Talk:Milo Yiannopoulos

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A fact from this article appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the "Did you know?" column on July 24, 2012.

The text of the entry was: Did you know ... that Milo Yiannopoulos arranged a moonwalking flash mob at Liverpool Street station as a tribute to Michael Jackson shortly after his death?

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Protected edit request on 28 December 2017

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In the infobox, please pipe [[United Kingdom]] to [[United Kingdom|UK]] to avoid line-wrapping as allowed by MOS:ABBR#Countries and multinational unions.
Please move the citation for Mr. Yiannopoulos' birth name from the infobox to the opening paragraph of the "Early life and personal life" section as recommended by WP:INFOBOXCITE.
The phrase "media personality" in the lead appears nowhere else in the article, and is uncited. However, since the body of the article does discuss Mr. Yiannopoulos' celebrity, and since "media personality" redirects to "celebrity" anyway, please change the former wikitext to the latter.
As the article at Breitbart News doesn't italicize the name of its topic, and since Breitbart News is not a newspaper, please remove italicization of "Breitbart News" from throughout the article.
"Cultural libertarian" and "cultural libertarianism" are both piped and linked to cultural liberalism without that (single-sourced) article mentioning "libertarianism" at all. Please remove these links.
Please pipe "neo-Nazi" to link to "neo-Nazism".
Please pipe "white supremacist" to link to "white supremacy".
Please pipe "ghost-written" to link to "ghostwriter".
Please elaborate in the lead that The Kernel is an online magazine.
As an official, trademarked name, please change "Simon and Schuster" to "Simon & Schuster".
The infobox claims Mr. Yiannopoulos' residence is Doral, Florida, but no reliably-sourced prose exists in the article to support it. Please remove this line from the infobox.
The infobox claims a "John" to be Mr. Yiannopoulos' spouse, but no reliably-sourced prose exists in the article to support it. Please remove this line from the infobox. — fourthords | =Λ= | 17:48, 28 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I've done the infobox changes per WP:BLP. I'll check back tomorrow to see if there any any objections to the other changes. --NeilN ^{talk to me} 18:00, 28 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Done the rest. Please let me know if anything is contentious and I'll revert it. --NeilN ^{talk to me} 17:00, 31 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Random watcher here: I have no objection to any of these changes. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 21:05, 31 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

religion again

Archive 3 (which could not be edited) has the statement, regarding whether MY is a "practicing Roman Catholic", "we should take a person's word for it and move on." The problem is we don't have his word for it. We have Bloomberg stating it as a fact, and the Tablet Magazine stating "Yiannopoulos identifies religiously as Catholic". One comment in one of the archives linked to a YT video where he (according to the poster) says he is Catholic, but that video has been deleted. I propose that "A practising Roman Catholic, Yiannopoulos states his maternal grandmother was Jewish" be changed to something like "Yiannopoulos, who reportedly claims to be a practising Roman Catholic, states that his maternal grandmother was Jewish". --Richardson mcphillips (talk) 15:02, 2 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I don't see anything objectionable about this. I'll do it now. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 15:26, 2 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Intersects poorly with multiple sections of WP:WTW; particularly WP:ALLEGED & WP:SAID. The Bllomberg source looks sufficient to verify this as factual: they state is as fact; we consider that they would have done their research. - Ryk72 ^'c.s.n.s.' 15:40, 2 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

"Reported" and "alleged" are two very different words, with very different meanings. In this case, I don't see how "reported" softens the claim enough to shift the implication that "Milo says he is a practicing Catholic" to one in which "somebody claims Milo said he is a practicing Catholic, but he might not have ever actually said it." ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 16:01, 2 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

"Reported" and "alleged" may be very different words; but "reportedly" and "allegedly" are synonyms. The text used the adverb forms. - Ryk72 ^'c.s.n.s.' 16:07, 2 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Strictly speaking, but they carry very different connotations. "Reportedly" implies that it is accurate, while "allegedly" does not. Indeed, to some people "allegedly" implies that it is not true. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 16:11, 2 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I don't understand why we would hedge this. "Reportedly claims" is dripping with skepticism, even if "reportedly" isn't as strong as "alleged". With the Jewish grandmother issue, we had some sources which provided context for why this would be worth additional caution. Does any source similarly contextualize him being Catholic? If not, we should just say it in simple terms as a bland detail. "Yiannopoulos is a practicing Catholic." Good enough. Grayfell (talk) 06:01, 3 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Generally when it comes to religion or ethnicity on a BLP we state as fact if a person self-identifies (say in an interview), and attribute it if reported by others. The hedging is because these are quite contentious areas and getting it wrong can (in some circumstances) cause real problems. I agree with MPants that reportedly is better than alledgedly (due to the common inference of both words) but tbh both are not good. There must be a better way to phrase it so its attributed but not with an inference it may not be true. Only in death does duty end (talk) 09:17, 3 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Honestly, at this point there are so many RSes taking his claimed faith at face value, I'd be okay with no attribution whatsoever. Just state that he's catholic and be done with it. Except for claims which have an obvious possible ulterior motive to them (such as Milo's claims about Jewish ancestry), I see no reason to doubt self-reported religious beliefs. Even then, better sourcing is all that's needed for us to say it (again, just like Milo's claims about Jewish ancestry). I honestly don't see much difference between "Milo claims to be Catholic" and "Milo reportedly claims to be Catholic" in terms of inferences of doubt, as I outlined above. But if it's contentious at all, we should just drop the attribution. We have at least one RS already stating it as a given, and here's another one. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 14:22, 3 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I keep going back and forth on this. I'm concerned that because there are so many legitimately controversial things about Yiannopoulos, we are transferring appropriate skepticism to trivial details, which is basically gossip. "Reportedly" seems like a filler word in this case. Who is doing the reporting, and why is the reporting aspect worth emphasizing? Do we doubt the "report"? If anyone was legitimately contesting this, we should be able to explain who and why. If we don't have sources for that, adding extra words to explain this is unnecessary. That it also implies doubt seems like reason enough, but even without that, I don't know what purpose this phrasing serves. Since we're not attributing this to Bloomberg or whoever, nor should we, Wikipedia is "reporting" this by proxy. Let's just say it, instead. Grayfell (talk) 23:18, 3 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Fuck it, let's just say he's Hindu and all argue against anyone who disagrees. We'll lie about what the sources say even when others can read the sources for themselves, and get at least a dozen others in on it. We'll keep it going for a year or two, then get the inevitable admin who joined the Hindu side to revdel all the edits arguing about it and wipe it out of the archives and pretend like it never happened. We'll deny ever claiming he was Hindu to anyone who brings it up. Epic cooperative trolling on a whole new level. You in? ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 00:08, 4 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Seems like a reasonable compromise to me. Grayfell (talk) 01:16, 4 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Alma mater

While it's not impossible for this to be used to refer to a place one attended, in the cases I've seen it used it's only for places one graduated from. It might be confusing to list places Yiannopoulos did not graduate from as his alma mater. Thoughts? PeterTheFourth (talk) 15:57, 4 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Alt-right

Milo Yiannopoulos has repeatedly disavowed the alt-right, and his views are not consistent with the white supremacists of the actual alt-right. I think the term "alt-right" ought to be removed from the "Movement" section on the right-hand column. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:141:100:9200:4D85:C5C0:8CC7:E04D (talk) 16:16, 5 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

His views were highly influential on the conservative population, and had a huge effect on drawing non-white supremacists into the 'alt-right' banner. He effectively obfuscated the origins of the alt-right movement for a lot of people, and garnered them a great deal of support from mainstream conservatives. Disassociating him from the alt-right because he ended up disowned by the core (and disowning the group) after many months of endless promotion would be a disservice to the reader. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 16:28, 5 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Further to my most recent edit, during an interview with the BBC, Yiannopoulos argues that the alt-right takes a number of different forms, from 'classical-liberals, disaffected leftists, ordinary conservatives, and this new young very energised, trolly, mischievous youthful contingent that has suddenly become interested in politics again, and that's the wing that I am most closely associated with, because that's the most exciting bit'. With this in mind, I don't think that it is accurate to say that Yiannopoulos has 'repeatedly disavowed the alt-right'. Jono1011 (talk) 23:29, 8 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah that pretty much tracks with everything I've seen, see alt-lite for a bit about the not-overtly-racist spinoff of the alt-right. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 01:51, 9 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 10 January 2018

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Third paragraph: please replace [[Leslie Jones]] with [[Leslie Jones (comedian)|Leslie Jones]]. The former link is to a disambiguation page. 134.223.230.155 (talk) 21:03, 10 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

DoneᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants Tell me all about it. 21:07, 10 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]