Jump to content

Talk:Drudge Report

Page contents not supported in other languages.
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This is an old revision of this page, as edited by 96.239.90.181 (talk) at 01:54, 7 June 2020 (→The irony). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

RfC: Should the article say that Drudge Report has been described as far-right?

Should the following bolded language be removed from the article?

"It has been variously described as conservative, right-wing, and far-right."

The supporting sources for the "far-right" descriptor are:

  • Jones, Janet; Salter, Lee (2011-11-10). Digital Journalism. SAGE. ISBN 9781446254042.
  • Ellis, Emma Grey (May 18, 2017). "The Seth Rich Conspiracy Theory: A Tale of Two Filter Bubbles". Wired.

--Dr. Fleischman (talk) 16:21, 3 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Survey

Neutral would not using a fringe label for him in the lead. NPV also indicates we describe disputes if there is weight to the claim, otherwise it is WP:UNDUE and WP:FRINGE. This also touches on WP:LABEL, which far-right easily qualifies under. PackMecEng (talk) 23:18, 12 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Move to body or remove Far right is often seen as a derogatory label. It seems the sources for the claim are of limited weight. Springee (talk) 00:12, 13 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Remove - per PackMecEng. It's risible to call Drudge Report "far-right" as it doesn't meet any objective definition of the term, but I'm sure it will end up staying anyway. WP doesn't do NPOV on political topics. Edgespath24 (talk) 09:59, 15 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Remove Undue. I also don't like the weaselly, "has been described as" passive voice either. When ever you write like that, add the attribution and see if it looks DUE when the attribution is up there. In this case it doesn't. It's better to just call it whatever it's uncontraversially described as by a reasonable majority, without any attribution or passive voice. Edaham (talk) 10:51, 15 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Remove Undue weight, I don't like the weaselly wording either, and I agree with @Edaham's proposal. (Summoned by bot)  — Mr. Guye (talk) (contribs)  05:29, 22 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Remove per WP:LABEL. Minor passing references should not be used in this manner in an encyclopedia. For some everything that disagrees with their viewpoint is "far-left/right"/"alt-left/right". Buffs (talk) 18:45, 22 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Obvious keep — This is undisputed in reliable sources. It belongs in the lede. We should also remove "has been described as". What does that mean? It's WP:WEASEL. Carl Fredrik talk 21:42, 22 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Remove - The standard for "far right" continues to be redefined by people who seem to have an agenda in doing so. Specifically tell me where Drudge has posted a link to the Daily Stormer. These increasingly zealous edits by left-wing editors wishing to ride in on their high horse to tell us all concerned with the truth about why their view of politics is "indisputable" by linking to some clown writing for a random rag of a paper is destroying the reputation of this encyclopedia. "Conservative" perfectly defined Drudge Report's leaning for years. This should apply as long as Huffington Post is labeled Marxist, since the objective standards for once commonly agreed upon labels have changed for political expediency. Bigeyedbeansfromvenus (talk) 03:53, 23 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Remove per WP:Undue. Conservative is supported by sources, far-right is not. One or two passing references by opinionated sources does not give far right due weight to be included. Marquis de Faux (talk) 16:45, 23 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]
It is verifiably false to say far-right isn't supported by sources. The sources are reliable. Wired and SAGE are reputable publishers. --Dr. Fleischman (talk) 19:32, 28 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • remove. It's totally fine to call it Conservative, even right-wing, but "Far-right" is more subjective, value-laden, and likely to cause repeated objections. FWIW, I think it's also poor form to shoehorn value-laden adjectives like conservative and liberal into the first sentence, before even defining the damn subject. I'd much like to see articles like this begin: "X is an American newspaper or news website, full stop. Founded in 1992, it has won several awards. It has a (liberal/conservative) editorial stance, and predominantly features (liberal/conservative/libertarian/Martian) writers..." Slapping a label onto the first sentence, even if it's a widely agreed label, seems to serve only the interests of those seeking to disregard it right off the bat. Significant biases and controversies should certainly be described in the article, maybe even mentioned in the lead, but should not be the first thing a reader sees. --Animalparty! (talk) 19:21, 2 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • Remove In writing journalese, especially headlines, authors often go for the shortest words possible, even if they are not the best ones to use. For example, "Sticks Nix Hick Pix." And all writers tend to alternate phrases in order to lessen tedium. Instead of every fifth word in an article being "conservative," they thrown in a few "far rights" for variety. Reasonably competent readers are able to determine what the writer means through the context in which the terms are used. Furthermore, the comment is original research, we would need a competent reliable source to make that observation. TFD (talk) 00:39, 10 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • Remove per reasoning of Animalparty (talk · contribs) also per WP:LABEL. Perhaps a section named reception to include such opinions, giving them whatever due weight may allow, would be a better place for that type of content. Some sources may verify the website is conservative, some might verify the website is right populist, or whatever. This would be similar to how many media articles have.--RightCowLeftCoast (talk) 06:43, 23 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Extended discussion

Edaham, outside of the scope of this RfC, if the "and far right" is removed from the sentence, do you have any suggestions to improve this sentence? A whole bunch of sources call DR right-wing and a whole bunch call it conservative. --Dr. Fleischman (talk) 17:16, 15 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

  • Yes DrFleischman. How about, "The Drudge report is an American conservative, right-wing news aggregation website"
    I've put "American conservative" together and linked to conservatism in the United States, as the editorship is made up of conservative editors but it is an aggregation of news which includes sources from outside the US. It is uncontroversial to flatly state that they are right wing without attribution as it is well cited in the body. Anything further than that requires attribution and would be pushing against the UNDUE boundary. The whole "variously described" part, is a text book example of weaselly phrasing. What ever adjectives you put after a statement like that are going to sound weak, controversial and ambiguous. Edaham (talk) 02:38, 16 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]
    works for me Buffs (talk) 18:47, 22 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Just an aside: While I don't agree with where this RfC is going, my edit is to be read as reverting what is essentialy a WP:VANDAL edit, which also removed that the site is a news aggregator. Do what you will now, but the IP edit was disruptive. Carl Fredrik talk 19:39, 23 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Lead of This Entry

The first sentence in this Wikipedia entry reads:

The Drudge Report is an American conservative,[4] right-wing[5] news truth spreading website.

Compare to the opening paragraph for the entry on Huffington Post:

HuffPost (formerly The Huffington Post and sometimes abbreviated HuffPo)[2] is an American news and opinion website and blog that has localized and international editions. It was founded in 2005 by Andrew Breitbart, Arianna Huffington, Kenneth Lerer, and Jonah Peretti.[3][4] The site offers news, satire, blogs, and original content and covers politics, business, entertainment, environment, technology, popular media, lifestyle, culture, comedy, healthy living, women's interests, and local news.

Notice a difference?

Only the Drudge entry uses not one, but two political adjectives as a description in the opening sentence. Both entries provide information on their political leanings (Drudge is right; HuffPost is left) further into the entry, but only Drudge leads with it.

The HuffPost entry could lead with:

HuffPost (formerly The Huffington Post and sometimes abbreviated HuffPo)[2] is an American liberal, left-wing news and opinion website and blog that has localized and international editions.

The Wikipedia guidelines state that Wikipedia entries should have a neutral point of view. The choice of words used in the opening sentence for the Drudge entry and the fact that information is included in the opening sentence does not come across as a neutral point of view.

P.S. I had never seen the Drudge website before, but I am a regular reader of HuffPost. This critique does not come from a partisan angle. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Auctoris (talk • contribs) 00:35, 17 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Neutral point of view does not mean even-handedness to subjects but that articles should reflect how they are usually described in reliable sources. TFD (talk) 04:17, 17 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]
The HuffPost is described as being liberal in its Wikipedia article. So reliable sources have stated that it is liberal. Should we move that adjective to the opening sentence? I ask that question honestly.Auctoris (talk) 17:14, 17 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Lead change to "right-leaning"?

Right now the opening sentence calls it a "conservative, right-wing news aggregator". "Right-wing" is a politically charged word, and two of the three sources cited for it may be problematic. I was recently involved in a discussion on the HuffPost article that resulted in a change of the opening sentence. The descriptor "politically left-leaning" was added to the opening sentence. Further discussion of the sites politics is discussed in the appropriate section of the article.

I know we all want Wikipedia to be as objective as possible. There is at least one reliable source that uses the term "left-wing" to describe the HuffPost. But that is a politically charged word and not helpful to include in the HuffPost article.

I suggest mirroring the wording of the opening sentence in the HuffPost article and describing the Drudge Report as a "politically right-leaning news aggregator". Then, like the HuffPost article, the Drudge Report's full political leanings are discussed in the appropriate section of the article. What do you think? -- Auctoris (talk) 04:45, 20 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The irony

Why was "conservative" removed from the first sentence? Has the source suddenly become mainstream or centrist? GaɱingFørFuɲ365 00:55, 13 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]


Well, wouldn't we all agree that now it is more than just a little bit absurd that this is in the lede: " . . . run by Matt Drudge . . . generally regarded as a conservative publication . . . though its . . . political leanings have recently been placed in question"

Talk about, understatement, hyperbole, and obfuscation!

It may used to have been conservative (even up to 2017), but now it is obviously the opposite.

Considering, for example: the beacon flashing "Drudge" red-bolder-headline today [2020-6-6] is: "ROMNEY WILL NOT SUPPORT TRUMP IN NOVEMBER!", I'd say that Drudgereport at this point is in the same category as Huffington Post. 96.239.90.181 (talk) 01:53, 7 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Slight issues with article

I would suggest that "(last known)" be dropped from the "Owner" field, seeing as how the article states that Drudge has been confirmed to still be the owner in the last paragraph of "Political leanings". The sentence "Site viewership is also down nearly 30 percent in that same time-frame." also appears to be out of place with the rest of the lead, perhaps that could be fixed also. 91.129.108.3 (talk) 20:33, 23 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Talk:Drudge_Report&oldid=961181886"