Talk:Baronage of Scotland

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Untitled

I created this article for collecting feudal baronies. I doubt if there have been creations of such baronies after 1707, but I want to have the possibility to put in also such baronies.
VM 17:33, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Better add some refs and an explanation of these peculiar left-overs.
DGG 01:41, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

Do you have an idea of what category this page should belong to?
VM 15:47, 30 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

This article is still very incomplete, since many Scottish baronies -- most -- are missing. Many are ancient subsidiary feudal titles held by Scottish hereditary peers. In addition, it mistakenly conflates feudal earldoms and dukedoms with baronies; they should be listed separately. The feudal earldom of Arran should not be listed among the baronies without clarifying that it is an earldom outranking all baronies. The feudal earldoms of Breadalbane and Crawfurd-Lindsay are simply missing, as is the feudal dukedom of Lenox (which in turn outranks all earldoms).24.227.153.54 (talk) 09:38, 23 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I believe that the current Baroness of Lag is Margaret Hamilton. The Baron of Mordington is Graham Senior-Milne. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Hephaestos69 (talk • contribs) 23:17, 2 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I also concur with the comment respecting feudal earldoms (and lordships). Some lordships, though not all, are also baronies (ex. - Kilmarnock and Holydean), but others are not (ex. - lordship of the Garioch). If the titles which outrank baronies are to be included in this list, they should at least be denoted as what they are. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Hephaestos69 (talk • contribs) 23:26, 2 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Need for individual histories

Each feudal barony ideally should have its own article, wikified from this list, as will soon the English feudal baronies, now all defunct. It is never too late to start such a history even where historical records are lacking. Where a current holder dies or sells, it would be desirable instead of simply deleting his name from the list and replacing it with the new holder, to start a new article titled "Scottish feudal barony of X", which will start the history as if at year 0 with a brief biography of the deceased holder, how he acquired the barony etc. I am not aware if there is any authoritative publication such as Debrett's Peerage which records the descent of these feudal baronies, or indeed whether any heraldic or other body exists which records them. (Lobsterthermidor (talk) 22:05, 28 January 2011 (UTC))[reply]

Rationalisation of feudal barony articles

I propose the following as a logical structure for the broad area of the feudal barony:

"Feudal barony" (effectively an entry level disambiguation page, to be created by renaming Feudal baron and de-merging its constituent elements into the articles listed below. Feudal baron mainly concerns Scottish baronies and is 99% identical to Prescriptive barony. The latter needs to be merged into the former.)
English feudal barony- article to be renamed (done), and to receive merger from Barony (country subdivision)
Scottish feudal barony- article to be renamed and to receive demerged Scottish elements from Feudal baron
Irish feudal barony- new article, to be de-merged from Feudal baron. Done, text copied, but not demerged pending consultation.
Scottish feudal lordship - no changes needed, ideal format.
Marcher lordship to be renamed & merged from List of Marcher lordships

I am pasting the above to talk pages of the other articles concerned. Your comments please. (Lobsterthermidor (talk) 21:26, 27 January 2011 (UTC))[reply]

Role of Feudal Baronies Today

Altruists: The Baronies of Prestongrange & Dolphinston are active in the cultural and economic development of their territories. Conquerers: The Barony and Lordship of Halydean (Holydean) reincorporated in Delaware and is amassing land and grazing animals abroad in a corporate "mergers & acquisitions" manner with all of the conquering fervor of any ancient Norman raider. Historians: Other barons act as historical spokesmen for their territories. Genteels: Many feudal barons quite elegantly insist, "please, just call me John," and strive to downplay their status. Perhaps a section could be added to this article describing the role of feudal baronies today? Does anyone find this interesting? insightfullysaid, talk 10:18, 18 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Counties

What is the definition of county in the list of baronies? Is it the “historic county”, and if so, in which era? See the articles Counties of Scotland, Barony and Local Government (Scotland) Act 1973. The county name at the time the barony was created may have changed during its history, and counties and burghs were replaced by other units after 1975. Contributors have used various versions. Also, there is variation with “shire”, e.g. Ayr/Ayrshire. Although baronies are no longer tied to land, I think it’s useful to include county. I’m going to use the historic counties before 1890 for now in my own additions, since that's when the baronies were created, and add shire, but I’d like to see this clarified. Cataobh (talk) 18:38, 16 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Well, it's obvious I'm a newbie. So un-Wikipedic to ask. I'm implementing my own standards as described above, starting with my own additions. Other viewpoints are welcome though, of course! Cataobh (talk) 21:53, 16 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Finnart

The baronies of Finnart and Finnart-Stewart would appear to come into this category, but have since been merged into Greenock and Gourock respectively. Should they be listed? . . dave souza, talk 18:28, 19 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Barony of Lochiel?

Here are two sources that say the lands of Lochiel were united into a Barony in the early sixteenth century:

Is this adequate evidence that Lochiel should be added to the list of feudal baronies? Thanks GPS Pilot (talk) 04:07, 23 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

New link

I have just linked a new article Barony of Preston and Prestonpans in the list - please feel free to take a look and improve it. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 17:59, 13 May 2014 (UTC)[reply]