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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by 84.46.53.140 (talk) at 12:39, 15 April 2019 (→Adult and atheist categories: talking about Category:United States, not the article). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Template:Vital article

sasha grey

According to her blog, she was on CBS. Can anyone confirm this?

A: Yes. She was interviewed on the TV show 'The Insider' which runs on CBS. It's been posted on YouTube.

A: Yes. She has a much more indepth and current interview on VBS.TV in the shot by Kern section. Unfortunately this site was deemed as spam for a yet to be declared reason. Should be noted that Sasha Grey's website links to this interview, and is the only link on her site besides her myspace blog, where she links to the same VBS.TV interview.

______________ Is she catholic or agnostic? (see her Myspace page)

A Brazilian magazine, EleEla, says that she was born in Fortaleza, Brazil. http://eleela.terra.com.br/aberto/423/artigo40652-1.htm?o=r (in Portuguese)

Apparently the archive bot wants a timestamp, and born in Brazil is clearly fictitious. –84.46.53.16 (talk) 07:06, 12 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]
If VBS.tv was about the famous Vice interview, the video is now listed as a reference for her David Bowie fandom. Getting ready for a GA nomination on March, 14. –84.46.53.245 (talk) 13:23, 4 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I tried to find "The Insider" (CBS) on YouTube and with Google searches, but only one result was interesting.[1] Unionpedia is a red link (bad sign), but used on more than ten enwiki pages. Inconclusive, but not good enough for a WP:42 reference from my point of view. The "concept maps" on this site can be interesting to find new references or to check facts.[2]. –84.46.53.245 (talk) 18:50, 4 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
It was v=dRDpXQYNQGo published on Sasha Grey's channel in 2006 (her site only linked to it), and she deleted those videos later. Apparently WayBack doesn't have it, and it cannot emulate a YouTube login or a YouTube vintage 2006 "yes, I'm old enough" check: google:v=dRDpXQYNQGo. –84.46.52.151 (talk) 22:41, 7 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
WayBack has the FLV: "Sasha Grey insider interview". misssashagrey's channel on YouTube. December 24, 2006. Archived from the original on November 1, 2010. {{cite web}}: Unknown parameter |deadurl= ignored (|url-status= suggested) (help) –84.46.52.207 (talk) 02:30, 13 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
WayBack did not catch v=nrYcjaKWS1I (her famous manifest) before she deleted it. v=gCBZ96mVgGw was archived (don't bother, it's not too interesting.) –84.46.52.134 (talk) 21:35, 21 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Pendu Sound Recordings

FYI, the last red link on Sasha Grey can be now resolved by Draft:Pendu Sound Recordings, please kick it if you can, it's one of several possible showstoppers for a GA review request.
Other issues: All references have to be checked and fixed with WAYBACK if they don't work as expected. The #Activism section should cover Equal Pay Day and maybe Planned Parenthood, unless that ends up in a hopeless tangle with donations from selling her merch. The relevance of more than 1.2M Twitter followers is unclear (for me), feedback requested on enwiki doesn't care how many friends you have. –84.46.53.62 (talk) 15:36, 3 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

GFE 2009 for #Acting

— unsigned image to the right added by 84.46.52.217 (talk) 12:54, 30 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

GFE 2009 beats Broken 2007 for #Acting. –84.46.52.115 (talk) 11:08, 31 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Something about Sasha Grey in art and culture as pop icon or similar is also missing, maybe as new section under #Personal life mentioning Richard Phillips, Richard Prince etc.[3] Not sure how to tackle this: –84.46.53.251 (talk) 06:51, 5 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Richard Phillips (American painter) covered in #Appearances (major parts of this stub are about Sasha Grey.) –84.46.53.245 (talk) 15:10, 4 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Ditto for the Matteo Bittanti page linked above, intentional red link here, a teacher + researcher at the California College of the Arts mentioned on 14 enwiki pages should be notable. –84.46.53.245 (talk) 15:38, 4 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
That didn't make it, self-published source by Matteo Bittanti not quoted anywhere else as far as Googlebot can tell it for queries Duellanti 2010 "sasha grey" or "Matteo Bittanti" "sasha grey".<shrug />, yet another demo why I considered "patrol" or "review" rights (not here) as honour (checking contributions by other editors), and disliked "auto-patrol" rights (because it bypassed 4 eyes for my own contributions), GB fan ^.^b –84.46.53.245 (talk) 22:28, 4 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Twitter followers (no matter what the number is) are irrelevant without WP:42 reference (consensus). –84.46.53.3 (talk) 00:31, 24 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]
This edit covers Equal Pay Day, seven years + one day too late (I didn't bother to find a source for March 8, 2012, assuming a PEBKAC on my side). Oddly this edit is tagged as possible BLP vandalism. Nice, if that accelerates the review here, but stupid, if it distracts reviewers from more urgent issues. So far I figured out that this tag is always triggered by YouTube videos as references, now I wonder if that feature is implemented as "using the word 'video' on a BLP", which would be extremely minimalistic. –84.46.53.128 (talk) 07:15, 9 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Planned Parenthood added to #Activism, there are just too many good references to drop it silently here, only because I consider any merch as abomination. –84.46.53.128 (talk) 09:54, 9 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Instead of sources for Richard Prince I found Julião Sarmento and more important thejuliettesociety.com with a better bio than on her home page.T-39h –84.46.52.207 (talk) 16:07, 12 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Two references incl. Dazed should do for A4 (2010), just in case here's 3rd reference:[4] –84.46.52.207 (talk) 19:04, 12 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Chris Hanley was a dead end, or I didn't grok it. –84.46.52.207 (talk) 20:55, 12 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
All references checked: 57 revisions started on March 14, 22:17 PDT (2019-03-15 05:17Z); now nominated as good article in category Media and drama. Total changes since 2018-12-09: 315 revisions from 43,870 bytes with 96 references to 62,186 bytes with 134 references. –84.46.52.92 (talk) 19:01, 15 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
FYI: Talk:Playboy#Sasha Grey. –84.46.52.92 (talk) 08:44, 16 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Fixed, now listed as celebrity on Playboy, and because Playboy is already wikilinked in the body no further #See also list is required at the moment (Grey is on two Playboy lists.) –84.46.52.28 (talk) 14:51, 7 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]
And Talk:Pop icon#Emma Peel + Sasha Grey. –84.46.52.48 (talk) 15:38, 28 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Updated status from 2018-12-09, old 43,870 bytes with  96 references, new 71,545 bytes with 153 references.
Updated status (before review), was 62,186 bytes with 134 references, now 71,545 bytes with 153 references. –84.46.52.103 (talk) 17:09, 20 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Updated status (before review), was 62,186 bytes with 134 references, now 73,113 bytes with 155 references. –84.46.53.4 (talk) 01:06, 23 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Updated status (before review), was 62,186 bytes with 134 references, now 76,072 bytes with 163 references. –84.46.53.181 (talk) 03:35, 25 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Double fault: Pendu Sound noticed dark ambient and "death-dub".[108], 2nd Pendu red link four lines below the 1st has to be unlinked. Reference [108] is a dupe of [12], all-caps in [12] is ugly, otherwise it can be recycled.
Unforced error: the 2011 video game Saints Row: The Third, which was released in November 2011, unsourced + irrelevant release month, for Linux it was allegedly 2016. –84.46.52.217 (talk) 13:23, 29 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Minor nits fixed, the major stuff noted in the next paragraph follows in April. –84.46.52.44 (talk) 18:22, 31 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I think I never tried to find a review for book II instead of III, AXS:[5] Same author, same site, 2016 (fresh for S.G.), about music:[6] Modeling for Interview (magazine) Germany:[7]. In #Awards wikilinking Babysitters (adult film) makes sense (redirect to section, won in a film category), it should be also added in #Career near her 25th AVN awards. –84.46.52.217 (talk) 19:22, 29 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
All added / done: –84.46.53.186 (talk) 10:57, 6 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Potentially good hypocritedesign.com source about Richard Phillips' short film still discussed (RS or not) at the TEAHOUSE. –84.46.53.186 (talk) 12:30, 6 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Meanwhile archived, I've added HyDe (Trial and Error), 2nd use as source on enwiki. –84.46.53.140 (talk) 10:21, 15 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I've removed two WP:RS/N#HuffPost contributors sources, one reference replaced by a Pendu source copied from the draft. –84.46.53.140 (talk) 10:31, 15 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Review

@Bilorv: Maybe move this section to a better place. Talk:Sasha Grey/GA1 is apparently the review working space, and I'm not supposed to answer there. The user talk pages of the IP nominator or the reviewer are not ideal, maybe this section here is good enough.

  • The split and the restraining order were discussed here. The consensus for the TMZ source was apparently "not good enough". If that goes into the article we should also add a 2018 Twitter #whyididnotreport source, which might be unrelated.[8] Otherwise, sure, the source in the lede about the split from aTelecine can be added in #Personal life as general split. (That was actually done the day before yesterday 23:11, 22 March 2019 (UTC))
  • {{fact}} was added by me replacing a "verification failed" source, or IOW, I didn't simply miss it before the nomination. (11:51, 20 March 2019 (UTC))
    Fixed. (11:54, 20 March 2019 (UTC))
  • Lede improved: photo book + trilogy + notable works=… (as on d:) + known for=… (05:47, 18 March 2019 (UTC))
  • No summary of book I of the trilogy from me before I've read it. (05:47, 18 March 2019 (UTC))
  • HelloTheMushroom edit summary: no WP:42 source (author works as illustrator at behance.net/hellothemushroom), but A review beats NO review. Some 3rd parties noted her.[9][10][11][12][13] (06:18, 18 March 2019 (UTC))
    • It's not correct that "A review beats NO review". Wikipedia can only include content from reliable sources. If there is no such content, then we don't include any reviews and that's fine. — Bilorv (he/him) (talk) 10:11, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
      The source is maybe significant (as in long + detailed, with a link to a review of book I by the same author), presumably independent (I'm not aware of any other connection with Grey), maybe reliable, e.g., I just found that it was quoted by amazon on their product page under "Editorial Reviews" as This was an enjoyable piece of erotica and a great read to make those intolerable commutes in London a little bit more tolerable. (Sara Hello the Mushroom).
      But there are no other uses of this site on enwiki, also no mentions of "Hello the Mushroom" / "Sara Doucette" / "HelloTheMushroom". I'm not deleting this reference only because nobody else on enwiki used this blog as source so far, go ahead if you hate it. The edit summary was intended as fair warning, and now I think that "no WP:42" was wrong: The notability of the author and her blog as source is unclear, and certainly not yet established. –84.46.52.208 (talk) 12:08, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  • @Bilorv: I've fixed the broken (maybe by me) "official retirement" blurb. It needs no better source, because she actually retired almost two years earlier (=no more new films), tried to be a producer for some time, stopped this when it didn't work out as planned, and the money she was willing to risk was spent: Sasha Grey on the 'first big failure' in her life, moving on on YouTube. There is no exact timestamp for her de facto retirement. Caveat, I have 76 videos in my Mismade Girl  playlist,[14] and 84 posts in a "privately shared" (unlisted) Mismade Girl  G+ collection.[15] Not coming to this review without lots of ammo, but I never shot for GA so far (since ~2005 :-) (09:14, 18 March 2019 (UTC))
    • It does need a better source. All article content needs to be verifiable. Surely there's a source to back up "Grey filmed her last adult film at age 21". Also, the Facebook link has stopped working for me; archiving the source is possible but a better secondary source would be optimal. — Bilorv (he/him) (talk) 10:11, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
      Fixed with source for de facto 2009, "official" 2011 with one month too late Fox News. (11:51, 20 March 2019 (UTC))
  • Minor comment 295 is covered by 371 near the end of the #Career intro before the #Appearances. (14:57, 18 March 2019 (UTC))
    IAFD is not a reliable source. — Bilorv (he/him) (talk) 15:17, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    Obviously unreliable, your 295 is also IAFD. I'm not aware of any better count, the IAFD source was already used on the page when I started with it, therefore I recycled it for what I wanted to say, she directed two adult films (based on the IAFD credits mentioning 371), I added both with titles + references. If you hate it anyway the IAFD blurb can be deleted, keeping the then unsourced 2 with titles and references as is. Saying "directed at least two" as if we don't know better would be very near to a WP:WEASEL (in spirit). –84.46.52.208 (talk) 15:33, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    I would imagine some interviews with Grey include descriptions of her body of work and I'd be surprised if none ever estimated how many films she was in. The IAFD source should be removed and the RogReviews sources already cover the other information. — Bilorv (he/him) (talk) 17:33, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    Okay, and of course "your" AFD is not "my" IAFD, sorry. (18:56, 18 March 2019 (UTC))
    Fixed. (11:51, 20 March 2019 (UTC))
  • Minor comment: post-modern feminist, that others see her as feminist was already covered in the first paragraph of #Personal life (14:57, 18 March 2019 (UTC))
  • Minor comment: Unsourced "controversial" removed from her Equal Pay Day video, the 1st source has only "sends a mixed message" in its title. (14:57, 18 March 2019 (UTC))
    That's not yet stricken in GA1#Minor, no idea why. (19:46, 21 March 2019 (UTC))
  • Minor comment: Guessing, the #Other awards aren't as well-known/famous as the awards in the table, the separate list of awards and nominations uses a similar layout for ages, no reason for me to pick another layout in this case: I rearranged the list article some weeks ago. (14:57, 18 March 2019 (UTC))
    This isn't the reason I would assume; the page simply categorises by award type and Grey didn't garner enough of the award types in "Other awards" for them to get their own section (there's no point having a table with one row). The lists on this page need to be merged. — Bilorv (he/him) (talk) 15:17, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    Fixed with HTML 3.2 table layout, #Other awards gone. (00:11, 19 March 2019 (UTC))
  • GFE Pierrot le Fou+Vivre sa vie reworded, starring Anna Karina (her 2006 alias) added, long Soderbergh quote trimmed, GFE has its own page. (00:21, 19 March 2019 (UTC))
  • Facebook April 2011 replaced by Fox News May 2011, last adult film 2009 with Mandatory.com source (they say 300 adult films, ignored, they quote TMZ, also ignored). (04:54, 20 March 2019 (UTC))
  • Anna Karina, Lars von Trier, Werner Herzog, and Antonioni added to cineast blurb, "Sascha Grey" (sic!) removed from infobox aliases, Chemosphere with new source added to #Appearances. (04:54, 20 March 2019 (UTC))
  • Added another The Juliette Society review to #Books confirming the 1st review, Juan Luis Buñuel with wrong first name ignored, Catherine is not Sasha and Serowa is not Grey. (05:01, 20 March 2019 (UTC))
  • The IMDb source for Membunuh: Murder is required, because the Indonesian film is also known as Shrouded Corpse Bathing While Hip-Shaking. There is a good Jakarta Globe source for this film. (05:20, 20 March 2019 (UTC))
    @Bilorv: All other IMDb sources (there were three) are replaced. (19:34, 21 March 2019 (UTC))[reply]
  • Unclear "formerly" nit near her own "LA factory girls" agency rephrased, there are no other sources, the FB page is an empty placeholder. I think that she really represented herself, and that 9 to 5: Days in Porn mentioned it, but Google isn't helpful. She certainly had or has a #Lotta continua firm or agency or whatever it is, but the LinkedIn profile is seriously dead, not even a photo. (06:16, 20 March 2019 (UTC))
  • @Bilorv: Added #Lotta continua motto in the lede, replaced I Melt with You IMDb by IndieWire reference. (07:13, 20 March 2019 (UTC))[reply]
  • All unreliable sources fixed (or improved in one case), cf. GA1#Major. (10:41, 20 March 2019 (UTC))
  • All minor comments and nits fixed, catholic per suggested name="Esquire" source. (11:51, 20 March 2019 (UTC))
  • Long relationship with Ian Cinnamon added to #Background with the Playground 149 page for his PoV as 1st source, and the Rolling Stone PDF for her PoV. (13:49, 20 March 2019 (UTC))
  • Added Rotten Tomatoes to two films with the missing Would You Rather. Replaced "Quit" IMDb by another shaky reference, if that's not okay plan B is QUIT - Official Trailer 2 on YouTube. (16:58, 20 March 2019 (UTC))
  • Added Heat of the Night to #Music in the DJ paragraph. (16:58, 20 March 2019 (UTC))

–84.46.52.8 (talk) 21:30, 17 March 2019 (UTC) 00:21, 84.46.53.4 (talk) 23:11, 22 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Hi, I don't understand why you can't comment on the review space—as far as I am aware, this is allowed. But I'm happy to comment wherever you prefer (please keep pinging me though!). The TMZ source is indeed not good enough but I presented a source from Complex and I've found a couple more from The Daily Beast and Daily Dot. These sources together (and any more we can find) are reliable, I believe, and mean that it's worth commenting on the restraining order and the accusations Grey made. However, unless reliable sources have discussed Grey's #whyididnotreport it then I don't believe it has a place in the article (secondary source coverage is how we determine which facts about a subject are significant enough to include in Wikipedia). — Bilorv (he/him) (talk) 21:39, 17 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
I've replied to a couple of your points inline. — Bilorv (he/him) (talk) 10:11, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
@Bilorv: No problem. Just in case, I'll be busy with other stuff tomorrow, and obviously I can't fix all issues today. –84.46.52.208 (talk) 14:57, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
@Bilorv: I'm not touching Саша Серова (Serowa) in the DB source on the Саша Грей (Grey) BLP, cf. w:de:Talk:Sasha_Grey#Als_Propaganda-Figur. Admittedly I "lost" (in the rough of a 2:1 rough consenus) on dewiki wrt "BLP issue".
Especially not after finding her #whyididnotrepot tweet on February 9, this agitprop was abuse. There are lots of other cases, where folks try to use her click-bait value without her consent, e.g., for obscure music. This BLP needs no #Trivia section, Madonna (the page, my model for some stuff here and on Emma Blackery) also has no #Trivia. A source claiming that she is "flat chested" instead of androgyn or similar, or "D-grade",[16] infuriates me. If folks disagree they can use DB as source, it's "only" yellow (not red) on WP:RS/P, with lots of entries in the WP:RS/noticeboard archives. I'm not volunteering to use DB as source.
DD as source is generally nice (and green on WP:RS/P), but like the Complex source based on the TMZ article about an unidentified court case, that's against the archived talk page consensus here, long before I started my GA quests (Grey + Blackery) in December. –84.46.52.208 (talk) 01:56, 19 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Batch2

  1. Clumsy "somewhere in between", yes, but Kinsey scale has no grey, and I have no better idea how to express this. Actually it's a verbatim quote, but she said straight and gay instead of heterosexual and homosexual. Willing to replace this by her plain English if desired... –84.46.53.4 (talk) 16:24, 22 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    Fixed by Bilorv. –84.46.53.95 (talk) 02:59, 9 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  2. I Melt With You, she played a minor role, reviews of the film belong on I Melt with You (film). I've added the wikilinked director, apparently they both like Nine Inch Nails and (from the NYC Pendu crowd) Chelsea Wolfe.
  3. Shrouded Corpse Bathing While Hip-Shaking: No reviews apart from the Indonesian reference, even the English title is unclear (IMDb uses Membunu: murder).
  4. Would You Rather (film) covered by Rotten critics consensus and on its wikilinked page. We have the quote of Amy played by Grey in the Rotten reference.
  5. China Test Girls: No wikilink, no entry on Rotten, the reference is the best available background info.
  6. Saints Row: That's two wikilinked video games, reviews belong on the relevant pages, she's only voicing one of the major protagonists in these games.
    Added THQ interview video as reference. –84.46.53.95 (talk) 02:59, 9 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  7. Durch die Nacht mit ...: That's a documentary, some Rotten Tomatoes links (this + two others for Grey) lead nowhere. I'm aware of one German review roughly stating that the two persons (Sasha + a lady from Hamburg) were very different, the German introvert kind of overwhelmed by the more extrovert Grey. Is that interesting?
    Added Herbertstrasse, Hamburg, nightlife, good enough. –84.46.53.95 (talk) 02:59, 9 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  8. Entourage: That should be handled on the wikilinked 7th season list. It isn't, but I've also not seen any significant review about Grey's role apart from episode summaries. –84.46.53.4 (talk) 18:04, 22 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    7th season got fresh + rotten tomatoes. –84.46.53.95 (talk) 02:59, 9 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  9. aTelecine: There are six pages for major works of this band, detailed descriptions on who did what when belong on these pages. She was a co-founder of the band, and in his post-split interview Cinnamon claimed that he did most of the later work. She got the dog. That dog is arguably relevant (on Personal life) if desired, it has its own Twitter etc. accounts, even a (dead) YouTube channel.
    No pets/cats/dogs on BLPs per Talk:Emma Blackery#Missing info. –84.46.53.95 (talk) 02:59, 9 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  10. We have better sources for her contributions to ex-TG (vocals covering Nico) etc. (mostly vocals), and detailed info about the Consequences of love for Death in Vegas (co-producer, video director, lyrics, singer.)
    Richard Fearless wikilinked, Talk:Death in Vegas 2006…2018 rewritten. –84.46.53.95 (talk) 02:59, 9 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  11. Some parts of the music will make more sense when Draft:Pendu Sound Recordings replaces the red link, it's often the same NYC Pendu sound crowd including Grey since aTelecine. –84.46.53.4 (talk) 18:32, 22 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    2 months old draft added to 5 WikiProjects. –84.46.53.95 (talk) 02:59, 9 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  12. The Equal Pay Day video "controversial", that was a WP:SYNTH by me based on the title of the first reference, and I removed it after your earlier observation and after checking that the content doesn't justify this adjective. –84.46.53.4 (talk) 18:52, 22 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  13. Is there any more on Grey's political beliefs? Of course, dozens of Twitter messages, but not in MSM as far as I recall that. One earlier op-ed (she was the author) is covered in Personal life. I think she'd be a good journalist if she wanted to, but apparently she wants to be a photographer (cf. Neü Sex and her instagram photos.) Completely un-encyclopedic at the moment. –84.46.53.4 (talk) 19:08, 22 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    After adding a new source to #Activism with "more than only Sanders" I've removed it again,,[17] in essence it quoted the old source, and the reliability of mofopolitics.com based on only two other enwiki uses is unclear. WikiLinking Lotta Continua would be unwise. –84.46.52.75 (talk) 13:35, 23 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    If it's not shown to be particularly significant then there may actually be no need to mention it at all. Just a thought... -- Begoon 14:02, 23 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    If you're talking about the motto, I think it's significant, see #Lotta continua below and the three references for it on d:Q2709. Only a wikilink could be misleading, Continuous Struggle is a lousy translation, in German it would be Der Kampf geht weiter, English The fight goes on, in the direction of the Churchill quote in Fool's Overture.[18] –84.46.52.75 (talk) 07:24, 24 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    One of the greatest tracks in music history. I saw the live Supertramp tour back in the day. No, really I just meant her support for Sanders, the content in the reference seems to be just "(Sasha is a Bernie supporter)" in a long interview, but I have no strong feelings on its inclusion or not. -- Begoon 07:37, 24 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    Looking at her Twitter today she's following him or at least re-tweeted his info about the Yemen war resolution (2019-04-04). –84.46.52.225 (talk) 01:29, 8 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  14. The widths of the Award table are still very out of proportion: They are perfect for me tested with two browsers, the first column widths are all determined by the arguably worst cases. The last column co-starring gets by definition the rest, forcing it into a smaller width would break it for me. I now specified column widths (percents) in the header, but as this has almost no effect for me I have no idea what it does for you. Wild guess, your browser window is far wider than 1600 pixels. –84.46.53.4 (talk) 19:22, 22 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  15. IMDb only used as source for their idiosyncratic "Membunu: Murder" title, this source always was only about their title not matching the title in the Indonesian source, explained above; and in the original edit summary by me added + reviewed months ago, please check [19] and the next three edits for the background. –84.46.53.4 (talk) 19:45, 22 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    Pointless reference replaced by wikilink. –84.46.53.95 (talk) 02:59, 9 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  16. Genesis 2009 vs. 2008: Both, #1 2009, #6 2008, possibly more TBD on demand. –84.46.53.4 (talk) 20:11, 22 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  17. Australians queen of the night reneeruin.com is used as source on five pages including Sasha Grey, as noted in the edit summary. –84.46.53.4 (talk) 20:28, 22 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    Resolved
     – archived RS/N inquiry. –84.46.53.95 (talk) 02:37, 9 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  18. The original summary mixed assessments nailed it, excluding one now removed source about another film: I've restored the good status-quo-antea for the four remaining GFE critics, we made it worse. There are now two other critics (actually three, you mangled two into one, I removed the extra, because I can't see the Orlando Weekly page anymore) covered by The Week, and another review by Violet Blue. –84.46.53.4 (talk) 20:47, 22 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  19. I found the G4tv video as archive.org/details/g4tv.com-video38325 and used this as archiveurl=…, another source for "grey" based on the Kinsey scale. –84.46.53.4 (talk) 21:05, 22 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Final

  1. /GA1#Final paragraph 5 of 6 fixed. –2A03:2267:2:0:B8ED:C598:A71B:4D19 (talk) 05:00, 26 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  2. For today I've had it with paragraph 4 of 6, the trimmed and rewritten lede makes sense for me. –2A03:2267:2:0:8498:22F:A2F6:437F (talk) 07:50, 26 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  3. All overlong quotes trimmed, stripped, or removed, paragraph 3 of 6 addressed. –84.46.52.41 (talk) 08:34, 26 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  4. WP:RS/N#Renee Ruin matches paragraph 1 in the final comments. –84.46.52.48 (talk) 16:07, 27 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
    Fixed based on Just another blog. –84.46.52.48 (talk) 20:45, 27 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  5. Paragraph 2 asking for "more detail" about #Acting and #Music is resolved for the latter, so this reverse count-down will go up to 7. –84.46.52.48 (talk) 06:57, 28 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
  6. Paragraph 2 #Acting also done, Entourage 7th season had fresh/rotten tomatoes, critics for films where Grey had no leading role ignored. –84.46.52.48 (talk) 13:59, 28 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Casting

@Moxy: I'm not so sure about (old): Grey was cast for the seventh season of the HBO show Entourage, where she played a fictionalized version of herself  vs. (reverted): Grey played a fictionalized version of herself for the seventh season of the HBO show Entourage, apart from the bogus "for the" instead of "in the", played  supersedes was cast, doesn't it?
Looking into the edit history for this minor nit I saw that I didn't kill my earlier wannabe-improvement as planned, was cast  without played  doesn't cut it on this BLP. –84.46.52.2 (talk) 20:30, 11 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Fixed today. I found no references for the two Kayla Crow  teasers on Vimeo directed by Paul Street, so that's not (yet?) good enough.[20][21] In one of the newer interviews used as references Grey mentioned that she wanted to play in an action movie. –84.46.53.121 (talk) 11:20, 11 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Inferno by Matthew Wilder starring Grey (2011) also was never realised; four YouTube clips exist. –84.46.52.103 (talk) 15:01, 20 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Inferno was released, and should be added to #Acting.[22] –84.46.52.75 (talk) 10:18, 24 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
It was not released, IMDb uses a 404 as final judgement. I've added it anyway to the #Filmography, because Linda Lovelace is interesting, although Grey didn't play her. 1st clip:[23], 3 more on the playlist. –84.46.52.75 (talk) 11:38, 24 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Lindsay Lohan explains a part of the Inferno debacle, "later replaced while in court mandated rehab"; another part is Lovelace (film), at some point in time Inferno was just too late. –84.46.53.181 (talk) 03:23, 25 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
The Girl from the Naked Eye (2012) never had a reference, fixed with RogerEbert.com / Roger Ebert. Durch die Nacht mit … had "1 episode" instead of … Sasha Grey und Mary Ocher, fixed + wikilinked. New section #Series with one table for "Television" + "Web series" under #Filmography, IOW, one section with one entry merged into another section with four entries. Oddly Open Windows (2014) was only listed in #Filmography, added to #Acting with a review and some facts. –84.46.53.181 (talk) 03:18, 25 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
This Ain’t Star Trek XXX info imported from dewiki (#Acting 2009 + #Filmography.) –84.46.52.233 (talk) 22:09, 25 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Selected adult films

At the moment the #Filmography contains "normal" (non-adult) films. I'd like to add one or two adult films: Broken starring Grey with David Navarro has no page, but it's mentioned on both BLPs and won a major adult award.[24] Counter-example, Fashionistas has a page, but "part 2" is only mentioned in one statement, and Grey was one of many actresses, irrelevant for the filmography, and covered in the prose + in the awards + in the separate list of awards and nominations + in the separate page for the corresponding AVN award ceremony.

The second candidate could be Circa 82, trailer available on Vimeo, if references exist. This might be (based on the trailer) one of the "punk-porn" films covered in the The New Erotic: Art Sex Revolution documentary. All I know about the latter is what the reference says, i.e., I haven't seen these films, but maybe it's as Matteo Bittanti wrote in 2010 (linked above): Sasha Grey forces us to rethink several expectations about art & pornography.

As long as it's WP:42, of course. The link was already rejected, because it's self-published, and even Googlebot + itwiki didn't help me with the notability of the Italian "Duellanti" magazine, where Bittanti published his thoughts in 2010. –84.46.52.151 (talk) 21:38, 7 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Added Broken, if it's relevant for #Career it's also okay for #Filmography. –84.46.52.92 (talk) 06:39, 15 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Pirates II: Stagnetti's Revenge is a similar case, 15 AVN awards, none directly related to Grey, added to #Career, but not to #Filmography. The removed "required review" protection makes me nervous. –84.46.53.181 (talk) 05:27, 25 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Atheist

A very short MaximoTV YouTube clip vintage 2010 for atheist isn't good enough for a BLP; some folks confuse not this god with no goddess at all. How about existentialist with one of the many sources for what she said instead of the shaky WP:SYNTH-atheist? –84.46.52.92 (talk) 06:09, 15 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Updated to existentialist with fresher source, old source kept as is. –84.46.52.103 (talk) 10:37, 20 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Grey vs. Gray

Okay, I knew that there were at least two inspirations for Grey, certainly not related to the much later 50 shades. It's in my 3rd reserve ammo depot chrome://bookmarks/Bookmarks bar/.plan/ToDo/SG, because "no picture/video" is unsuited—or rather, boring—for sharing on G+, LinkedIn, or blogger in the 2010s.[25] Figuring out what I thought about this source, it cannot be archived, WayBack as client gets an error (400).

That an artist widely recognized as nerd ("el cerebro del sexo") has a spelling error—intentional or otherwise—in her nickname never made sense for me. She mostly sticked to the Dorian Gray legend in public. Clear case of "gotcha" in the paused GA review, I didn't expect some kind of expert in the Fields of Grey, blog label FoG.[26]

Of course I now have to add the other legend. All good spells have many facets, at least two reasons for Grey are perfectly fine, and Sasha Gray is anyway already listed as alias in the infobox. –84.46.52.208 (talk) 10:09, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Done. –84.46.52.208 (talk) 21:00, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Resolved
 – by Bilorv in this edit; I didn't grok grey wrt the Kinsey scale. –84.46.52.115 (talk) 12:11, 31 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Lotta continua

Fun stuff not related to the GA review, but now might be a good time to discuss it: d:Q2709 (I can type that Interwikilink without checking) has a motto "Lotta continua" with an Italian reference. She actually used it (instead of "regards" or similar) in mails, IIRC she also had a company with that name. –84.46.52.208 (talk) 18:18, 18 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Implemented (end of lede) with Italian source. –84.46.52.26 (talk) 07:18, 20 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Now in #Personal life, not wikilinked, Lotta Continua doesn't express Never surrender. –84.46.52.233 (talk) 17:29, 25 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
She has MAS. LC. on her Twitter profile, and LC is exactly what lotta continua says, and agrees with itwiki, therefore "I dare" wikilink it now. For MAS I'm not sure what it is, but Memento Audere Semper would fit (found on it.wiktionary.org/wiki/MAS - eyes wide shut for the fascist connotations.) –84.46.52.225 (talk) 00:59, 8 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Steam5 and Bilorv: There are some stylistic differences between contributors to this page about wikilinks. Apparently all agree that excessive wikilinking is wrong and/or ugly, there are some -4 edit summaries. In two cases I tend to disagree:

  1. Clearly wikilinks ending up in another section of the same page are slightly odd. OTOH these wikilinks will continue to work if somebody decides to expand Neü Sex into a separate article again, or creates a proper page with cover images etc. for The Juliette Society. Some critics say that it's better than the 50 Shades of Grey, this could realistically happen. [[#Books|Neü Sex]] instead of [[Neü Sex]] would be worse, nobody suggested it.
  2. work=[[…]] instead of work=… is a related issue: Readers should see in the popup that the referenced work has an enwiki page, and therefore is by definition notable. In all references of the same work, same idea as using authorlink=… in all references of the same author. Limiting these wikilinks to some first reference is a maintenance headache, references are moved around, removed, re-inserted, etc. all the time.

Remotely related: Obviously all titles of works should be in italics on this page, even if the title is a wikilink. For Quit I just picked ''Quit'' ([[quit smoking]]) instead of ''[[Smoking cessation|Quit]]'', rendered as Quit (quit smoking) instead of Quit. Matter of taste, please fix it if you don't like it. Some magazines like Penthouse and Playboy are also wikilinked in italics, others are only wikilinked, and there's no obvious (for me) rule why folks prefer what on this page. –84.46.52.134 (talk) 15:24, 21 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Linking to e.g. The Juliette Society is okay on another page, but not part of the same page, as it forces the browser to reload the same page (an unnecessary delay for those with slow internet connections). If an article is created at The Juliette Society, then (and only then) links on this page can be added. I'm agreed with your second point. — Bilorv (he/him) (talk) 18:00, 21 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Normally I assume that my connections are the worst, from ISDN when others had DSL, to UMTS (mobile broadband) or "free WiFi" today, when others have LTE or FTTH. But yes, a redirect can be expensive, "https" killed ordinary caching. –84.46.52.134 (talk) 18:47, 21 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Meanwhile… all magazines and titles are in italics. –84.46.52.134 (talk) 19:27, 21 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
@Aia94: If you have another plan please explain what it is, I've reset your 6 double quotes to 6 italics for now. –84.46.52.233 (talk) 01:34, 26 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Apparently accepted. –84.46.52.48 (talk) 16:13, 27 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

TMZ and the restraining order

@Steam5, Iamcuriousblue, and Bilorv: FYI, I've put TMZ on the BLP/Noticeboard. –84.46.53.4 (talk) 00:48, 23 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Iamcuriousblue: The recent GA review kind of forced engagement back in, but I think it is not too bad, Grey used the word "fiancé" at different times. I still hope to nail WP:RS/P#TMZ (yellow: caution, instead of red: stop) on BLP/N. –84.46.52.48 (talk) 14:12, 27 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
FWIW one contributor on BLP/N wrote about TMZ that No "celebrity gossip" news is ever "reliable", the entry is now archived. –84.46.53.186 (talk) 02:57, 6 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Great work

I think it's worth adding a comment here to thank "84" for their excellent work on this article. It's on my watchlist for some reason (I probably reverted some vandalism or something), and I've hugely enjoyed seeing it evolve so very well recently. Thank you. -- Begoon 13:48, 23 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Awards

I've tagged Adultcon with {{multiple issues|{{primary}}{{notability}}}}. For the AFGW awards I found a "Best Orgy Scene" matching the Fashionistas Safado: The Challenge, we already had that as AVN award in the table; I simply added a row for another award. The AFGW award for the Best Blowjob Series went to "Gangbang My Face" (Evil Angel) with Sasha Grey as only one of many other actresses in part 1, not unlike the Fashionistas, but an award for a series, not a scene, therefore I didn't add that. –84.46.53.181 (talk) 03:02, 25 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The Adultcon "award" 2007 is BS: Adultcon tried this once in 2007. Grey did not get any of their awards, and "Adultcon Vice President Renaud West estimated the attendance at 'maybe 100,' adding, 'It was not well-attended, but the right people were there.'"[27] She was listed as one of the top 20 hardcore porn actresses, and I had to fix the XBIZ {{cite press}} EL on Adultcon with WayBack to check at least this irrelevant fact.[28] Maybe it was a consolation price, far below any standard for Sasha Grey after 2007. –84.46.52.115 (talk) 12:47, 31 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Adultcon 2007 "top 20 honor roll" removed, 16 back to 15 awards. –84.46.53.186 (talk) 01:22, 6 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]
Now {{multiple issues|{{external}}{{notability}}}}. –84.46.53.95 (talk) 20:12, 8 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Exactly four enwiki articles mention TLARAW: Sasha Grey#Awards matching the List of awards and nominations received by Sasha Grey, Mason (director), and (unsourced) Wasteland (film). I think the two sex toy awards could be also removed as not notable, unless we find some source that she was involved in the engineering or at least present at the award ceremonies. –84.46.53.186 (talk) 02:44, 6 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]

FYI: Talk:List of awards and nominations received by Sasha Grey#TLARAW. –84.46.52.225 (talk) 02:00, 8 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]
TLARAW sex toys removed per Special:Diff/891212178/891212307, the WikiProject Awards is still on attention=yes for a third opinion and one last TLARAW award for Mason (director). –84.46.52.219 (talk) 05:54, 11 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Infobox image

At the moment the infobox has "caption = Grey in 2010", should that be "caption = Grey for G4 at AEE 2010" or similar? Technical, "image_upright = 1.11" works for me, please remove it if it doesn't work for you. –84.46.52.48 (talk) 14:58, 27 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Implemented. –84.46.52.44 (talk) 17:53, 31 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Adult and atheist categories

Four adult categories were unclear, and I removed them "immediately" (= years too late) per policy. Are former porn stars supposed to be categorized like active actresses, or does that make no sense? This must be some solved problem, I just don't know what the solution was, and where it is documented, e.g., not in Category:American pornographic film actresses.

Next issue, assuming that one category is okay, which should it be? Is "bisexual" better—in a cybernetical sense, least loss of information—than "American"? For "pornographic film actors from California" I'd assume that it's better than "American pornographic film actresses", a small loss for the gender info vs. a huge win for the location.

After that it gets bizarre, not unusual in the Fields of Grey, is "LGBT adult models" better than "American female adult models", and why on earth do these rotten cats try to mix four unrelated concepts (occupation, location, gender, sexual preferences)? Categories for cinéastes, vinyl collectors, or industrial musicians would be far more interesting than this ex-job/geo/sex mash-up.

I've also replaced two "atheist" categories by one "existentialist" category. Nobody knows if she's an atheist (as in "no god or goddess at all"), a part-time atheist (as in "still praying occasionally"), or even belongs to Category:Christian existentialists, but I know that BLP-cats are no BS-bingo for best OR-guesses. –84.46.53.95 (talk) 19:08, 8 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Commons OVERcat
Ditto, two LGBT cats retired, covered by two corresponding bisexual categories, the locations (CA or US) are also covered in other cats. –84.46.52.142 (talk) 01:14, 13 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]
@Steam5: Your edit summary Please don't remove the categories, This is for her nationality and the occupations makes no sense for me, the B in Bisexual is the same as in LGBT, the former is a proper subset of the latter (aka "sharper"). We have twelve American and five California categories for the nationality, and as noted above two occupations (musician and writer) are already covered by two corresponding sharper Bisexual categories.
If what you want is some verbatim "United States" in the categories, maybe because "American" could be unclear, it's not done, almost all subcats of Category:United States use "American" or the name of the state, e.g., "Actresses from California" => "Women in California" => "California society" => "Society of the Western United States".
If you think that "California" could be unclear, we can move Sasha Grey down to "Actresses from the Greater Los Angeles Area‎", that's not Mexico. Ditto for other American/Californian categories. What we definitely do not need are LGBT categories to get a U.S. nationality. –84.46.53.140 (talk) 12:33, 15 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]
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