Talk:Abdication

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Abdication

I'd really appreciate it if others who have worked on this would add their references to the References section. I almost randomly stumbled on this; I have no clue what references have already been fully exploited, and it would be a real waste to duplicate someone's research. -- Jmabel 07:01, Jul 20, 2004 (UTC)

Most of the current monarchs of Europe are expected to resign sometime in the future. The era in which monarchs ruled until death may be over soon. Can we have some references or even justification for this remark? -- Perey 21:15, 13 Nov 2004 (UTC)

I can't work it out either. Queen Elizabeth II and the Pope will almost definitely not abdicate. I'm not sure of a precedent for Spain, Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Bhutan, Nepal, Bahrain, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, Qatar and Oman. Belgium doesn't have a recent precedent either (Léopold was an exceptional case, just as Edward VIII was an exceptional case in the UK). Jacques Chirac will not resign as co-prince of Andorra (though I don't know about the Bishop of Urgell). On the other hand, the Netherlands, Luxembourg, Liechtenstein and Cambodia do have recent precedent, as does one of Swaziland and Lesotho (I can't remember which) and there have been rumours that Prince Rainier III of Monaco may abdicate in favour of Prince Albert. So I make the W-L-? result 14.5-5-1.5. Time for that remark to be consigned to oblivion, methinks. Also the paragraphs preceding it are a load of claptrap too:) jguk 21:50, 13 Nov 2004 (UTC)

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Why only Crowned Heads?

Hi. From your list of abdicated persons it is clear that abdication refers to a crowned head of state. But in the text it is not so clear. We don't speak of the abdication, but resignation, of the head of a republic. Maybe this could be tidied up. And maybe someone could find out out when the word came to apply only to monarchs (and Popes too). Cheers.--Gazzster 01:09, 14 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The lead paragraph says (and has said for some time), "The term commonly applies to monarchs. A similar term for an elected or appointed official is resignation." How can we be clearer than that? - Jmabel | Talk 02:23, 17 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I made the distinction on de.wikipedia.org (Abdikation vs. Rucktritt) and was smacked down because it's held to be implicit that only the crown can abdicate and there's no need to mention that it's resignation otherwise. Abdication is implicit when the monarchy is abolished unless there is a challenge from the crown in which case it becomes a pretender. In the recent case in Nepal the crown signed an instrument of abdication several days after the monarchy was abolished without pretense. 74.78.162.229 (talk) 17:43, 9 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

It should not be seen as an abdication unless it was formally done PRIOR to a monarchy being abolished. If it was done after the fact, it would be seen as legally pointless and only effect members of the former royal family should it ever be restored. That-Vela-Fella (talk) 14:31, 14 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Edward II

Should Edward II be included on the list? He was forced to abdicate, like Richard and others. DanTrent (talk) 17:16, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Inclusion of Pope Benedict XVI

Although the pope is a monarch, he is an elected one, and canon law and Vatican documents uniformly refer to resignation rather than abdication. (And indeed, our own article is called "papal resignation".) Hence, I think it's inappropriate to list Benedict XVI or other popes as having abdicated, the same way we wouldn't say Richard Nixon abdicated. Knight of Truth (talk) 21:46, 11 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

It's an arguable point. He resigned the See of Rome. Canon Law deals with the office of Bishop of Rome and makes no mention of the temporal state. Therefore he could be said to have abdicated the government of the Vatican State. Being an elected makes no difference. There's little comparison to Nixon, as the President of the US governs in the name of the People and is democratically accountable to them. The Pope claims to govern in the name of Jesus Christ and is accountable to no-one,Gazzster (talk) 21:15, 13 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I think that this matter needs further discussion. Up until 1870 Head of Church was also Head of Church State in Italy, after 1870 Pope is not a monarch per se - as he is only a head of organized religion. I don't think that if for example (randomly chosen example not meant to offend anyone) Dalai Lama will resign it will be referred as abdication (even that he was a head of state in Tibet and remains it in exile). Migatu (talk) 23:37, 13 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]