Talk:Might Is Right

Philosophy: Literature Stub‑class Low‑importance

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Philosophy, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of content related to philosophy on Wikipedia. If you would like to support the project, please visit the project page, where you can get more details on how you can help, and where you can join the general discussion about philosophy content on Wikipedia.PhilosophyWikipedia:WikiProject PhilosophyTemplate:WikiProject PhilosophyPhilosophy articles

Stub

This article has been rated as Stub-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.

Low

This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Associated task forces:
/
	Philosophical literature

Books Stub‑class

	Books portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Books. To participate in the project, please visit its page, where you can join the project and discuss matters related to book articles. To use this banner, please refer to the documentation. To improve this article, please refer to the relevant guideline for the type of work.BooksWikipedia:WikiProject BooksTemplate:WikiProject BooksBook articles
Stub	This article has been rated as Stub-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.

POV

Point of view (This artical seems to only be dominated by Darwinistic Randroids). Can their be at least SOME critical reviews as well? -- 69.248.43.27 21:07, 9 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, the bottom link is quite critical of it. Being as it is the foundation for the Satanic Bible, and such an obscure text, reviews are likely to be skewed towards or against it, anyways. I don't really see a problem here, though. If you think it's a problem, just find a negative review and tack it onto the bottom. Fourthgeek 05:13, 31 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Download Might is Right

Since the text of the Might is Right is in public domain for long time, does anybody know where one may download the full original text? Perhaps somebody can OCR the book without the copyrighted introduction and afterword? I would definitely appreciate this. Memediver 10:06, 14 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I'm (slowly) working on uploading it to Project Gutenberg. My copy is pretty poor so OCR won't really work well. :/ Fourthgeek 06:21, 26 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Satanism

Although LaVey used this in his work, I don't think this should necessarily be listed within the Satanism template. You could just as well put it under a Nazism template, an Evolutionary Theory template, or any other. It has contributed to much more than just Satanism, misinterpreted and reinterpreted to fit the aims of many groups. Fourthgeek 06:21, 26 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

merge Ragnar Redbeard with this article

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.

Ragnar Redbeard has no notability or verifiability outside of the book Might is Right, so that article should be merged with this one. — coel acan — 21:38, 5 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

As this has already been taken care of I'm going to archive this conversation for purposes of organization. --129.71.73.247 (talk) 05:42, 4 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Content

There is no clear-cut explanation on the page about the relation of the book with Satanism. This needs to be rectified.
There are no examples of why it was considered "incendiary".
There are no examples of its "glaring contradictions".
Ragnar Redbeard should be merged into this, because it is lacking in content. Whatever little it does have, is subjective and unreferenced.

In view of these points, I'll go ahead with the merge and cleanup of these two pages in 48 hours if there are no objections. Thanks xC | ☎ 04:02, 6 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Initial merge has been completed. Will complete the cleanup and re-write (where neccessary) asap. xC | ☎ 17:37, 10 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Discuss links here

Editors regularly clean out undiscussed links from this article. Please discuss here if you want a link not to be cleaned out regularly. (You can help!)--VS ^talk 04:36, 27 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

VS ^talk has removed an external link to a website which I publish containing information and on Arthur Desmond. I believe this link is still relevant to the article, and in fact is an important citation. To avoid a conflict of interest, I should not post the link to the article myself unless it has been discussed on this page. Other editors are free to post the link if they think it is relevant.--Takver 08:42, 1 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Arthur Desmond - Ragnar Redbeard and "Might Is Right"

Correct Publication Date

Article says book was published in 1986, yet the publication history shows this entry: "Auditorium Press, 1890." Is this a typo? Kasyapa (talk) 03:41, 29 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Good point—the infobox showed the date as 1896 (not 1986), but the text had it as 1890, as well as did the item that you mentioned in the table. The later publication date seems to be given in several sources, including the Tolstoy essay. However, the earlier date seems more likely; while I couldn’t find a reliable source that actually stated that the original publication date was 1890, I found a National Library of Australia catalogue entry and a Google Books page for an 1896 third edition by Auditorium Press, making it likely that the first edition was published by the company some years earlier. I referenced the National Library of Australia web page in the table.

—Quick and Dirty User Account (talk) 15:31, 10 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I understand Nietzsche is heavily cited and used in the book, which makes 1890 sound a bit early for an American piece. He was almost unknown to any wider reading public, even in his native Germany, all through the 1880s up to the final months of his creative life (and before that time he had not begun developing his anti-moral, antinomian ideas, the Superman etc). By autumn of 1888 he was just starting to get noticed as a major and innovative (and controversial!) thinker, championed by Georg Brandes and a couple of other critics and writers, and down the line he gained increasing momentum in central Europe, then in the English-speaking countries through the 1890s (while the man himself suffered a terminal mental and physical breakdown in January 1890, removing him personally from the scene) - but by 1890 he would still have been a very arcane, unknown name in most places and especially in the English language. By 1896 he was a very talked-about name and many people had got around to reading him or hearing about him, so it seems very much more likely as a publication date for this pamphlet. 83.251.170.27 (talk) 03:04, 19 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Authorship

If you read the well-documented article on Arthur Desmond, it would appear that there is no question whatsoever about the book's authorship.170.71.252.34 (talk) 02:55, 30 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The stuff about Jack London seems unlikely. London's first short story was published five years after Might is Right. His second short story was eight years afterwards. London's first novel was twelve years after Might is Right.

And, by the way, Jack London turned 14 years old the year Might is Right was published.

London's age and the length of time between Might is Right and his first short story create a high presumption that he is not the author. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.190.228.120 (talk) 22:49, 28 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Thinking about reading this, but...

This book seems to get published by ideological publishers. I am wondering if any versions have taken liberty with the text in order to promote different agendas. And if not, which versions are recommended as authentic. --67.54.235.190 (talk) 01:18, 3 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

There needs to be a link to SATIRE in this article so that idiots who believe this not to be a work of satire understand what satire is

RAGNAR REDBEARD as a pen name, no matter who it is in actual reality, means it is a satire automatically, period.

This is a satire.

End of discussion. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.24.251.152 (talk) 00:21, 23 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Broken links tag

A recent edit added the "broken link" tag to two external links (labeled "EGO No 6 1985 Twenty Five Pence", a link to the internet archive wayback machine capture of the original link and one label "the original"). The first link works for me, it takes a moment for the wayback site to load. I added the first link because the second one died, so I don't believe it has to be tagged as dead. AFAIK, I followed standard procedure for link to internet archive versions of dead links, if someone knows any better, speak up.--Sus scrofa (talk) 15:43, 10 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Tolstoy's "Reaction"

The Tolstoy quote as it was 3/1/13 is hardly a reaction, it's simply a summary of the arguments made in the text. I would imagine if that summary alone must be incorporated, it should be introduced differently. It could easily be misread as supporting the arguments of the author, whereas Tolstoy's actual reaction which follows is a scathing critique. It is a good summary and maybe someone else has another idea on how to incorporate it in full, but as it stands I've replaced much of it with the actual reaction. The content of Wikipedia articles is "booty for the bold" :) 24.91.23.219 (talk) 06:15, 2 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: moved per request. Closed by Tiggerjay; see closing comment at the end of the discussion. Favonian (talk) 13:03, 26 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Might is Right → Might Is Right – Per MOS:CT, in the titles of compositions all verbs should be capitalized. Is is a verb and should therefore be capitalized. Although some (not all) sources do not capitalize Is, Wikipedia should capitalize according to its own style guidelines. ShelfSkewed Talk 04:00, 17 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Comment. It is not our job to make up capitalization. The book appears to capitalize Is. Apteva (talk) 05:17, 17 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose the book cover shows "Might is Right" -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 05:33, 17 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Comment. No, there is no dot on that I. What the book cover actually shows is MIGHT IS RIGHT, in 3 different sizes of capital letters. Is that how we should title the article? Graphical titles used to illustrate the covers of books (or albums, games and other titled works) are subject to the whims of designers and illustrators and are not a good indicator of how we ought to apply our style guidelines.--ShelfSkewed Talk 13:31, 17 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment no, you're wrong. it says MIGHT IS RIGHT, which is the same as "Might is Right" The "i" is not enlarged, and is the same size as the "s" -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 04:20, 20 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  - Comment While acknowledging that this is possibly the silliest argument in the history of Wikipedia, I must point out again that the I in IS has no dot, therefore it is a small capital, not a lowercase i. The two ~~other~~ lowercase is on the cover clearly do have dots, so there is a distinction made. But even if I were to grant your point, my other point still stands: Graphical titles on book covers are not a sound standard by which determine the correct or "official" capitalization of a title. --ShelfSkewed Talk 05:00, 20 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
    - Comment If you're going to argue that, then the title is "Might IS Right" with the S necessarily capitalized, because it is the same size as the "I". Clearly the other 'i's are not smallcaps, so you can't compare it that way, since the only allcaps are "MIGHT IS RIGHT" -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 05:32, 20 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
      - Comment Font size does not determine letter case.--ShelfSkewed Talk 05:43, 20 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
        Comment in the case of the font/typeface used for "might is right" on the cover, the size of the caps is used to indicate capitalization, as it does in many different fonts/typefaces. Otherwise the M and the R would not be larger than the other letters in those words. -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 23:12, 20 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
        Comment Now you're just making stuff up. By that logic, the IS, in the smallest of the three font sizes, would be something "lower" than lowercase, whatever that would be. And all of this is still completely irrelevant to the issue at hand...--ShelfSkewed Talk 03:57, 21 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
        Comment Have you ever used an allcaps font at all? Check some out [1] -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 06:11, 25 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Support per MOS:CT. Powers ^T 16:52, 17 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- MOS:CT only applies to titles that we do not have articles about. WP:NCCAPS is the applicable page for article titles. Apteva (talk) 01:02, 18 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  - Which says, "For details, see Wikipedia:Manual of Style (capital letters)#Composition titles, which is MOS:CT, yes?" Dicklyon (talk) 01:51, 18 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
    - That makes no sense whatsoever. Apteva (talk) 02:26, 18 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  - WP:NCCAPS specifies a capitalization guideline for titled works that is exactly the same as MOS:CT.--ShelfSkewed Talk 03:58, 18 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
    - And it refers to MOS:CT for more detail. It's not clear to me if Apteva is saying that referral makes no sense, or that my pointing it out makes no sense. Makes no sense... Dicklyon (talk) 04:07, 18 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
      - I've found its best to ignore such things these days. Powers ^T 12:45, 18 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Support per MOS:CT, indeed. --BDD (talk) 21:45, 24 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Closing comment - consensus is to follow policy in MOS:CT, since this page is already existing, I am deferring to an admin to CSD#G6 to make room for the move. Tiggerjay (talk) 05:19, 26 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.