Talk:Straight edge

So what is Straight edge?

Is it a punk movement? A military movement? A religion?

I previously knew OF this straight edge thingy. I thought of it as just another American puritan movement. But since I never encountered it, other than the music, I never gave it much thought. Now decades later I read this and know not much more than what I did when I knew nothing. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.253.73.146 (talk) 11:56, 29 April 2012 (UTC)

It is a movement within the Hardcore Punk scene. --Guerillero | My Talk 19:45, 6 May 2012 (UTC)

Yeah, it is not affiliated with any one religion or military. Many straight edge people share common morals on certain things, but there is no formal political agenda either. On its own it is simply a choice to refrain from consuming certain things, just like vegetarianism. Freikorp (talk) 01:28, 7 May 2012 (UTC)

Where it went?

It seems today that straightedge is a term commonly used by emos and ravers ('scene kids'), who have little understanding of the origin of straightedge but brandish the orientation and/or the X to indicate their abstinence in otherwise drug-centered subcultures. Rave, for example, stresses the ideas of peace while still being quite enthusiastic about amphetamines, so it would be logical for some to go X. With Emo, Punk and Rave being more closely associated these days (with scene subculture and emo/rave cross bands like Blood On The Dance Floor) by the mainstream music industry, is this the fourth wave of X? --24.118.61.24 (talk) 00:07, 10 December 2012 (UTC)

Please read Wikipedia:Talk page guidelines. Talk pages are for discussing how to improve the article. "Article talk pages should not be used by editors as platforms for their personal views on a subject." Freikorp (talk) 00:14, 10 December 2012 (UTC)

List of People That Follow a Straight Edge Lifestyle

Due to a mistake of capitalization, see Talk:Straight Edge. I think List of People That Follow a Straight Edge Lifestyle should be merged back to this article rather than exist standalone. Chris Troutman (talk) 00:47, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

Discussion is now closed BlackDragon 00:22, 25 April 2013 (UTC)

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

The result was to Keep the two pages separate. The list has greatly expanded and no comment has been made here since the moment it was made--

BlackDragon 00:21, 25 April 2013 (UTC)

---

Hi, I would like to discuss...

"List of People that follow a Straight Edge" stub article should have been created in the original Straight Edge article so that consensus could have been reached about creating a separate list. Chris Troutman (talk) 00:22, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

Its a "stub" because I just created it and I have a life and dont want to add like a hundred people at once. They are many people that follow this lifestyle and could produce a big list, if people helped of course, but the article literally just started and should stay separate and not merge. This would make the Straight Edge page a list and not an article and would make it pretty long, which is unnecessary. This page should have a list section and then have a link to the list page I just made. Besides there are tons of list articles and they have to start out somewhere. So the page should stay how it is and everyone should help make it longer, I mean I barely scraped the list, just kinda added the more well known ones like Punk and Hetfield. BlackDragon 00:34, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

And if refs are a worry I can easily find them and add them in no prob. BlackDragon 00:36, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

I've moved the closed discussion back here for archival purposes as I am redirecting Talk:Straight Edge to this page so that this capital issue does not happen a third time. Freikorp (talk)

Vegan Straight edge

Per WP:UNDUE a whole top level section on vegan straight edge is unnecessary. The section needs to be forked back into the 90s section with less puffery. While some bands of the era were hardline or krishna, it wasn't a majority. --Guerillero | Parlez Moi 21:09, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

Actually this whole article needs to be written from the ground up. --Guerillero | Parlez Moi 21:10, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

(edit conflict)I found a considerable number of sources on this, and it seems to be a movement that has continued past the 1990s, so it doesn't really make sense to shove it all into that section. I don't know what you mean by "puffery" - I thought I gave it a fairly even-handed treatment. Can you explain that? --Sammy1339 (talk) 21:12, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

I'm not volunteering to rewrite the article - I came here because there were some sources relevant to veganism that mentioned this subculture, and I became interested in it. I don't see a reason to try to force it into a false chronological narrative, though. It seems like the sXe culture has multiple strands that make that kind of narrative a bit awkward. By the way, I'm not familiar with punk music, and I'm just writing what I've gleaned from reading a dozen or so academic sources. --Sammy1339 (talk) 21:14, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

Both Wood 2003 and Tsitos 2016 confirm that hardline and krishnacore pretty much died by the mid 2000s. Looking over the sources you provided as well as the ones I have, I don't see a broad narrative that vegan straight edge existed as a thing separate from those two strains of straight edge. --Guerillero | Parlez Moi 21:38, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

I think every source I've read draws a distinction between hardline and other vegan straightedge participants, and I've rarely seen Hare Krishna mentioned. See Haenfler 2004, for example, where Krishna is not mentioned at all, and hardline only once, despite extensive discussion of veganism. --Sammy1339 (talk) 21:44, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

Also Pieslak, writing in 2015, speaks of "xVx" in the present tense and makes clear that it's an ongoing movement in which hardline is a subculture. On p. 188 he quotes someone as decrying the lack of ideology in vegan straight edge music post-2000, and he identifies hardline as a right-wing group within xVx at the bottom of that page (and repeatedly elsewhere). --Sammy1339 (talk) 21:51, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

Semi-anecdotally, here are some primary sources showing that veganism is alive within the straight edge subculture and is still espoused by some bands as of the 2010s:[1][2][3]. Interestingly the third one notes "the vegan, straight-edge lifestyle that the members adhere to (but don't browbeat or proselytise for)" and the second: "we were all vegan and all straight edge. We thought it would be funny to describe ourselves as a "vegan straight edge" band, because those are terms usually reserved for heavier bands, but it was just as true of us. It's a tongue-in-cheek label, but it's true." We may have a difference in perspective, in that you may be interested in "vegan straight edge" music, which, from what I read, seems to have changed significantly in the last decade, but I am interested in the vegan straight edge subculture, which is still there. --Sammy1339 (talk) 22:13, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

NPOV Relevance

Should I really end up here when the much more common reference to a the tool that this movement borrows its name. Shouldn't it be straight_edge_(movement) referred from the disambiguation page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.2.5.101 (talk) 19:09, 27 April 2016 (UTC)