Talk:Survival horror

Regarding History

Am I mistaken, or is the actual loading text in Resident Evil "Welcome to the world of survival horror", not just "welcome to survival horror?"

That's right - I think the quote is used correctly in the Resident Evil article, but not here. I've fixed it. -Sean Curtin 23:03, Sep 4, 2004 (UTC)

BloodRayne

Can BloodRayne be classified as a survival horror game? I would personally categorise it under third-person shooters. It does not employ claustrophobic environments or puzzles, nor does it attempt to scare the player. Rather, it is more of an action game or third-person shooter, with horror elements. This page seems to include games very liberally, on the mere basis of horror elements. I would be perfectly happy to call BloodRayne "horror", but I think that "survival horror" is unsuitable. Zoggie50 18:03, 8 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Hmm. I can't know because I haven't played the game. You see, it's already a hard to classify genre, so we can only ponder. If you think the game doesn't belong to the list, I think it's alright to take it off. – Kaonashi 18:20, 8 Oct 2004 (UTC)

I think the problem is that the survival horror genre is defined by theme rather than game play style, making classification more difficult. I personally associate survival horror with slow-paced, third-person games in which the focus is puzzle-solving and trying to survive (hence the term, "survival horror") on a small amount of weaponry and ammo: i.e. the "Resident Evil mechanics" mentioned in the article. I do accept the beat 'em ups, role-playing games, first-person shooters and text adventure games mentioned in the article, but I feel that BloodRayne is more like Doom: i.e. a game that features survival horror elements, without actually being a survival horror. Zoggie50 20:12, 8 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Well, you're right. For example, someone had added Zombies Ate My Neighbors to the Survival horror games category. I had to change that, obviously. Check talk page to see it. So yes, it's hard to classify and we can only use common sense with this. About DOOM, I don't know. Check the new DOOM 3 for example. I don't know about you, but I get a strong survival horror feeling from that. Sure, the ammo is pretty abundant, but the atmosphere is pretty much survival horror. That's what I think. – Kaonashi 20:30, 8 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Agreed: common sense is required. However, I personally think that it would be better to use the term with only those games that follow the Resident Evil format - such as Alone in the Dark, Silent Hill and Eternal Darkness - rather than to use the term more liberally to include games such as Doom and BloodRayne, as this is what causes confusion such as that over the Zombies Ate My Neighbors example you gave. Zoggie50 21:47, 8 Oct 2004 (UTC)

RE: "Points to other genres"

About the following part:

"Other games such as the DOOM and Castlevania series include several survival horror game elements, but they also feature other strong characteristics that point to different, more suitable categories. For such reasons, the subjective nature of such discrepancies can make survival horror a difficult genre to classify."

Replacing this edit:

"Other games such as the DOOM and Castlevania series include horror elements, but these games are not typically considered survival horror because they do not attempt to elicit feelings of fear from the player. However, the subjective nature of such discrepancies can make survival horror a difficult genre to classify."

First of all, "point to different, more suitable categories" is grammatically awkward. Something like "...but are typically associated with other genres because horror is not the defining characteristic," would be better. Secondly, stating that Doom and Castlevania include several survival horror elements is inaccurate. While these games certainly have horror elements, they do not follow the definition of survival horror earlier in the page (themes of isolation, rationing of armaments that is much more strict than shooters, focus on puzzles, etc). Most survival horror games are rooted in the adventure genre (collect items, solve puzzles, advance the plot, occasionally fight), which is a very different approach than Doom or Castelvania.

Finally, neither Doom nor Castlevania promote fear in the player, one of the primary characteristics of the survival horror genre. One could probably argue that Doom 3 attempts to build fear and tension in the player through atmosphere, but I don't think that's true of the first Doom. Both Doom and Castlevania employ horror motifs (I mean, Castlevania is about attacking Dracula!), but unlike Silent Hill or Resident Evil, neither game seeks to build an atmosphere of fear by employing horrific elements.

I think we agree that Doom and Castlevania are not survival horror. I think the page should reflect that they are not survival horror because these games, while applying horrific motifs, do not conform to the characteristics we've defined earlier in the page.