fits the definition of capitalism: the means of production are almost entirely privately-owned, and enterprises compete to generate a profit. I hope this clarifies the issue for you. Battlecry (talk) 22:14, 14 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

August 2011

Thank you for your contributions to Wikipedia. Before saving your changes to an article, please provide an edit summary for your edits. Doing so helps everyone understand the intention of your edit (and prevents legitimate edits from being mistaken for vandalism). It is also helpful to users reading the edit history of the page. Thank you. bodnotbod (talk) 09:21, 31 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

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Free market (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver)
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Battlecry are you using the account User:Rocketman116

Battlecry the account Rocketman116 like you also supports the technocracy movement. It is acceptable to use multiple accounts provided that they are not used for abusive sock puppetry, however Rocketman116 said "I agree with Battlecry". I will admit that fact that both you and Rocketman116 support this rather obscure and unknown movement does look suspicious to me. Whether or not you are using the account - it may be a coincidence that you and that user both believe in the technocracy movement - I am still going to bring it up with administrators, I am informing you of this so that you are aware.--R-41 (talk) 18:13, 3 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

You have been reported to a sock puppet investigation

I have looked over your edit history and that of Rocketman116, it seems clear to be that you are the sock master of the sock puppet Rocketman116 that you are using in abusive manner by pretending that Rocketman116 is a different user. You have been reported for sock puppet investigation here: [2].--R-41 (talk) 18:58, 3 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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