Talk:Halo 3

User:David Fuchs/talkpage

PLEASE NOTE!

I've archived some of the older conversations, but due to the lax posting method, it's pretty disorganized. From now on, please start new topics at the bottom! I'm going to just make this easier with a link up top. David Fuchs 21:56, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

Brute Weapons

Bungie has already announced that Brutes will have their "own class of weapons", how come their weapons are combined with the Covenants? I think that protecting this page also is a bad idea, because everyone who can edit it is probably a n00b on halo. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 67.50.86.61 (talk) 23:45, 5 December 2006 (UTC).

Brutes are a part of the Covenant, so their weapons are Covenant weapons. Also, its a rather silly assumption to say that those who are allowed to edit this page are "n00bs" just because they are registered editors of Wikipedia; I've been playing Halo for years and own copies of much of the available media, including all four novels and the HGN. If it bothers you that you can't edit the page, sign up and wait a few days. Unprotecting the page isn't a good idea because of the sheer amount of vandalism and incorrect info that gets added in. Peptuck 16:47, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

They have their own class of weapons because (SPOILER WARNING) since the events of Halo 2 the Brutes and a few other Covenant races are now seperated from the others since the Elites learned of the Prophet's betrayal. So, being their own entities now, they should have their own weaponry. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.236.200.31 (talk) 00:52, 9 December 2006 (UTC).

They're still "Covenant," as both sides still view themselves as members of the Covenant; the humans still certainly view the two factions as Covenant, just that they've started shooting each other as well as humans. And how are we going to handle the weapons that cross over between both factions? Plasma pistols, beam rifles, fuel rod guns, carbines, etc. are all weapons used by both sides, and are all "Covenant". Its simpler just to keep it all under one blanket definition of "Covenant equipment" as that is what it is: gear used by aliens in the Covenant. That they have started blasting each other does not mean they aren't Covenant. Peptuck 03:47, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

If British people moved from Britain, in your terms they'd not be British anymore.

It's a war. Does that mean that if Iraq has a war with the USA, that makes Americans aliens and Iraqis human (or vice-versa)? No. It's the same sort of thing. Just cos they're fighting with each other, it doesn't suddenly transform them into a different life-form.

the x button?

did u ever wonder what the x button in halo 3 will do? i think i know what it is going to do! in the new halo 3 trailer the master chief throws a grenade at his feet and then creates a force feild around himself(not the shield that he useually has on from the first and second halo). then, he runs out of the dust blasting at all the brutes in his way. i think that the x button is going to create that force feild around u to give more of an edge to the battle. i also think this feature is going to be for the single player verson of the game only. not for the multiplayer,because if it was for the multiplayer battles it would really suck! if anyone thinks differente please contact me.

—The preceding unsigned comment was added by THE6DARK6MAN (talk • contribs) 03:40, 5 December 2006 (UTC).

Um...No. 1. The bubble isn't mobile 2. IT'S NOT A FRIGGIN GERNADE 3. That be too much of an advantage 4. It'd suck in singleplayer as well!

Well since he can carry four guns now maybe x is for switching between your duel wield and your single wields.Spartan282 04:10, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

I would expect X to be run, like in GOW it's A. The way they have reduced the amount of each grenade you can carry leads me to believe that the shield will indeed be a grenade. Stercus Accidit 17:15, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

They said that the grenades were reduced to make people move around more in multiplayer, and I agree, the shield bubble would imbalance multiplayer too much. And Spartan, you can't wield four guns. They took liberty with some of the shots and showed the Spartans with holstered sidearms, but it's still the same two-three DW config as last time. David Fuchs 20:31, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

Stay on task guys, this is sounding pretty forum-ish.--SeizureDog 01:31, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Yeah it is... but isn't that the point of this page? (<--that sounded forum-ish too... =D) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 60.228.170.8 (talk) 11:54, 12 December 2006 (UTC).

No, not really. It's for discussing improvements or changes (hopefully also improvements) to the article. James086^{Talk | Contribs} 13:20, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Legendary edition

The article said that the legendary edition will include the first two Halo games. This is incorrect according to all sources I've read, which say it will include cinematics from the first two games. If anyone has different information, please link me to them. Doytch 04:34, 3 December 2006 (UTC)

beta now playable?

On November 30, 2006, known Bungie employees (New0001, Evil Otto…Ect) Xbox live usernames (i.e. gamer tags) have been showing the following:

Playing Pimps At Sea (Alpha) Sailing, Yarr!

http://nikon.bungie.org/news.html?item=17301

http://live.xbox.com/en-US/profile/profile.aspx?pp=0&GamerTag=New0001

Stercus Accidit 20:11, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Can people not read the word "Alpha"? 137.205.74.252 01:12, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

Seems to be the alpha of the beta... Stercus Accidit 17:04, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

No, it's just the Alpha test, which follows the pre-alpha build that EGM and other publications played, and precedes the Beta test this spring, which will be open to the public. There is no such thing as an alpha of a beta... the concept makes no sense.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Development_stage

Now the Alpha test on the other hand, IS playable, but only to Bungie and select Microsoft employees (approximately 10 000 total).

137.205.74.252 17:11, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

shield bubble

After watching the video closly, I see that the bubble did not dissipate after sustaining damage, but rather was in perfect shape after the mortor exploded. It actually closed automaticly after 5 seconds, which leads to believe that it has a 5 second energy source that dissipates after activation. Could someone change this, as I am a new member. ThePheonix9

It will probably get a lot of discussion, but I'll change it anyway for now, as I can see it sort of retaining a shape as well. Bronzey 01:42, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

[Edit conflict] I was also thinking this, the shield comes down after the wraith shot had exploded, just the dust was falling. I'm guessing is is indestructable for (5 seconds?) then disipates, of course you must be stationary which means enemies can take aim, but it saves you in situations like that. James086^{Talk | Contribs} 01:47, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

How do you know it didn't dissipate. It vanished as if it were drained of power. It could be that it may not be destroyed by the mortar immediately, but the mortar drained it of enough power that it couldn't sustain its charge. ANOTHER thing is that it could be indefinitely sustained, and that it only dissipates when you move. But it does dissipate, hexagon by hexagon. JAF1970 17:22, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

It does dissipate, yeah, but if the Plasma Mortar's impact were the real cause of it, then the shield would have gone down immediately. Instead, Master Chief is still stationary and the shield remains in its fully expanded state for a considerable time after the mortar impact. Amalga 18:25, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Incorrect- it's common sci-fi (and Halo canon) that shields linger and fade when they take overwhelming damage. See also: Covenant ships' shields flickering away after taking nuclear hits in the novels.75.7.201.218 15:34, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Not just sci-fi. Most electronics. Like my CD player. When the batteries are low, it just doesn't turn off right away. It has problems maintaining power, then eventually refuses to start up. JAF1970 03:38, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

Flicker, yes. I am quite aware that the UNSC-issued and Covenant standard energy shields flicker when they take damage. The same cannot be said for the "Bubble Shield," however, where it maintains its structural integrity for a considerable amount of time without showing any sign of wear or give. It almost seems to "wait" until the smoke clears before it shuts down. Even if the mortar were to have drained it of power upon, it's something that would have happened quickly if not at an instant. Amalga 04:43, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Shooting Star

Haven't seen any discussion of this anywhere, but I am pretty sure the thing mentioned as a "shooting star" cannot possibly be one. It only moves across maybe a couple of degrees of sky in the few seconds it is visible. If it really were a meteor it would be moving much faster. It seems more likely that it is a rocket of some type, but obviously this is speculation. --ABVS 12:50, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Bungie says it themselves it was a rocket.

Kids in ad are not CGI. They're live actors

According to [1] JAF1970 17:53, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

And Bungie said the ad was CG. But seriously, look at the little girl when the camera is next to her face; how is that not CG? Peptuck 19:32, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Whoa, wait, nevermind. Bungie just said they are real kids; Joystiq is right, they were just lit up to make the transition less jarring. Peptuck 19:56, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

That's kind of scary. James086^{Talk | Contribs} 03:48, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Just to be specific, that wasn't Joystiq - it was 1UP. Joystiq just reported the video by the 1UP editors. JAF1970 03:36, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

Beta listings?

Is the beta listings section encyclopedic? It's just a list of sites to go get the beta. Remember Wikipedia is not a repository of links. James086^{Talk | Contribs} 13:12, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Agreed. I removed them. — TKD::Talk 15:35, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Overspecific Weapons

Can we please form an agreement to get rid of the overspecific weapons listings? For example: "SRS99D S2-AM Sniper Rifle (modified from the original)". If it were modified, wouldn't that make it a new variant, and therefore it would have a different designation? Similarly, the "M247 GPMG General-Purpose Machine Gun" was probably copying Halo 2- which again poses a problem, as modifications are likely to make it have a new designation. Aside from this, virtually all of these details are likely fandidates for fancruft, as I think 90% of the people who see the words "pistol" or "shotgun" have some idea of what the weapon is and what it does without needing a designation at all. Can't we just leave the weapon names and be done? I don't see many people struggling to press Bungie on whether the Plasma Rifle is going to be the "Covenant SCB232 Blue Avenging Holy Light" or the "Covenant SCB232d Blue Avenging Holy Light Which is Marginally Different from the First One". Er, you get the idea. When you say "Plasma Rifle", everyone basically knows what you mean. There's no need for designations. 75.7.201.218 16:06, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

I agree wholeheartedly. When the game is released and the manual comes out (or we are given bungie approved designations for the halo 3 versions) lets go crazy, but until then lets just state what is known for a FACT. Also, i love the names :) WookMuff 21:12, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

I agree too. It's just kinda confusing. We want to see "Battle Rifle" not "DMSKGMNSIT395". We want to know the weapon, not it's whole name. If I were greeting you, and my full name was Sam David Shilson-Josing, or something, I would say, "Hi, I'm Sam." not "Hi, I'm Sam David Shilson-Josling." —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 60.228.170.8 (talk) 11:50, 12 December 2006 (UTC).

Vandalism

Somone Cut The ESPN Starry Night trailer article in Half. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by IAngelofFuryI (talk • contribs) 01:52, 10 December 2006 (UTC).

Sorry, didn't mean to do that. I was editing and when I saved noted that it had, indeed, been cut in half. I later found it was caused by a less than sign and an exlamation point. Its fixed now though. Sorry about that. 71.138.254.60 04:34, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

Mongoose/Warthog (Again)

Since it seems to be a subject of contention, I think it fair to being up (for a second time) the issue over the Warthog/ATV. My understanding is this:

• The wreckage behind MC when the camera does the 360 pan is a Warthog, judging by size, wheels, windshield, and the winch on the front. (screencap)
• The vehicle visible when the plasma mortar hits is a Mongoose, judging by frame, foot pedals, the front bumper, and vehicle shape. (screenie)
• The two vehicles are not the same. One is lying on its side, while the other is lying upside down (as you can see under it). Note the differences in front bumper, wheels, and body shape; the two cannot be the same vehicle.
• Therefore, by deduction, there are two pieces of wreckage near Master Chief: a Warthog and a Mongoose.
• To quote Amalga: "TheSittingDuck has it right. Master Chief is thrown from the Warthog and winds up less than 10 scale-feet away. He turns away from the Warthog to retrieve the Assault Rifle, and at this point is facing the general direction of the Mongoose ATV which is more than 10 scale-feet away. When the camera pans out, the Warthog is obscured from view on the left-hand side of the shot."

The article states (currently) that MC is "...taking note of an overturned, damaged Mongoose ATV he'd presumably been thrown from. Although it may appear to be a Warthog from one angle, when the camera switches angles it is revealed to be an ATV, or definitly [sic]] not a Warthog."

I believe that MC was thrown from the Hog, and there's a Mongoose laying nearby. As such, I have reverted the above statement several times. On my last revision, I realized it was the third one in 24 hours, and 3RR lay dangerously close. Therefore, I open this topic up (again) for community consensus to decide what, exactly, the trailer contains (apologies for having been thickheaded to not have thought of this earlier...). Ourai ^т _с 23:58, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

Someone has to know a little bit about 3D modeling to notice the difference. People are too quick to listen to OMG HALO3 CMERCAIL forum threads. Note the distance between Master Chief and the vehicles, and what direction he's facing. When we see the Warthog, its wheels are still spinning and the Chief is no more than seven scale feet from it, looking away from the Warthog to the Assault Rifle.
When he turns to the Assault Rifle, his back is to the Warthog and remains that way when he stands up and activates the shield. He does not turn around whatsoever. When the camera pans out, it reveals that the Mongoose ATV, also overturned, is about fifteen to twenty scale feet away. The Warthog is simply not in the shot because of the camera angle. Bungie and Digital Domain are smart enough to where they don't suddenly overlook such a huge discrepancy.
Pre-rendered footage, also, does not have much of a tendency to have "bloopers" that are so noticeable. Props stay in the shot. Unless Bungie says something different, this explanation stands. Amalga 06:02, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Apperantly none of you have read anything about it. The screenshots confirm it is an ATV, there is no warthog in the picture. The wheel of the ATV is similar to the Hog, but the design is really different. It needs to be changed back to ATV Superbowlbound 16:33, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

The screenshots don't "confirm." I've read plenty about this footage and I've read nearly every theory on its contents, specifically the Warthog vs. ATV debate. I don't simply believe what I read, especially if it's not coming from Bungie or Digital Domain's mouths. I analyzed the footage on my own and went through it frame by frame by frame, over and over again. So please do not talk to us as if we don't know anything. My explanation is not at all arbitrary--it came from actual research, and not idle glances. Amalga 04:25, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

So what you are saying is that it is OR? Hmm... WookMuff 04:31, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Yes, it is original research. Because everything else to be read about it is original research. Superbowlbound implied that we know nothing of the subject and have read nothing. My point was, I've read everything that was said about it and I decided to perform my own analysis of the shot.

The Warthog is mentioned in the article as the vehicle the Chief was thrown from because that is where evidence points to the most. In the shot featuring the Warthog, the Chief has his back facing to the vehicle and is kneeling about six to seven scale feet away. When he picks up the Assault Rifle and stands, he does not rotate at any angle--his back remains facing to the Warthog. He maintains the same orientation when he spikes the Bubble Shield and ducks. At this point, he is now facing the Mongoose which is at least ten scale feet away from him. Relative to the Chief, the Warthog and Mongoose ATV are at opposite ends--the Warthog is simply obscured from the shot. Logic and basic knowledge of 3D modeling.
I'm willing to bet that Digital Domain and Bungie would have reviewed the ad several times and notice such a huge blunder that two drastically different vehicles suddenly traded places inexplicably. Amalga 04:55, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

I have read about it, and I read "Warthog" on 1UP and Frankie's post (the most recent one circulating). Agreed, there is a Mongoose in the second shot with a vehicle. But in the first shot--when the camera does the pan of MC--I believe it's a hog, based on this screencap. The greyish patch on the front is, if you look closely, very similar to the winch on the front of the Hogs in Halo 1 and 2. There is no such winch on Mongooses (Mongoosen?) Also, look at the wheelbase: the suspension visible doesn't match that of the Mongoose. Also, the windshield is clearly cracked in the first vehicle, while no windshield, cracked or otherwise, is in the second vehicle. The wheels are too similar, I think, to be the grounds for a final judgement, but the other factors are. Ourai ^т _с 23:20, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

с, here's some screens. As you can see the Warthog's wheels are wide and almost rectangular in shape. The Mongoose ATV's wheels, however, feature a lighter design: they are not as wide and are rounded, much like motorcycle tires. They also feature a three-point "spoke." Clearly two different vehicles, each featured alone in two different camera angles. Amalga 04:36, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Spartans

Guys, Spartans have been CONFIRMED BY BUNGIE. Websites (e.g. 1UP.com) and magazine staff (e.g. Official Xbox 360 magazine) that were invited to Bungie to play Halo 3 were all shown a 17-second clip of ACTUAL GAMEPLAY. A.I. controlled Spartans were in that gameplay, no mistaking it. Please don't remove them again. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Ras29 (talk • contribs) 04:45, 12 December 2006 (UTC).

Bungie has denied that there will be AI in Halo 3, or at least said that it's doubtful. The gameplay footage that the 1UP guys (and gal) saw was most likely either singleplayer footage (where NPCs have to be controlled by the AI) or multiplayer footage with other people playing. Unless there's an explicit Bungie quote that there will be multiplayer bots, nothing new has been introduced. Ourai ^т _с 05:39, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Ras29, please cite that. Just saying "this website" is not sufficient proof, and does not mean "confirmed." Amalga 06:05, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Correct. In fact, I've read over the same information provided by 1UP.com and haven't seen any mention of the presence of another Spartan. Peptuck 06:39, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Okay, I'm quoting from the Official Xbox 360 Magazine here - "When Bungie said blink and we'll miss it, they were right. But then we spotted them - Spartans! It looks like for the first time in a Halo game, the Master Chief will have backup in the form of Spartan warriors. An A.I. Controlled Spartan ran over to control a new type of vehicle we've never seen before.". (crap sorry... forgot to sign in... but it's Ras29 here. And in reply to Ourai, it's definately a single player vid they were talking about, seeing as there were mentions of Cortana, Brutes, the Master Chief, and references to the story line, as well as refering to this video as "the 17 seconds of single-player footage.")—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 60.228.170.8 (talk) 11:36, 12 December 2006 (UTC).

I'm doing some checking around to verify this, but I will say that with available information, if there even is a Spartan it cannot be an S-II, because there aren't any left that we know of. All of the surviving S-IIs excepting Maria-062 are either locked up in the Forerunner Dyson Sphere or dead. If it is a Spartan it is likely an S-III from Gamma Company, as most of them were not on Onyx during the events there. Peptuck 14:30, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Okay. BTW, the above quote was from the Australian OXM, but it might be in the US one too, I dunno. Just in case you read the OXM and you can't find it. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 60.228.170.8 (talk) 01:08, 13 December 2006 (UTC).

Couldn't it just be a marine in similar armor? I remember people mistook some Halo 2 marines for Spartans after they saw the new armor prior to Halo 2's release.

Cluttered ESPN ad

The ESPN ad section is cluttered by verbosity (that is, saying the same stuff over and over) and grammatically a nightmare. Clean it up and simplify. It looks really amateurish. JAF1970 18:12, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Agreed. I modified the section slightly: the first paragraph explains how the ad was created, while the second two describe content. Also cleaned up a bit of the prose so that it reads less like a frame-by-frame analysis and more like an overspecific encyclopedic article. (Once Halo 3 is released, the trailers sections should be merged into one section detailing timeline and general overview of trailer content, since there'll be other things to focus on.) Ourai ^т _с 23:40, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Demo rumor needs squashed

This line, "On October 23, 2006, Game Informer reported that in the first half of 2007, a multiplayer demo of Halo 3 will be released over Xbox Live.[14]" should be removed as first, the reference is just based on rumor and unfounded speculation. It's also noted the reference is from October, before the beta was announced. As such, there is no reason to speculate a demo releasing yet. Whoops, forgot to sign it... sorry folks, first day here.Momo Hemo 10:56, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

I half-agree. There is a 'demo' being released, but it isn't really a demo. It's a public beta testing, and a limited number of people will be selected play it, so it won't be released on Xbox Live. more info on www.bungie.net.