User talk:Smokefoot

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January 2014

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used as a saline laxative to treat constipation or to clean the bowel before a colonoscopy.<ref>[http://wishardhealth.kramesonline.com/Medications/26,1558</ref>

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of phosphate to aluminium to sodium. Additionally an SAlP of ill-defined stoichiometry is used (NaxAly(PO4)z (CAS# 7785-88-8).<ref>Lucina E. Lampila "

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e.g. [[sodium triphosphate]]. Polymeric sodium phosphates are also well known, these include [[Kurrol’s salt, Graham’s salt, and Maddrell’s salt. Cyclic phosphates are called metaphosphates,

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Three families of sodium monophosphates are common, those derived from PO43-), hydrogen phosphate (HPO4-), and dihydrogenphosphate (H2PO4</

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178873-19-3, and 63148-57-2. These include the tetramer ((MeSiHO)4), copolymers of poly(dimethysiloxane and poly(methylhydrosiloxane), and trimethylsilyl terminated materials.

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: 2"(MeSiH)" + (Bu3Sn)2O → "(Me2Si2O" + 2 Bu3SnH

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}</ref> The most important additive is [[cornstarch]], although [[potato starch]] may also be used).

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are mainly used as [[radical initiator]]s in the [[polymerization]] of certain alkene]]s. Commercially important polymers prepared using persulfates include [[styrene-butadiene rubber]]

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| year = 2007 | publisher = Wiley-VCH | location = Weinheim | doi = 10.1002/14356007.a13_443.pub2 }}</ref><ref>Römpp CD 2006, Georg Thieme Verlag 2006</ref>

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heterocycles are often prepared via condensation of 1,4-[[diketone]]s or 4-ketoacids and hydrazine]].<ref>M. Tišler, B. Stanovnik "Pyridazines" Advances in Heterocyclic Chemistry, Volume 9, 1968,

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periodic table

Please look at Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Elements#element infobox and comment if you if you wish.Petergans (talk) 16:42, 6 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Acetylene edits

Thank you for looking over my work once again. I will take your critiques to heart and make some appropriate changes. I agree about my illustration, it is a butt-ugly eyesore. I just thought I would draw it because the whole article set a precedence for pictures (i.e. I didn't want my submission be the only one to break the format). Anyways... I first learned of this from Ullmann's too but the coverage was a mere paragraph. The Walter Reppe 1969 source source says iron pentacarbonyl can be used as reagent when no free carbon monoxide is available to recharge the catalyst. The equation yielding iron(II) carbonate is taken verbatim from the 1969 paper. For chemists without a lab fitted with special hazard insurance (i.e. being OK'd to work with carbon monoxide), I thought small-time experimenters ought to know they can work with a relatively safe solid reagent rather than a highly poisonous gas.

As a side note on the topic of the iron pentacarbonyl usage, the 1969 source says the reaction between methylacetylene and dimethylacetylene is highly selective (regardless of stichometry) favoring 1,2,4-trimethylhydroquinone, a precursor for the total synthesis of Vitamin E. It also says that higher alkyl groups work as well for this method. Looks to me that this sort of reaction could have industrial applications (considering aromatic substitution is a pain in the ass). The author also explains the reason for this type of synthesis "going out of style" is because petroleum's rise to dominance over the prior calcium carbide industry (and acetylene's cheaper petroleum replacement ethylene). We all know that is a problem considering that we, as a species, are rapidly depleting our oil reserves. Definitely an opportunity to invent new, cheap, "future proof" syntheses of substituted aromatics...

As for topic reccomendations, besides the other occasional curiosities, I am interested in sourcing chemical reagents from renewable resources (i.e. practical yet unconventional total syntheses of reagents). It's fun to think (mostly waste time) over. If you have something weird for me in a secondary source please shoot away, I will give it a look. --ThunderSkunk (talk) 21:23, 7 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Well, I learned something about the hydroquinone synthesis, thanks. I thought that you blew it with ferrous carbonate and had intended to write Fe(CO)₃. There is a huge amount of stuff in the Reppe area, but the main apps are hydrocarbonylation and hydroesterification of alkenes and alkynes.

The main challenge is notability, that is the reason that Wiki policy places so much emphasis of WP:SECONDARY (books and reviews). In this spirit I recommend a new review on acetylene chemistry doi:10.1021/cr400357r. Even if you do not have a subscription, you can view the articles outline.

Re your comment about the depletion of our petrochemical reserves. My understanding also is that cheap petroleum destroyed the coal-based chemical industry. Thank god though! Calcium carbide based chemistry is filthy and is probably only practiced in PRC and other places that tolerate pollution associated with making that crud. Petrochemicals are here for a long time, esp in view of cheap natural gas. Cheers,--Smokefoot (talk) 01:37, 8 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

File:Al2Et6wedge.png

Hi Smokefoot. The H₃C on top should rather be CH₃ IMHO as the bond it straight upwards. It is also inconsistent with the CH₃ at the bottom and the two ethyl groups on the left hand side. --Leyo 01:34, 13 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Drats. I thought that maybe you and DMacks would be happy! Well, at least the drawing is better than before. I will eventually redraw this again! Its been a while. Thanks, --Smokefoot (talk) 02:02, 13 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Boron nitrate

This looks rather odd. The "references" seem to be to boron nitride, the usual spelling mistake. The unreferenced preparation is tribromide plus nitric acid. All seems like a mistake to me. If you agree can we get it deleted?Axiosaurus (talk) 13:30, 27 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Well that is an odd one. As we know, all sorts of articles get entered and the dubious ones have weak refs. I guess someone must have made the nitrate ester of boric acid, but I had not heard of it. Will look around as the opportunity arises. --Smokefoot (talk) 16:02, 27 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Here is a reference that says it does not exist: http://www.geothermal-energy.org/pdf/IGAstandard/WGC/2005/0207.pdf but of course there could be a later one that says it does. But this references says it exists below -78°C. http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/BF00854900 Graeme Bartlett (talk) 06:13, 1 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Reference Errors on 30 January

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"Cut-and-paste move"

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Thanks for the reminder. Although I might err in some cases, I usually follow official protocol. It would be nice to have the authority to switch the target title to an existing redirect without needing to ask for an administrator, but I get lots of help. It looks like the move that I wanted was implemented by fellow editor Edgar181. I need to go back and tidy up the redirects. Cheers, --Smokefoot (talk) 20:18, 31 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

February 2014

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Hexafluoropropylene oxide]] is one of the simplest members of this class of compounds. [[Perfluoro(methyl vinyl ether]] and perfluoro(propyl vinyl ether are used as a co[[monomer]]s with tetrafluoroethylene.

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* [[tolidine|''o''-tolidine]] (2,2'-dimethyl-4,4’-benzidine

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the chlorides of sodium ([[halite]] or NaCl), potassium ([[sylvite]] or KCl), and magnesium ([[bischofite]], hydrated MgCl2. Called [[serum chloride]], the concentration of

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Perfluoroalkoxy alkane

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Tricresyl phosphate

I agree that in general primary literature should not be cited. But the ref. list already contains several others, and the paper I added extends the value of the article. So where is the consistency? Ankababel (talk) 12:29, 9 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I guess the article should be cleaned up, that would be the way to go rather than adding to the problem. There also is the appearance of COI between the editor who started an article on a journal edited by Ramsden and citing an obscure article by the same person in the same journal. Thanks for the note.--Smokefoot (talk) 13:29, 9 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Reply

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Fluoride

I saw your edit for Fluoride: https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Fluoride&oldid=596071903 I could see why you removed my newer sections as I mistooke that I was posting on the ion form of fluorine. I wanted to ask a few questions though: you removed the secion: "===Inorganic chemicals=== Fluorides are pervasive in modern technology. Hydrofluoric acid is the fluoride synthesized on the largest scale. It is produced by treating fluoride minerals with sulfuric acid. Hydrofluoric acid and its anhydrous form hydrogen fluoride are used in the production of fluorocarbons and aluminium fluorides. Hydrofluoric acid has a variety of specialized applications, including its ability to dissolve glass.^[1]

Mined fluorite (calcium fluoride) is a commodity chemical used in steel-making. Cryolite, Na₃AlF₆, is the next highest fluoride salt in industry. It is used in aluminium smelting. Formerly, it was mined, but now it is derived from hydrogen fluoride. Various other fluoride salts are used as fluxes or for the preparation of other fluorine compounds, including covalently bonded fluorochemicals." I didn't create this section but it seems to stay on subject for fluoride, I thought it should stay and I'm new to editing on wiki but I remember reading I should ask the editor if possible before reverting parts of their edits.

Also, for one of the citations you removed info, from: "<ref>{{vcite article |url=http://www.who.int/water_sanitation_health/dwq/chemicals/en/fluoride.pdf |format=PDF |year=2004 |title=Fluoride in drinking-water |author=World Health Organization}}</ref>" to: "<ref>http://www.who.int/water_sanitation_health/dwq/chemicals/en/fluoride.pdf</ref>" I've been including title and such from my citations, are you not supposed to? I want to make sure I'm not missing something. Thank you for your help.

Thanks for the note. I hope that you will have a positive experience. The nature of your impact will improve by (i) communicating with established editors and (ii) making small changes initially.

In any case, the fluoride article is on F^- and related salts. At least that is the direction that the article has taken. I did not check to see if the chloride, bromide, halide etc articles are similar. You quickly can realize that there is a lot of opportunity for disciplined writing/content.

One issue that I often contend with is that infrequent editors fail to appreciate the huge prosaic applications. Instead, we get a lot of editors who want to mention their hobby (e.g. aquariums, stain removal, grandma's ant poison) or their college essay/publication as being something really important, when in fact they are negligible and obscure the big picture. Hence the need to focus fluoride on its role in aluminium and steelmaking, which really dominate. On the other hand, the use of fluoride in dental care is highly impactful, but consumes tiny fraction of the world's fluoride supply.

About the link "<ref>http://www.who.int/water_sanitation_health/dwq/chemicals/en/fluoride.pdf</ref>" You are welcome to revise if you think that I messed up. My recollection is that the link was non-functional (they call this link-rot around here) so I tweaked it.

And the RSC links and WebElements links that I am disinclined toward. These websites do not seem (to me) to be particularly authoritative. They probably/possibly borrow content from Wikipedia or chemical catalogues. I view them as quasi-adverts for some organization, such as the RSC.

I hope that this extended answer is helpful. Feel free to ask more or just go edit. Cheers, --Smokefoot (talk) 18:05, 19 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for the feed back, and clarification. I'll double check the link for what I was thinking but it makes more sense now. As for RSC it seem informative. I've listen to many of their podcasts and for the elements podcasts they are each produced by different professions. They mention a lot of the same information but that leads me into the other point you mentioned, about the Inorganic section. As a reader and someone that has mainly used Wikipedia for school, it seems relavant to me to include as much of the uses for a compound or an element as with fluoride isn't steelmaking or aluminium or for dental care in the big picture. The reason I even started looking it up was to look at alternative uses, but it was a little confusing the overlap between fluoride and fluorine that and the names being similar didn't help, and I made a silly mistake on my part. The inorganic section seems very relavant as I was most intrested in the inorganic properties, which does get into steel making and such, but there are so many other research sections. How do you think it would work best to include the rich diversity of an element such as F, but not include filler? I ask, only because I don't have a good answer myself. That said, maybe put the steel and aluminum section under inorganic chemistry and just have the uses divided by class of chemistry? Thank you again, --HardKhora (talk) 15:20, 19 February 2014 (Central Time)

Butoxyethanol

Hi Smokefoot! Thanks for all your help and edits with the 2-butoxyethanol page. We will try to make our sources more international and we will look into other sources. Blairwal (talk) 20:05, 19 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Perchlorate Suggestion

Hi, thank you so much for your help and suggestions. However, I came across some questions.
1) Be sure to emphasize secondary sources, i.e. reviews and books. See WP:SECONDARY. Absolutely required for biomedical citations per WP:MEDRS. -- How do I emphasize secondary source on bibliography?
2) If you find you are using the word "recently", don't. We are not interested in news per WP:NOTNEWS. -- I haven't used recently but all I said was "it is currently a subject of legal action". Should I not use currently either?
3) The article is international, so do not assume exclusively US perspective. Far more readers live outside of US than inside. An essay on US regulations is inappropriate. -- I just gave what US is doing as an example. Should I just remove a discussion on US government?
4) The article is about a chemical species, not its environmental impact per se. So be balanced per WP:UNDUE. -- For part of the project, we are researching on how these chemicals are affecting humans and environment. The article already seems to have health issues involved. Would including more health issues and environment be a problem?
Thank you Kohw 23:52, 21 February 2014 (UTC)

^ Aigueperse, Jean (2005). "Fluorine Compounds, Inorganic". Ullmann's Encyclopedia of Industrial Chemistry. Weinheim: Wiley-VCH. p. 307. doi:10.1002/14356007.a11_307. ISBN 978-3527306732. {{cite encyclopedia}}: Unknown parameter |coauthors= ignored (|author= suggested) (help)

[Aigueperse-1] Aigueperse, Jean (2005). "Fluorine Compounds, Inorganic". Ullmann's Encyclopedia of Industrial Chemistry. Weinheim: Wiley-VCH. p. 307. doi:10.1002/14356007.a11_307. ISBN 978-3527306732. {{cite encyclopedia}}: Unknown parameter |coauthors= ignored (|author= suggested) (help)

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