User talk:Lawyer2b

Welcome!

Hello, Lawyer2b, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you have any questions, check out Wikipedia:Ask a question or ask me on my talk page. Again, welcome!

-- MicahMN | μ 15:09, 22 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Re:Wikipedia:Miscellaneous deletion/User talk:Rex071404/Liberal Editors Cabal

Hi, I noticed your vote on there and saw some your edits and wanted to let you know a few things

Your vote might not be counted since you're a new voter(i'll paste the template below)
You should take a look atWP:CIVIL,WP:WQT, WP:NOT,WP:NPOV and WP:NPA. You had one foot in breaking the third example at WP:NPA, and from scanning some of your edits and edit summaries, you'll probably put the other foot in fairly soon at this rate. If you don't follow those guidelines and others and continue on the subjective advocacy path you currently seem to be on, you'll probably follow a long line of right and left wing extremists such as our friend Rex there as well as Silverback, Ultramarine, Bigdaddy777 and -Ril- who recieved long and potentally permanent bans from Wikipedia.
I'm a Liberal and I also voted keep, not because I found that page to have any merit(the content is irrelevant on there), but because precedent on similiar pages was in favor of that page not being deleted, and if a page like that is deleted, I assume that anyone looking to violate WP:POINT will try to delete one of my user pages as some kind of vendetta for something arbitrary.

Personally, from your animosity towards Liberalism, I don't understand how your brand of Libertarianism differs from Conservatism, since most Libertarian advocates I know outside of Wikipedia consider Libertarianism half Liberal and half Conservative, just like on the Nolan Test. However, that's a discussion for another time, because here on Wikipedia, you're a Wikipedian first regardless of whatever your political beliefs are. A good person to talk to on this would be MONGO; he's on the right and i'm on the left, but I think he's a far better Wikipedian than many on the left, and in the end that's all that counts.

Here's the template, please feel free to contact my talk page with any more questions. Karmafist 06:25, 22 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Welcome, Lawyer2b! I noticed that you placed a vote on Wikipedia:Miscellaneous deletion/User talk:Rex071404/Liberal Editors Cabal. Participation in the community is encouraged, of course, but your status as a brand new user means that your vote might not be counted. Please understand that this is a common practice on Wikipedia, and that it is necessary to prevent deliberate misuse of our voting systems. Straw polls on Wikipedia are meant to measure community consensus, and should not necessarily be taken as literal one-member one-vote voting. However, please do make further contributions to Wikipedia, and express your opinion on policy matters.

Wow!

I must say, i'm really impressed at your edits after the letter there, they exemply WP:AGF. Good job, my friend! I just have this feeling that you're going to make a kickass Wikipedian, and i'm glad I wrote that letter there.

I don't know if I'll hit on all the points of your response, but i'll try..

The "New Voter" thing I believe is an unwritten rule, due mostly to sockpuppets, but also due to new voters not having a complete grasp of Deletion Policy, although most users never completely understand it since like real life law, Wikipedia law is constantly evolving. The best thing to do there is understand Wikipedia is a Sociocracy and not a Majoritarian Democracy and focus on non-ad hominem votes and comments. You're probably just past the boundary of "New Voter" --it's around 50 usually, but that's not an exact rule, as with most of the "unwritten rules". Even the actual guidelines aren't enforced by the letter alot of the time, and then there's WP:IAR, which can be awfully confusing at first. I've been around the block a few times(I went over 3,300 edits today), so don't be afraid to ask for advice.

As for the hatred thing, i've seen it all to frequently on both sides, and it disgusted me, along with alot of other things, last year when I was a volunteer/paid canvasser during the presidential campaign and ran for state rep. Desperation and a feeling of disempowerment can cause that, trust me, i've seen the correlation during my time as a Red Sox fan. ;-) I wish someday that I could become a higher level politician and try to change that sense of polarization that we've got in this country right now, but my career is in the toilet and it's beginning to look like it's not feasible.

Oh yeah, have you seen [Political Compass.com? It's basically a better version of that Nolan Test link you sent me(I always score around the edge of Libertarian and Liberal on those)

Your vote counts !

Here is another opportunity to vote on a topic that likely interests you: Talk:Stolen Honor#RfC re scope of this article

Rex071404 ^{216.153.214.94} 17:58, 25 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Hello

Regarding User_talk:Sam_Spade/Theoretical_Biases#Buddy_List, we have Wikipedia:Trust network, but its not really in use. If you'd like to get in touch w me I'm very accessable, and glad to try to help or discuss or whatever. Incidentilly, I'm not a Libertarian, but I like them alot, and have voted libertarian more than once, w the idea that if nothing else, they arn't going to oppress me! Drop a note @ User talk:Sam Spade sometime, Cheers,

Sam Spade 00:42, 26 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

You're a re-run

Just so you know (FreePeopleAreHappyPeople (talk · contribs) + LegalBreifs (talk · contribs)) / (DavidsCrusader (talk · contribs))² = (Lawyer2b (talk · contribs)), seriously, try the mime next time, or the wiki cowboy, far less over played choices--64.12.116.9 17:44, 26 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not quite sure how to respond to your post except to say you basically copied the same thing from Wikipedia:Miscellaneous deletion/User talk:Rex071404/Liberal Editors Cabal where I replied beforehand. I'm not a sockpuppet, what can I say? (shrug) But please let me know to whom I belong. I'd love to meet other libertarian non-sockpuppets. :-) -- Lawyer2b 01:20, 28 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

What part of the mime is funnier aren't you understanding, oh and welcome back after your 3 month vaccation, always nice to meet a not-sockpuppet--172.129.152.98 05:07, 24 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for the welcome back. Hurricane Wilma wreaked havoc down here and created a back-loaded semester so I just haven't had the time to edit that much. Regarding the mime, I don't get that at all so please do explain. :-) Lawyer2b 05:14, 24 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Black Box (band)

Hi Lawyer2b. With regard to you edit on the above article, is the "good percentage of that song" quotation taken from the website referenced immediately after it? I couldn't find the quote on that site and it sounds odd to me - wouldn't it me more likely to be something like "a good percentage of the earnings/royalties from that song"? Regards, CLW 17:47, 13 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

CLW: I thought there might be some question and considered mentioning his lawyer's name, Patrick McNamara. I just added it so hopefully it will be easier for someone to find the direct quote, which I think I quoted correctly. His attorney probably didn't use the word "earnings/royalty" because in his world, it's so obvious it goes without saying but I understand your questioning it. :-) Lawyer2b 18:06, 13 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

In that case, given that there isn't yet a source for the direct quote, I'll remove the quote marks (and reword) so that it doesn't look like a direct quote. CLW 18:12, 13 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I'm confused. You say there isn't a direct source for the direct quote but I just gave it: his attorney, Patrick McNamara. If you go to www.danhartman.com and click on the "Patrick McNamara" link there is a page of comments that appear to be typed by Patrick McNamara himself. On that page is the direct quote, "After much negotiation, Dan ended up with a good percentage of that song." Let me know if this satisfies the source requirement. Lawyer2b 18:19, 13 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I said there wasn't a source ("yet"), because at the time I wrote my previous comment, your most recent comment was that you thought it was quoted correctly and you hadn't been able to find the quote ("it will be easier for someone to find the direct quote"). Now, subsequent to my previous comment, you've found the source. Hope that clears up the confusion!

However, I still think the quote should be replaced with my paraphrasing of it - as pointed out above, it sounds odd because it's grammatically incorrect (they would have given Hartman a percentage of the earnings, not a percentage of the song), and could therefore be potentially confusing for users, particularly if English isn't their first language. CLW 18:52, 13 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

When I typed, "I think I quoted it correctly", I was trying to be gentle because I didn't want to come across as, "I quoted it correctly. Dammit." But I can see how it could've been seen as, "I'm not sure if I quoted it correctly." I can also see how that led you to interpret my saying, "it will be easier for someone to find the direct quote", to mean, "I hadn't found it yet", when in fact I just meant it would be easier for others to find the direct quote as I had already. Sorry. Let me just say that I did find the quote and knew what I was quoting before I ever edited the Block Box entry in the first place.

I guess I see what you're saying regarding the wording. I happen to like how his lawyer put it, as its colloquial, but since wikipedia is unfortunately not about what I think sounds cool but rather making things easy for people to understand, if you change it as you see fit you'll get no objection from me. ;-) Lawyer2b 19:20, 13 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Cool - looks like we now understand one another! And you could always add the colloquial quote to the article's talk page if you think it will be of interest to others. Regards, CLW 19:31, 13 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]
An excellent suggestion! :-) Lawyer2b 19:33, 13 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Right to Work
Sorry for the delay, I added my two cents in there, mostly just some guidelines from things i've seen in the past. Let me know if I can help out more. karmafist 00:54, 26 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Re: Right-to-Work
Thanks for your interest in my view. I have to admit I was suprised, I guess I have gotten used to.. losing! (: I wrote about my opinion on Talk:Right-to-work.
Re: Hi, fellow Anarchocapitalist who supports conservative ideas!
Thanks for adding the AnarchCap userbox to my userpage. The only one I could locate was the one that said "This user is an Anarcho-capitalist pig-dog," which I felt was inappropriate. Where did you find the UN stinks one? And the legalize all drugs one? Oddly, my userpage is now protected, and I can't figure out how or why. Also, I'd appreciate your support at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:Userboxes#Suggestion_for_Incorporation_into_Wikipedia_Rules_Regarding_Removal_of_Graphics_from_Userbox_Templates and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_%28policy%29#Suggestion_for_Incorporation_into_Wikipedia_Rules_Regarding_Removal_of_Graphics_from_Userbox_Templates. Thanks!
MSTCrow 00:51, 2 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Also, I suggest adding your custom tags (Anti-UN, Anti-ACLU, Legalize All Drugs) to the appropriate userbox categories.
MSTCrow 18:49, 2 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hey there :)
I just wanted to say that I loved your Anti-ACLU tag. Nice work! Robert Paveza 18:12, 3 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Templates
I undeleted them until the Deletion Review is over one way or another. Tony will basically destroy anything he doesn't like, regardless of what policy he has to ignore. It's Ironic, the ACLU would probably be the first people to protect the Anti-ACLU userbox. karmafist 06:59, 11 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
That's pretty much all they do from the people I know who have worked with them, but eh, no biggie. I have way to many things to care either way.

Thank you for your kind words, my friend. If there's one thing I can't stand, it's tyranny, whether it's tyranny of the individual or the community. Without some basic procedure, we're left with anarchy, which i've seen as almost invariably devolving into a tyranny of the strong over the weak(what Wikipedia is fast becoming), which is perhaps the worst kind of tyranny. Unfortunately, it's tough when it seems like a bunch of people are ganging up on you whenever you have an opinion, citing some drivel somewhere. I don't know how much longer I can keep this up, I have three jobs now, and many parts of Wikipedia make me sick to look at nowadays. karmafist 14:43, 11 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Thank You, My Friend
My despair was EATEN BY A BEAR!
I know it might sound corny, but if it weren't for a few things, yourself being one of them, I'd probably be dead after the last few weeks(It wasn't just Wikipedia). One day this country will be able to get past labels like "Liberal" or "Conservative" or whatever and just respect each other while trying to follow the most pragmatic path, but until then, thanks for letting me know that there's people out there who think i'm worth keeping around. Karmafist 03:46, 20 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
sure!
Hi, thanks for your nice grace note! Sure of course you can use anything from my page, don't need to ask. Herostratus 05:34, 20 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Helping Hand
I still think of myself as a Wikipedia newbie, even though it is over 6 months since I joined. However, I have had some lapses of almost 2 months when I might only sign on once a week and just contribute a small amount to the RD, no time for anything else. I recognize that different people on Wikipedia have different sense of value for various aspects of support for community of people mutually helping learning curves at getting better at presenting information into the ultimate encyclopaedia, so that my effort to make my user page combine lots of info with a pleasingly good appearance, as not being good bang for WP buck, since I am so slow to learn how to apply that aquired know-how to encyclopaedia articles.
Your user page impressed me because you had researched many places worth remembering the links. My watch page has growing volume of places I want to remember exist. I had been contemplating moving some of that to a secondary page off of my user space, like the archives, but it is easy to lose track of what we have for what purposes, even with WP links. Since I am still learning here, I feel honored that you have asked me to soup up your user page appearance. User:AlMac|^(talk) 19:25, 20 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Cyberlaw project
Given your user signature here, you might find some interest in exploring links from this page.
Also --Tantalum T] told me about WikiProject Law andWikiProject International law, which may also be of interest to you, assuming you are involved in the law, and depending on your speciality there. User:AlMac|^(talk) 19:33, 20 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Notice the sysop of the Harvard Wiki appears to be the same User:Sj who started the Cyberlaw project. After I signed up to help it, and suggested some ideas on the talk pages, I said hello to the other folks who had signed up before me, and I was encouraged by Sj, in a way that I interpreted as an invitation to help out in a variety of ways. I hope I have not been a kiss of participation death, since I not seen anyone else from WP contributing after I joined. One thing I learned from The Harvard Wiki is it is easy to lose track of secondary pages that I might create, since WP not seem to come with an easy way to locate all of them again, unless I create and maintain links as I create them.
For example, I might remember I created pages like these, but forget where I placed them.
next bottlenecks

Educators who set bad examples

Internet users false expectations

News stories relevant to topics mentioned in the law school classes
etc. User:AlMac|^(talk) 20:43, 20 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I also stumbled over Wikipedia:Association of Members' Advocates which is like an ACLU for Wikipedians. If some editor feels overwhelmed with preceived bullying, or unfair treatment, they can ask for an advocate to make sure their case is fairly considered. Again, you may be well aware of some stuff I am sharing, but I just thought since your sig here has "lawyer" embeded, and I figure "2b" means you are on a path to lawyering, this might also interest you.

User:Alex756 has shown up a couple places as being someone who perhaps is deserving of a barnstar.
First Coordinator of the above advocates organization, resigning on Martin Luther King Day to inspire election of successor.

Wikipedia registered as a Trademark thanks to this user.
Thanks for touching up my user page. User:AlMac|^(talk) 20:57, 20 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Userboxes
Oh go on! You know you want to! :) --Tony Sidaway|Talk 09:50, 25 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The ACLU and the United Nations
Why do i not support the UN and ACLU?
UN - I outright HATE the united nations becuase all they do is fart around and do nothing, while genocides happen (Rwanda, Kosovo, Liberia, Congo/Republique Democratique du Congo (Formerly Zaire). They let millions die while sitting on their tushies.
Keep in mind: in 1949, NATO was created BECAUSE the UN was already too idiotic to get anything done. That was when the UN was just 4!
The ACLU: it does nothing to defend other minorities, other than blacks and jews. Chinese, latinos, arabs/muslims, hindus, native americans, and so on, are hardly, IF EVER, defended by this organization.
Other than those two reasons, i do support them. They just need a major overhaul.
Raccoon Fox 21:33, 26 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
thank you for defeding the truth
thak you, for sticking up for real Amercians, as few of us as there are on wikipedia
Category:Real Americans
Hi
Sorry, but I live in Jacksonville, which is on the northeast. --Revolución (talk) 22:14, 29 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Liberal POV?
From your user page:
I look at this picture and forget all about the liberal POV on wikipedia. (sigh) Ahhhhhhhhhhhh. :-)
If you think Wikipedia has a liberal "POV" it might just be because as a whole the world is a lot more "liberal" than the narrow spectrum you see in America. Regardless, I don't think this polemical statement is appropriate at it can only lead to unpleasantness. --Cyde Weys 16:25, 30 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Dear Mr. Liberal Troll above, I assure you that America is far more conservative than what your immediate neighborhood in Kalifornistan would lead you to believe. Yes, Wikipedia, like the internet in general, is overrun by liberals and liberal POVs. I am used to it, but denial is so blatantly stupid, it is almost offensive. Welcome to middle America, and enjoy your coffee. Thank you and good night, --PistolPower 19:30, 11 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I very much like what Lawyer2b's says about liberal POV and I think Psitolpower is right about cydeweys being a liberal troll. --UNK 11:19, 26 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]
LOL
LOL thx. I thought that would disappear into the void and never be seen... Perhaps you'll appreciate the addition of the "diagram needed" template here... Herostratus 06:41, 1 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]
GROUP HUG!!!!
Lol. Don't ask. Hey did you see my revision to the diagram over at Talk:Cum fart. A slight improvement I think... I wonder if I should nominate it for picture of the day... Herostratus 01:37, 9 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Response
I have responded to you in the discussion about the template. --Revolución (talk) 22:14, 9 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]
your comments
Hey there, I don't appreciate the comments you directed at me on Talk:Cum fart. Thanks. AnAn 01:15, 10 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Its ok, I just wanted to mention it rather than to let it stew. AnAn 03:46, 10 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]
help yourself
User:Mike McGregor (Can)/code page
you know which one you want... BTW, if you know how to link to a category to group like-minded users together, please modify...Mike McGregor (Can) 03:15, 11 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Just a fun userbox about deleating userboxes, I thought you might like it...Mike McGregor (Can) 06:20, 11 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]
"Template"
Please excuse, Lawyer2b, but may use the 'Anti-UN" 'user-box' upon my 'user-page?' (I apologise if I eavesdropped.)--Anglius 19:07, 11 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Mark Levin
Thanks for the kind words. Currently, the same anonymous vandal is intent on adding advertising links, POV and deleting any links to anything less than a Levin fan site, and then ranting about it ad nauseam on the Talk Page. It might be helpful if you stopped by the Talk Page to give your thoughts. Take care. Eleemosynary 18:49, 12 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The Seven Words
Thanks for the corrections! --Analogdemon (talk) 02:40, 15 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks, My Friend
I'm sorry I lost that e-mail -- I had a few more of those moments, but hell, I got through them. I just have to remember that the only person that can beat me is me. Oh, and I thought you'd get a kick out of this[1]If somebody can't make fun of themselves, they need to lighten up and drink a few beers, or for that matter, join a political party sponsored by beer ;-) Karmafist 04:16, 15 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Reinstating Template:User CCW
Hi. I believe you deleted Template:User CCW which stated "This user carries a concealed weapon in their home state, and is licensed to do so." When you deleted it, your edit summary said it was divisive. I would like to ask you reinstate it and reconsider its deletion as I do not feel it is "divisive" in the sense that is being used to justify deletion of many POV userboxes. Template:User CCW doesn't express a point of view -- it simply tells something about the user, namely that they are licensed to carry a concealed weapon and do so on a regular basis. Thank you. Lawyer2b 01:26, 8 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The "information" provided by this template is not valuable to the process of writing an encyclopedia. Furthermore, the possession of concealed firearms is a controversial topic throughout the world. Given the combination of these two facts, it is my conclusion that this template offers no positive value to Wikipedia, while at the same time creating the risk of a division within Wikipedia. (I can see no practical reason for an editor to declare this other than to express a political point of view, which is a highly disfavored purpose of a user page.) As such, it should not be allowed to exist. There is no reason why Wikipedia needs to provide a generic "warning sticker" for people to put onto their user pages for the purpose of making this declaration. Note also that this userbox would not be permitted under the proposed userbox policy as it fails to be "of benefit to creating an encyclopaedia".
Having considered your request, I feel compelled to refuse to grant it. You may, of course, include within the personal details on your user page the statement that you elect to carry a concealed weapon (in whatever format appeals to you), although I would discourage you from doing so as such statement carries no significant interest to editors of the encyclopedia. I would instead suggest that you declare an interest in firearms or perhaps expert knowledge about firearms; such information would be of use to Wikipedians who need assistance in editing articles about firearms or related topics. Kelly Martin (talk) 04:10, 8 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Clarence Thomas page
Hi. If you get a second, would you mind stopping by the Clarence Thomas Talk page? I'm in a dispute with a user over whether the fact that Thomas performed, at his home, Rush Limbaugh's third wedding should be mentioned in the article. I think it should. The other user does not. I'd appreciate your input. Thanks. Eleemosynary 02:44, 7 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]
cool pic
Awesome pic on your main page. imho, you should change your user box to say that you disagree with MOST of marx's ideas. For example, he said that "Machinery is knowledge objectified." or even the vast majority. TitaniumDreads 05:02, 12 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]
alack, i don't know anyone in south florida let alone hard core communists. For the record, i think the terms Socialism, Communism, Capitalism, Democracy are all utterly worthless. At least unless they are qualified to reflect their various flavors. example, to say the US has a freemarket system is horrendously vague. Do we promote enterprise? yes but heavily subsidize most industries to promote the public good which is decidedly not free and of course that's a very optimistic view, some cynics would say that's just cronyism. The same terminology and implementation problems persist for democracy, socialism etc.

Also, what have you read by him? imho, he was a brilliant analyst of how economies work, he just didn't agree with the outcome. Probably the people that would be more interesting to talk to would be anarchists, are you familiar with crimethinc? The book i recommend most to people is Days of War, Nights of Love. it's only 8 bucks and it comes with a bunch of stickers if you buy it from the site. You won't agree with everything but holy shit parts are brilliant.
http://crimethinc.com/days TitaniumDreads 07:32, 13 April 2006 (UTC) ps. lawschool, oi[reply]
Heh, i typed in that uri wrong, but it's pretty interesting to follow it anyway http://www.crimethinc.com/a/days/ will do you right
2006 custodial workers' strike
Just wanted to let you know that your decision to create a separate page for this topic makes sense, especially if it's an issue that's going to be around for a while, as looks likely. Good move. MiamiDolphins3 00:35, 26 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I second this opinion. Excellent decision. 69.180.103.161 14:03, 2 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Comment from User:24.163.205.147
Hey Lawyer2b. Why don't call Brit Hume up and just ask him about it? How many sources do you want. I mean Christ dude you even looked up the ABC news report yourself. Why don't you call that service and ask them for a copy of Brit's report?
It's not my fault that you don't understand the relavance of the story. To repeatedly delete it is exactly what the entry is about. You are a judge and jury who thinks you have some obligation to protect people from reality. Just like Brit Hume thought he had an obligation to keep quiet about illegal weapon sales to China.
Call Wolf Blitzer, Bill Plante and Wendall Goler. ask them if it is true. Oh I guess it is easier to just delete someone's entry and give a lame excuse on the talk page?
You act like you are God's gift to Brit's wikipedia page. If you had actually researched Brit you would have come across the Ouellette issue and started wondering for yourself. — Preceding unsigned comment added by xxx (talk • contribs)
Sorry
Sorry I wrote Ann Coulter is a stupid whore, but I: just can't stand that she really wants women to give up the right to vote to allow Republicans to get relelected. I understand it wasn't write to write that there.
Response to Iraq war dilemma
Thank you for your respectable comments and statements. There is one thing however that bothers me, why do we finance the terrorists we fight? It would seem logical not to support a terrorist organization that we are trying to battle and potential resolve. It seems American business interests are more of a concern than that of the safety of U.S. citizens or people of other nations. There is much evidence, and you will find on the link I posted in my article in the Iraq war discussion, to support the idea of war-profiteering, grafting, money laundering, and finacial fraud and manipulation in the U.S. It is astonishing to know that even the bin Laden family's interests have stocks in the NYSE that we support readily and wholly. Not to mention Afghanistan has not been denounced as a terrorist supporting nation by the U.S. yet Iraq seems to have fallen under that category. Why aren't we over in Pakistan, the largest terrorist supporting nation in the world, except America. Here is a brief layout of some weird facts: -The U.S. funded the Taliban and supplied them with weapons, the CIA even trained them for combat. -Osama bin Laden and much of his family are very wealthy and powerful thanks to the NYSE and the CIA. -Hussein was provided with bio-weapons from the U.S. during the Iraq-Iran war. -Hussein was put into power by the U.S., today he is in U.S. captivity. -The Bush family and the bin Laden family are close friends and are part of the same business assets. -A couple of bin Laden family members actually have residence in the U.S. (e.g. Omar bin Laden), ironically he lives right next to the CIA edifice.--Existential Thinker 02:52, 5 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]