Talk:South India

Inclusion of Trivandrum.

Hi all., Trivandrum is a major city, a capital city etc., etc., I definitely agree. But it's not as major as the others that are listed. Moreover, it's not as populous as the other cities and the list is "List of large metropolitan cities", which Trivandrum is 42nd. I think, it was removed previously also for the same reason. Just entered this in the talk page to prevent further edit warrings... This is just my view. If yours differ, do reply.Mugunth^{(ping me!!!,contribs)} 15:41, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

I have just added a "Subdivisions" section to the article; I am looking to add a map of the states and districts if available. Maybe we can identify Trivandrum and other capitals on this map. Please let me know if anyone has such a map/map-template. I tried to create it one myself, but there are over 100 districts in South India and the level of detail is making it impossible to complete. Thanks AreJay (talk) 18:03, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

can we use maps from live local? (local.live.com) I'm not sure of the copyrights...Mugunth^{(ping me!!!,contribs)} 09:17, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

Nope...they are copyrighted Microsoft data...and plus this would be a raster image and would lack quality. I've worked on a SVG version based on the blank SVG India map. I just need some help editing it...will have a better picture on if I need to reach out to any resources this weekend. AreJay (talk) 14:36, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

User:Rajithmohan has reinserted Trivandrum with the explaination that the section was about major cities, not most populous cities. The section's title says "major metropolitan areas". A metropolitan area is defined as follows:

A metropolitan area is a large population center consisting of a large metropolis and its adjacent zone of influence, or of more than one closely adjoining neighboring central cities and their zone of influence

The defining feature of a metropolitan area is its population; therefore a large population center is implicit in the definition of a "metropolitan area". I'm therefore going to rv his addition; like I said, I'd be happy to include Trivandrum in the map that I'm working on, but to include the 40th largest city over the inclusion of larger (and therefore more major) metropolitan areas like Madhurai, Mysore and Vijayawada doesn't make any sense. AreJay (talk) 19:00, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

Trivandrum is the largest city (both in area and population) in Kerala. Moreover, it is the capital of Kerala. When you say about major cities, how Tvm can be excluded? The Southern Air Command is headquartered at Tvm. The city has an international airport. Around 80% of the states IT exports comes from this city. The list says about populous Urban Agglomerations. More populous doesnt implies more important. Is Pimpri a major city when compared to Chandigarh, whose population is lesser? Also, the list is about the urban agglomeration, not the city population. Here is the list of most populous cities in South India :

Rank	City	Population (2001 census) India Census 2001	State
1	Chennai	4,343,645	Tamil Nadu
2	Bangalore	4,301,326	Karnataka
3	Hyderabad	3,637,483	Andhra Pradesh
4	Visakhapatnam	982,904	Andhra Pradesh
5	Coimbatore	930,882	Tamil Nadu
6	Madurai	901,681	Tamil Nadu
7	Thiruvananthapuram	744,983	Kerala
8	Salem	696,760	Tamil Nadu

Hence, I suggest to include Trivandrum also in the major cities section, as it is an important city down South.
Cheers, -- Rajith Mohan ^{(Talk to me..)} 03:56, 8 January 2008 (UTC)

Not sure where you got this list from, but the most populous city in South India is Bangalore while the most populous metrololitan area (urban agglomeration) is Chennai (links 1, 2). When we use the term "city" is refers to the jurisdiction of one municipal corporation, while the term urban agglomeration implies a larger, more populous area, perhaps spanning multiple municipal corporations. To your point about notability of Trivandrum, every city is noted for something (if not multiple things). I have no doubt that Trivandrum is an important city (I've visited the city and I think it's beautiful) – it's just that we are trying to restrict the list to the top 25 urban agglomerations and Trivandrum doesn't fall into that list. If we were to make a case for the inclusion of Trivandrum, we'd have to make a case for the inclusion of Madhurai, Mysore and Vijayawada, which are all, I'm sure, important and notable in their own right. If you refer to the map in the Infobox, I've included only the capitals of South Indian states and Trivandrum is very clearly mentioned there. Thanks AreJay (talk) 04:31, 8 January 2008 (UTC)

I prepared the list based on the information from the Census website. Go here and search for the population of Bangalore, Chennai and other cities. What you stated regarding Bangalore and Chennai is wrong. According to 2001 census, Chennai is the largest city as well as largest UA. Check world gazatter also. Btw, I have provided the link too. Btw, if you are very much particular about the exclusion of Trivandrum, why to keep and inappropriate section name? Instead of major metropolitan areas, change the title to Populous metropolitan areas. This can convey the message more clearly.. -- Rajith Mohan ^{(Talk to me..)} 06:41, 8 January 2008 (UTC)

Umm, not sure which World Gazetteer data you're talking about, but there's no ambiguity listed here [1]. In fact even if you look at the source data for your citation in the list that you created [2] it is contrary to what you are claiming...the source is for a list of cities, not urban agglomerations, and indicates that Bangalore is the largest city in SI as of 2008. And even on this list Trivandrum is ranked 53rd, below Bangalore, Chennai, Hyderabad, Visakhapatnam, Coimbatore, Mysore, Vijayawada, Madhurai, Hubli and Salem. However, I do take your point that the naming convention in the infobox is ambigious. I will change it to "Most populous metropolitan areas (2008)". AreJay (talk) 13:57, 8 January 2008 (UTC)

Now that the info-box has been modified to the "Most populous metropolitan areas (2008)", the above discussion may not be very relevant, but let me make a few points. Firstly, the 2001 Census never took into consideration even outlying suburbs of Trivandrum when designating the U/A. This was due to a number of factors, not the least of which was the then-recent expansion of the Municipal Corporation. Secondly, the latest Election data (as of 2005) shows that the city had already expanded beyond a million people and it has consistently recorded one of the fastest urban growth rates in India. Finally, I believe that classifying the importance of cities just by population over factors like their economic, social, historical and geographical significance is an incorrect methodology. If it were true, then Mexico City would have beaten the likes of London, Paris, Shanghai and Washington D.C. to the post. Anyways, just my two cents. Let's not kick up another argument. Good work on the article. Cheers! - Ajaypp (talk) 13:30, 10 January 2008 (UTC)

Definitely agree with you. Thanks AreJay (talk) 15:01, 10 January 2008 (UTC)

Now, after the change of the section name, the ambiguity is removed. The discussion can be archived. Btw, regarding the population of Bangalore, you pointed out the same link that I provided along with the list. I sorted it with the 2001 census data, while you maintained the rank as per the 2008 calculation. The 2008 population is just estimation, but not an authentic one. It reflects a guess figure based on the statistics of population growth. That’s why, I preferred the 2001 census population, which is officially declared and is more genuine. According to 2001 census, Bangalore is not the second populous city in India. However, in the list I created, I missed out Vijayawada and Hubli, which is having more population (2001). I will update the list soon. Thank you for pointing out.
Any ways, great effort in improving the article contents. Go ahead. Cheers, -- Rajith Mohan ^{(Talk to me..)} 03:52, 11 January 2008 (UTC)

Coorg and Murudeshwar

I be including some contents from these two articles into this.... Murudeshwara, kodagu. Your comments? Mugunth^{(ping me!!!,contribs)} 05:07, 10 January 2008 (UTC)

The Murudeshwara article doesn't seem to have a lot of content while the Coorg article is certainly not lacking in it. What type of contents were you planning on including? Thanks AreJay (talk) 15:01, 10 January 2008 (UTC)

May be something from Coorg into the Geography section and some thing into the Culture and heritage section from the Murudeshwara article?Mugunth^{(ping me!!!,contribs)} 04:50, 12 January 2008 (UTC)

Sounds like a good idea! AreJay (talk) 20:51, 12 January 2008 (UTC)

Few more sections

After comparing with other country articles, I felt that, we have to add Education, Transport and probably Tourist attractions to this article. Education should not be just a list of univ in SI, but should focus on Govt policies regarding compulsory education, may also state the reason for higher literacy rates in the South etc., Similarly, Transport, focussing on Southern Railways, road transport, BMTC Volvo (Volvo services for the first time in India) etc., etc., should be added. Tourist attractions, could be sort of a list of important places of interest, Kanyakumari, Ooty, Kodaikanal, thekkadi, Kochi, Coorg, etc., can be added. Mugunth^{(ping me!!!,contribs)} 03:38, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

Actually, I had given this some thought previously and had held off simply because of the fact that SI isn't a official political entity like a state/UT, so there's not one government enforcing policies on education, transport, etc. In that regard, I except to see differences b/w the SI article, and others, say, India. However, if you have the time, perhaps you'd like to take a shot at drafting these sections (Education, Transport, Tourism) and see what we come up with...I can definitely help fine tune them as necessary...just remember to keep them in Summary style. Also, I think we can definitely add the "Tourism" section, since, while each state has a tourism authority, there's still enough general information about tourism in SI that can be covered in the article. Thanks AreJay (talk) 04:18, 14 January 2008 (UTC)

I just noticed that Tourism isn't a major section for India-related articles as prescribed any of the WP:INSTATES, WP:INDIA or WP:INCITIES. In seeming some Indian articles, it looks like mention of tourist destinations is made in the culture or flora/fauna sections. We might need to do that as well. AreJay (talk) 04:31, 14 January 2008 (UTC)

Colonial - Euro Centric Images

There are four images showing people. Two of them are colonial images. Would someone please add images representing actual South Indian people? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 206.47.249.252 (talk) 23:57, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

Name of the article should be: Southern India

Observation
I notice that the main article is hosted on a page titled "South India". Though browsing to "Southern India" also works (by automatically redirecting the user to "South India"), this is inaccurate. There is no geopolitical entity called "South India", except in informal and erroneous (and widespread) usage of the English language.

Description
Technically, "South India" would refer to a nation/state of the mentioned name (not a region, as the fact is). Examples are North America (the name of a continent), West Virginia (the name of a state), and South Korea (the name of a country). The word "South" is one of the four cardinal directions. The only two accepted usage contexts in the English language are: in a proper name (e.g. South America) and to indicate the direction with reference to a particular and already existing entity (e.g. Sri Lanka is to the south of India). The correct way of referring to the region comprising the states of Karnataka, Andhra Pradhesh, Tamil Nadu, and Kerala is "Southern India". The government of India recognizes this anomaly and discourages the usage of the term "South India".

Suggestions
The main article should be hosted under the title "Southern India". Browsing to "South India" should automatically redirect to "Southern India" and a note inserted about the inaccurate usage of the term "South India".

--203.199.115.214 (talk) 05:55, 12 February 2008 (UTC) Vikram Tayde

Hi, what about South Indian Bank? This is a quite prominent bank in South India. I could tell you many other samples. Can you give us an accurate source, that the government of India declines this name for the southern region of india? Googling provides me 2.4 million hits for South India and just 900 000 for Southern India anyway. --Thirusivaperur (talk) 03:35, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Economic Comparison North Vs South- Data Obsolete/Article biased.

The data presented in the economy section is obsolete and fictitious, the national per capita income for India in 2008 is USD 1004(nominal) the economic comparison should be done on the basis of Gross Domestic Product of each individual state which depicts a clearer view of economic performance rather than on regional basis which is absurd as great variation exists between the demographic and socio-economic conditions of the states in North part of India. a) The richest states with highest per capita GDP are Punjab, Haryana, Himachal, Gujarat & Maharashtra and union territories of Chandigarh and Delhi. None of the four south indian states is among the top five in the country.

b) Even High Income states are more industrialised, developed and have higher literacy rates than South India. They spend more money per capita on health, education and development than South Indian states.

c) South India is not homogeneous and is divided on the basis of four dravadian languages namely Kannada, Tamil, Telugu and Malayalam. They have their own regional differences and disputes.

d) The situation in South India is not very different from rest of India in terms of poverty, malnutrition, unemployment, politics, corruption, riots, Naxal violence, law and order problem, infrastructure, health and education etc. If you compare South with the worst performing states than it may look better, but the problem remain unresolved. Why not compare South india with some developed country in Asia like Singapore which has per capita income of US$ 26,481 Vs South India of only US$ 625(2004 estimate). This means the per capita income in Singapore is 43 times higher than South India. This clearly indicates that South india is not very different from rest of India and has to go long way before it can boast of having a distinction of developed nation status like Singapore or Japan. source: [3][4][5] --Himhifi 11:41, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

To respond to this rant, certain states in south India complement each other to give higher averages, so essentially the individual states treatment you are talking about is also valid in your reference to Dravidian states. Kerala for example has the highest human development and literacy rate in India though poor industrialization, whereas cities like Bangalore and Kochi have high per capita incomes. The point being south India has overall higher averages than "north India" though on an individual basis all states have their pros and cons, though I have read sources suggesting south India is developing at a faster rate then even the more developed states in northern India. Anyway averages aren't perfectly accurate to all areas. KBN (talk) 11:55, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

This is valid arguement and not a rant, the richest states in India also exist in North part of India and economically they are performing better than four South Indian states which are grouped on the basis of culture and language. We can compare states on the basis of GDP for a better analysis of economic performance. Punjab/Delhi the richest states in india can be compared to UP/Bihar or Karanataka/TN irrespective of geographical location. The regional differences and similarities exists between all states in India. There are examples of faster developing regions throughout India like National capital region- Delhi, Gurgaon, Noida. Punjab/Chandigarh, Maharashtra/ Gujarat and Goa not just selective areas mainly metros in South Indian states like Bangalore, Hyderabad and Chennai etc. --Himhifi 13:05, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

Fastest Growing Cities in the World mostly in North, East & Western India.

Fastest growing cities and urban areas (1 to 100) Rank City/Urban area Country Average annual growth 2006 to 2020, in % 1 Beihai China 10.58 2 Ghaziabad India 5.20(U.P) 3 Sana'a Yemen 5.00 4 Surat India 4.99(Gujrat) 5 Kabul Afghanistan 4.74 6 Bamako Mali 4.45 7 Lagos Nigeria 4.44 8 Faridabad India 4.44(Haryana) 9 Dar es Salaam Tanzania 4.39 10 Chittagong Bangladesh 4.29 11 Toluca Mexico 4.25 12 Lubumbashi Congo 4.10 13 Kampala Uganda 4.03 14 Santa Cruz Bolivia 3.98 15 Luanda Angola 3.96 16 Nashik India 3.90(Maharashtra) 17 Kinshasa Congo 3.89 18 Nairobi Kenya 3.87 19 Dhaka Bangladesh 3.79 20 Antananarivo Madagascar 3.73 21 Patna India 3.72(Bihar) 22 Rajkot India 3.63(Gujrat) 23 Conakry Guinea 3.61 24 Jaipur India 3.60(Rajasthan) 25 Maputo Mozambique 3.54 26 Mogadishu Somalia 3.52 27 Gujranwala Pakistan 3.49 28 Delhi India 3.48(National Capital Region) 29 Pune (Poona) India 3.46(Maharashtra) 30 Las Vegas USA 3.45 31 Addis Ababa Ethiopia 3.40 32 Indore India 3.35(Madhya Pradesh) 33 Faisalabad Pakistan 3.32 34 Rawalpindi Pakistan 3.31 35 Brazzaville Congo 3.29 36 Peshawar Pakistan 3.29 37 Khulna Bangladesh 3.24 38 Suwon Republic of Korea 3.23 39 Karachi Pakistan 3.19 40 Asunción Paraguay 3.17 41 Lahore Pakistan 3.12 42 Asansol India 3.11(W.Bengal) 43 Riyadh Saudi Arabia 3.09 44 Dakar Senegal 3.06 45 Multan Pakistan 3.06 46 Valencia Venezuela 3.05 47 Jakarta Indonesia 3.03 48 Brasília Brazil 2.99 49 Port-au-Prince Haiti 2.98 50 Palembang Indonesia 2.94 51 Jidda Saudi Arabia 2.93 52 Accra Ghana 2.93 53 Agra India 2.93(Uttar Pradesh) 54 Hyderabad Pakistan 2.91 55 Bandung Indonesia 2.90 56 Wenzhou China 2.90 57 East Rand (Ekurhuleni) South Africa 2.89 58 Wuhan China 2.87 59 Mosul Iraq 2.86 60 Amritsar India 2.85(Punjab) 61 Bursa Turkey 2.85 62 Manaus Brazil 2.83 63 Meerut India 2.83(Uttar Pradesh) 64 Yaoundé Cameroon 2.80 65 Changsha China 2.80 66 Belém Brazil 2.79 67 Bangalore India 2.79(Karnataka) 68 Heze China 2.78 69 Tijuana Mexico 2.77 70 Shantou China 2.77 71 Maceió Brazil 2.75 72 Algiers Algeria 2.74 73 Ahmadabad India 2.73(Gujrat) 74 Lucknow India 2.72 (Uttar Pradesh) 75 Douala Cameroon 2.71 76 Austin USA 2.69 77 Bhopal India 2.69(Madhya Pradesh) 78 Atlanta USA 2.64 79 Ujung Pandang Indonesia 2.63 80 Ludhiana India 2.63 81 Managua Nicaragua 2.62 82 Zhanjiang China 2.59 83 Karaj Iran 2.59 84 Jamshedpur India 2.59(Bihar/Jharkhand) 85 Mecca Saudi Arabia 2.56 86 Vadodara India 2.55(Gujrat) 87 Davao Philippines 2.53 88 Kanpur India 2.53(Uttar Pradesh) 89 Ciudad Juárez Mexico 2.51 90 Tegucigalpa Honduras 2.51 91 Shenzhen China 2.51 92 Srinagar India 2.50(Jammu & Kashmir) 93 Coimbatore India 2.49(Tamil Nadu) 94 Abidjan Côte d'Ivoire 2.49 95 Yangon Myanmar 2.46 96 Dhanbad India 2.46(Bihar/Jharkhand) 97 Rabat Morocco 2.45 98 Aleppo Syria 2.42 99 San José Costa Rica 2.42 100 Khartoum Sudan 2.41

Only two South Indian cities Bangalore at 67th position and Coimbatore at 93rd position could make it to the fastest developing cities in the world. Source: [6] --Himhifi 01:29, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

South India covers a lot less area and population then the north. Similarly if you can find statistics on the least developed, both economically and human, places in India, the majority would be in areas of Indo-Aryan India which you have by error called North and Western India as you have highlighted eastern Indian cities as well. It is also likely that these statistics that you have shown will change in time. KBN (talk) 01:58, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

In addition, I also found the following sentece at the top section to be contradicting,

South India ranks the highest in terms of social and economic development in areas such as fertility rate and infrastructure; the fertility rate of South India is 1.9, the lowest of all regions in India.

So, the lower the fertility rate, the higher the ranking? Wasill37 (talk) 07:42, 5 August 2014 (UTC)

Punjab & Maharashtra Tops the list in Human Development Ranking.

Human Development Ranking by State(2001)

State            Rank      GDP Per Capita
                           
Punjab           1         2
Maharashtra      2         1
Haryana          3         4
Gujarat          4         3
Tamil Nadu       5         5
Karnataka        6         6
Kerala           7         - 
Andhra Pradesh   8         7
West Bengal      9         8
Rajasthan        10        9
Madhya Pradesh   11        10
Assam            12        -
Uttar Pradesh    13        11
Orissa           14        12
Bihar            15        13

Source: [7] [8] --Himhifi 11:42, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

2001? I assure you Kerala is the leading state in human development at this time. This source says that states like Punjab while having good per capita income, has low human development. [9]

This is pure non-sense, or what else. Just go to Indian sensus and search there. Gujarat will take another 10 years (2020) to reach what kerala achieved in 1990!!!! (203.99.197.2 (talk) 06:45, 5 February 2009 (UTC))

Revised map

File:South.india.JPG

South India

About 33 per cent of the census 2001 population of India live on one-third of the landscape. This is south India comprising Gujarat, Maharashtra, Goa, Karnataka, Andhra Pradesh, Kerala and Tamil Nadu.Anwar (talk) 13:53, 2 April 2008 (UT

A discussion on the constitution of the South is in Archive 2. I don't think the term "New South" exists (or has been accepted) in India...we have to be careful not to bring in WP:OR into the article. Thanks AreJay (talk) 16:14, 2 April 2008 (UTC)

Anwar, could you provide a reliable source for including Maharashtra and Gujarat as well as Goa to the South Indian region? --Thirusivaperur (talk) 18:08, 2 April 2008 (UTC)

Maharashtra and Gujarat are part of the region known as Dravida along with the other south Indian states, however most definitions of south India refer to the four states. KBN (talk) 10:59, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

South India Defined

On what basis is South India defined in this article? With the Southern United States, the distinction is clearly based on secession during the Civil War. This entry, however, fails at present to attach the notion of "South India" to any clear variable(s). It is this omission that will continue to evoke requests of cartographic modification like the one above. Before we delve into History, Geography, Flora, and so on, I think we must first clearly define (with appropriate citational support) why the particular geographic region we have identified constitutes "South India." sæ (talk) 21:13, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

This has been discussed n times so far... Check the talk archives. For your information, you can search for "South indian states" in google. Reverting it back. If any one has a problem please discuss...

Mugunth^{(ping me!!!,contribs)} 01:05, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

Thank you Mugunth. Perhaps this was already discussed, but isn't some sort of internal citation in order, particularly for the WP user who does not consult talk page archives? sæ (talk) 00:41, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Not an South India vs North India article

All the comparisons are with North, if one wants to show progress relative- a more balanced approach would be a comparison with all regions and not just one. Haphar (talk) 09:45, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Anyone willing to discuss the inclusion of the table?. KBN (talk) 11:05, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Source is "India Information", I have never heard of the site before, but still even if one was to consider it, how does one reconcile the fact that India's per capita income is stated as US$ 1004 in the India article ,and this site gives the data as Rs 13000 + PCI for South India and Rs 8000 + PCI for North India ?. Where is the drag down to Rs 4000 coming from, considering that West should be doing well? Even if we get the correct information, a better approach might be to get a national average and compare that with that of the South to show how South is doing well ( which it is !). Haphar (talk) 11:24, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

I agree with this...Mugunth^{(ping me!!!,contribs)} 12:03, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

I have no clue how this happened. The original table that I added a few years ago was sourced from Outlook India. It seems to have been replaced now by this whereincity website whose credibility is nil. I am going to go ahead and remove that table for now because it is sticking out like a sour thumb; meanwhile, I'll try to go back through the history to see if I can find my citation. Thanks AreJay (talk) 16:40, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Just updated the table. AreJay (talk) 18:28, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Looks good, could you add it to the Economy of South India article too ? Even there the other table had been put and I removed it yesterday. Haphar (talk) 20:47, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

The new table is good... Let's go with this...Mugunth^{(ping me!!!,contribs)} 04:35, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

Question about names

Hello, can someone knowledgeable about South India tell me the following (to my discussion page):

1. The literal meaning of the name "Subramaniam"/"Subramanian"

2. The literal meaning of the name "Ramanathan"

Thank you, Badagnani (talk) 08:26, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

Subramanian is derived from Sanskrit and not a Proto-Dravidian language. Su (means good, or dear), while barmanian (means Brahmin), translating losely to dear to Brahmins. Ramanathan comes from Rama and nath, meaning Lord. Thanks AreJay (talk) 16:28, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

Thank you, you mean "bramanian," not "barmanian," correct?

One more question: what does the "Bala" in Balasubramanian mean? Badagnani (talk) 20:00, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

Yes, bramanian not, barmanian. Not too sure about Balasubramanian. Bala means young in Sanskrit. The name Subramanian is typically a reference to the elder son of Shiva, Shanmukha; I can only infer therefore that Balasubramaniam means Shanmukha as depicted as a child or young adult...similar to Balakrishna (Krishna as a child) or Balamurali (A young, flute-playing Krishna). AreJay (talk) 20:33, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

How nice that the meanings of these common names are now (with your help) finally being "unlocked" for me. Badagnani (talk) 20:38, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

One more: Ranganathan. Badagnani (talk) 20:58, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

And another: Krishnamurti. Badagnani (talk) 21:15, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

Ranganathan is Vishnu, as depicted resting on Shesha Naga. Krishnamurth(y/i) means idol (form) of Krishna AreJay (talk) 00:56, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

Thanks, but what does "ranga" mean literally in Sanskrit (is it "gathering place")? And what does "murthy" mean literally in Sanskrit ("idol")? Badagnani (talk) 01:08, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

The "an" is a Dravidian suffix added to Sanskrit words, "am" is also used. Trips (talk) 14:03, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

Cant we include Goa in this Section

if we say south india goa should also be included or is this based on linguistic culture? --Neal007 (talk) 21:53, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

Typically South India means the parts where Dravidian Peoples live or where Dravidian languages are spoken. Goa does not come under South India for this reason, the main language there is Konkani which is an Indo-Aryan language. Of course if you look at it from a geographic context the entire peninsular portion could constitute a "South India" but it is seldom reffered to in a geographic sense. --Deepak D'Souza 05:48, 7 May 2009 (UTC)

wrong data of urdu speaking population (Urdu is spoken by over half of the 25 million Muslims in southern India)

in kerala muslims are around 24% kerala population ,every one's mother tonque only malayalam %

this is 11% population of south india is musilm (i.e 25 or 2.5 crore people) but only very few musilm have mother tonque urdu,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mappila

read about kerala musilm

know about musilm with mother tonque tamil

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tamil_Muslim

only muslim in andhra (i.e hydrabad area ,they only have urdu as mother tonque)

and converted musilms in karnataka to adopted urdu as a mother tonque

ect.... maximum around 50 to 75 lacks people in south india speaks urdu , pan india musilm every one converting as urdu speaking muslims — Preceding unsigned comment added by 115.184.48.53 (talk) 09:16, 11 August 2011 (UTC)

India Page Image Rotation VOTE

There is currently a vote going on to decide the images to be selected in the Demographics Image Rotation. Please carefully see the proposals and vote for your 8 favorite images that best represent the people of India.

Please vote here.

Thanks. Nikkul (talk) 05:06, 24 October 2011 (UTC)

Kutuwa language?

A recent edit (22 January 2013) has included Kutuwa language as one of the languages spoken in South India. Can some more details about this language be added? Or shared on this page? Where is this spoken? Any reference to its existence and recognition by linguistics?

Anant (talk) 07:52, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

Has Malayalam been declared a classical language?

The Languages of India article seems to show that only Tamil, Kannada and Telegu have been officially declared as classical languages by the Indian Central Government. Is there any notification, which can be cited, to state Malayalam has been officially declared a classical language? There also seem to exist some criteria for declaring languages as classical. Please see classical language. There are many good things about Malayalam culture, including some well known historical contributions to medicine and mathematics. These could be highlighted some where? Anant (talk) 13:47, 7 April 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for bringing this into notice. No, Malayalam is not yet granted the status of Classical Language. I have removed it from the article. Thanks TheStrikeΣagle 13:55, 7 April 2013 (UTC)

Neutrality

So, what exactly is the problem with the neutrality of the tagged sections? Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 12:22, 4 July 2013 (UTC)

Gallery

This article is drowning in images now. How about a gallery, or removing several pictures? Joshua Jonathan -Let's talk! 12:22, 4 July 2013 (UTC)

Urdu offiicial language of South India

Urdu is official langugage of south India, check official language of new state telangana and Andhra Pradesh before its divide. Try to know before you just bluntly deny it as someone did with editing — Preceding unsigned comment added by Afroze.shaikh (talk • contribs) 10:53, 18 July 2014 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:South India/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Sainsf (talk · contribs) 11:27, 19 March 2016 (UTC)

Hi! I will be reviewing this article. Adding my comments in 24 hours. Sainsf <^>_{Talk all words} 11:27, 19 March 2016 (UTC)

Cool! Good to work with you again! Magentic Manifestations (talk) 14:46, 19 March 2016 (UTC)

I am working on duplinks and reference from the bottom of the article. Will update once done.Magentic Manifestations (talk) 16:18, 19 March 2016 (UTC)

Sainsf, Guess all the changes have been made. Pls chk once and we can close this! Magentic Manifestations (talk) 20:06, 22 March 2016 (UTC)

Lead

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Talk all words} 06:10, 20 March 2016 (UTC)

• I would like to have the citations removed from the lead and adding them to the main text.Y
• South India includes the southern part of the peninsular Deccan Plateau and is bounded by the Bay of Bengal in the east, the Arabian Sea in the west and the Indian Ocean in the south --> Covering the southern part of the peninsular Deccan Plateau, south India is bounded by the Bay of Bengal in the east, the Arabian Sea in the west and the Indian Ocean in the south.Y
• Link plateau, fertility rateY
• two mountain ranges the Western and Eastern Ghats bordering --> two mountain ranges-the Western and Eastern Ghats-borderingY
• are the largest urban areas in the region. I think it is better to say this directly : "are the millionplus urban agglomerations in the region." (there are about 15 million plus agglomerations and did not want to list everything Magentic Manifestations (talk) 04:07, 20 March 2016 (UTC))

Etymology

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Talk all words} 06:10, 20 March 2016 (UTC)

• Italics not needed for South/Peninsular IndiaY
• Deccan --> "Deccan"Y
• anglicized--> anglicised. This article should follow British English or rather Indian EnglishY

Ancient era

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Talk all words} 06:10, 20 March 2016 (UTC)

• Starting from the Sangam period, trade happened with Phoenicians, Romans, Greeks, Arabs, Syrians, Jews and Chinese --> Trade with Phoenicians, Romans, Greeks, Arabs, Syrians, Jews and Chinese began from the Sangam periodY
• Please add how long ago the Sangam period wasY
• Several dynasties ruled over the region such as "Several dynasties such as ... ruled over the region."Y
• How are these dynasties arranged? In the order of their periods of rule?Y(arranged as per period start. Magentic Manifestations (talk) 04:20, 20 March 2016 (UTC))
• When was the Vijayanagara Empire founded here?Y

Colonial era

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Talk all words} 06:10, 20 March 2016 (UTC)

• in 15th century , end of Vellore Mutiny "the"Y
• control of South India "of" --> "over"Y
• consolidated power "their"Y
• Link princely state if this is the first mentionY
• Duplink: British East India CompanyY

Post Independence

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 17:03, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

• After Indian Independence in 1947 --> After the independence of India in 1947Y
• As a result of this act "Act", not "act"Y
• What is taluk?Y
• "the" Bombay State, "the" Hyderabad StateY
• union territory Link?Y
• June 2, 2014 Best to write 2 June 2014 Y
• Many duplinks: Madras State, Travancore-Cochin, Tamil Nadu, Andhra Pradesh, Hyderabad State, Kerala, Mysore State, South Canara, Karnataka, PondichéryY
• As a result of this Act, Madras State retained its name with Kanyakumari district added to from Travancore-Cochin Not sure what this meansY
• Why has Mysore State been separated from the others into a separate para?Y
• comprises ten districts in northwestern Andhra Pradesh Not sure what this meansY

Geography

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 17:04, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

• Don't repeat "by the" in the first lineY
• Both the ghats What is a ghat?Y
• Duplinks: Eastern Ghats, Tamil Nadu, Andhra Pradesh, Lakshadweep, Deccan plateau, Bay of BengalY
• Palakkad and Wayanad hills, and the Sathyamangalam ranges Is a comma needed? It may alter the meaning.Y

Climate

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 17:04, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

• with rainfall dependent on monsoons --> and depends on monsoons for rainfallY
• In the Köppen climate classification, it is a non-arid climate --> According to the Köppen climate classification, it has a non-arid climateY
• with mean temperatures of minimum 18 °C (64 °F) What does this mean?Y
• Andhra Pradesh gets between commaY
• falls on Tamil Nadu "in" not "on"Y
• with mean monthly temperatures... for agriculture Needs some fixing. Convert template?Y
• "north-east" not "North-East" monsoon same for South-WestY
• which brings devastating bringY
• Tropical cyclones are rapidly rotating... Bay of Bengal Grammar errors. The whole of this is actually redundant.Y
• Duplinks: Western Ghats, Lakshadweep, Tamil Nadu, Andhra Pradesh, North–East Monsoon, Bay of Bengal, Arabian Sea, Tropical cyclonesY
• The last para on tropical cyclones seems out of scope.Y

Subdivisions

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Talk all words} 08:54, 20 March 2016 (UTC)

• Source for the intro para?Y
• Don't link union territories if already done as requested in HistoryY
• Is every point of the tables sourced? How are sources arranged here?Y(changed and sourced as per census 2011; Andhra was split later and hence added sources separately for AP and TS. Magentic Manifestations (talk) 08:47, 20 March 2016 (UTC))
• Duplinks: Puducherry, Lakshadweep and Andaman and NicobarY

Demographics

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 17:04, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

• The region's total fertility rate Add (TFR) so that we are not confused with it when used later on.Y
• What is replacement level?Y

It looks a bit more messy. We need just the link here. Please restore the line and simply link the term. Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 04:05, 21 March 2016 (UTC)Y

• tap water. Wells and springs Too common to be linkedY
• The Per capita income No capsY
• by United Nations "the"Y
• Duplinks: Kerala and Tamil NaduY
• Can it be a bit clearer that the next two paras after the intro are based on the 2011 census?Y

Languages

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 17:04, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

• seventy-three We should typically write this in digitsY
• Official Languages Act no italicsY
• Duplinks: Tamil, Telugu, Kannada, Malayalam, Konkani, Government of IndiaY
• No caps for speakers and spoken in the tableY
• Sources for the number of speakers?Y

Religion

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 17:05, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

• Prehistoric religion why caps?Y
• world traces its commaY

Seems you did not fix it well. Done now. Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 05:34, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

• Link ArabY
• Duplinks: Hinduism, Jains, Malabar coast, Deccan Sultanates, Muziris, Kerala, Jewish communitiesY
• Do you not think the discussion about the history of religion should go to the History section? (According to me, it makes more sense to be with religion as the sub section deals with it exclusively. It is not notable enough to overall history to be included in history section. Let me know your comments. Magentic Manifestations (talk) 15:59, 21 March 2016 (UTC))

Economy

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 17:05, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

• after independence no link needed here Y
• Link socialist Y
• Duplinks: Kerala, Andhra Pradesh, Tamil Nadu, Karnataka, monsoons, Godavari, cotton, tea, rubber, spices, Chennai, Telangana Y
• is the second most industrialized state in the country After which state?Y

Administration

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 17:05, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

• Puducherry and the other five states has an elected state government while the Lakshadweep and Andaman islands are centrally administered by the President of India Repetition from "Subdivisions". I think it would be better if "Subdivision" comes before this section or is the first subsection under this.Y
• Can you add a title for the gallery?Y
• Tamil Nadu, Kerala and Puducherry follow unicameral legislature while Andhra Pradesh, Karnataka and Telangana follow bicameral legislature. Source? This line should anyway go to the next para.Y
• Duplinks: centrally, President of India, coalitionY

Politics

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 17:06, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

• Duplinks: Madras Presidency, Self-Respect Movement, Tamil Nadu, Indian National Congress, Andhra Pradesh, Karnataka Y
• led the party on the death of Jawaharlal Nehru You mean after the death? Y
• Indian National Congress should be linked at first mention in the section Y

Clothing

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 17:06, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

• The dance, clothing, and sculptures of South Indian exemplify the celebration of the beauty of the body and motherhood Could this be more encyclopedic? We can write beautifully but this seems a bit too flowery and unclear. This intro may not even be needed.Y (Moved down and rephrased. Magentic Manifestations (talk) 16:42, 21 March 2016 (UTC))
• There are more than 80 recorded ways to wear a sari and the most common style is for the sari to be wrapped around the waist, with the loose end of the drape to be worn over the shoulder, baring the midriff. Seems out of scopeY
• In Indian philosophy, the navel is considered as the source of life and creativity and hence by tradition, the stomach and the navel is left unconcealed Does this imply that because of this philosophy the stomach and navel are kept bare?Y (yes exactly; re-worded. Magentic Manifestations (talk) 16:42, 21 March 2016 (UTC))
• While the colorful appearance of dhotis is mentioned, that of the saris is not.Y
• western dress is getting increasingly popular since when?Y

Cuisine

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 17:06, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

• Duplinks: rice, spices, coconutY
• using clean fingers of the right hand to transfer the food to the mouth. Source?Y

Arts

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 07:04, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

Cinema

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 17:07, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

• Source for the table? It needs to be updated for 2015. (CBFC has not released data for 2015. Last updated is 2014 in website. Magentic Manifestations (talk) 16:58, 21 March 2016 (UTC))
• South Indian film industry released 1032 feature films in 2014 contributing to 53% of the total films produced in India. This could be added for every year. So what is the significance of this line? It can be covered by the table for the latest year. (modified it. Magentic Manifestations (talk) 16:58, 21 March 2016 (UTC)) Y

Literature

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 07:26, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

Architecture

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 07:26, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

Transport

• Bus services are provided by...Puducherry Road Transport Corporation. Source?Y
• Source for the road density column of the first table? And for all points in the following tables?Y
• 80-mile link convertY
• Much of the "Rail" part could go to the History section(Again, in my opinion, it feels appropriate to be in rail section as it is specific to rail transport. Magentic Manifestations (talk) 17:57, 21 March 2016 (UTC))
• The region is covered by water on three sides and has a long coastline redundant(first mention. It is not redundant. Magentic Manifestations (talk) 17:57, 21 March 2016 (UTC))

When you say South India is peninsular, this is what is implied isn't it? Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 18:02, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

Got it. Magentic Manifestations (talk) 20:02, 22 March 2016 (UTC) Y

• Major ports include Chennai, Visakhapatnam, Mangalore, Tuticorin, Ennore and Kochi. Don't leave this unsourcedY
• Duplinks: Madras Presidency, Madras Railway, Indian NavyY

Flora and fauna

 Done Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 05:35, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

• What is this section doing at the bottom of the article? (Pl. suggest where should it go. Magentic Manifestations (talk) 12:03, 20 March 2016 (UTC))

Shifted to the bottom of Climate. Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 05:35, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

• high altitude rain forests --> rainforests located at high altitudes Y
• the backwaters of Pulicat and the backwaters of Kerala Can we avoid repeating "backwaters"? Y
• one of the largest populations in India? World? Repair this in the caption Y
• Karnataka, in colon not comma Y
• crest-line What is this? Y
• In the last line some animal names begin with caps, why? Y
• Duplinks: UNESCO, Pulicat, mangrove Y

Sources

Similar comments as in earlier reviews and a few issues:

• Bracket to be removed in ref.5Y
• In refs. 4 and 5 can you write the way you have in, say, refs. 8,9,10? Looks neater.Y
• Italics and link for The Hindu (ref.7) Please see that all newspapers are linked appropriately in the citationsY
• ref. 30: mention the author (Geological Society of America)Y
• ref. 63: not properly cited. Use the cite-journal, feed 19001685 in the PMID parameter and click autofill. That should work. You can also add http://medind.nic.in/iby/t08/i8/ibyt08i8p198.pdf in the URL parameterY
• ref. 80: Use cite-journal templateY
• ref. 116, 123, 125: proper formattingY
• ref. 188: why is the journal name repeated?Y
• refs. 193, 194: ISBN?Y
• ref. 213: The publisher should be "IRCTC"Y
• ref. 237 Link Indian NavyY
• ref. 241: dead linkY
• ref. 242 Link UNESCOY
• refs. 77, 99, 107, 110, 121, 157, 159, 229, 233 look inappropriate or not so reliableY

An FAC-level point: Please ensure that e are using Indian/British English throughout the article. I am trying to help with this. Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 04:05, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

All done. Magentic Manifestations (talk) 15:44, 20 March 2016 (UTC)

Thanks. Found time for this today, I will add all my comments. Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 04:05, 21 March 2016 (UTC)

Alright, all my concerns have been appropriately addressed. In my opinion the article now meets all the criteria for a good article. I am glad to promote this. Cheers! Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 03:44, 23 March 2016 (UTC)

Thanks! It was good working with you again! Magentic Manifestations (talk) 18:11, 23 March 2016 (UTC)

Exclusion of Andaman and Nicobar

Andaman and Nicobar islands have been included in South India, while in actuality they are part of East India. In fact the East India page also lists these islands and the geographical society of India (which is administered by the Government of India) also considers these islands as part of East India, see | this link. Further the Government of Andaman and Nicobar Islands makes no mention of the union territory being part of South India (unlike Puducherry and Lakshadweep).

Kindly look into this matter.