Talk:Renée Vivien

France Unassessed

	France portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject France, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of France on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.FranceWikipedia:WikiProject FranceTemplate:WikiProject FranceFrance
???	This article has not yet received a rating on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.
???	This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

I think that the Symbolists would have been surprised to learn that Vivien was a Symbolist. She is not normally included as part of the movement.

Poems by Vivien were included in Bernard Delvaille's anthology La Poésie Symboliste. (ISBN 2221501616) There may have been a strong element of "wannabee" in Vivien's verse, which is why I wrote that she "took to heart the mannerisms" of the school, and "claimed allegiance" to it. -- Smerdis of Tlön 04:14, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

I am not sure how reliable Delvaille's anthology is as a source of mainstream ideas about Symbolism. I saw the table of contents of the book which included some unusual choices of authors. I am getting a copy of the book and will see what he has to say before making a judgment. Vivien is usually associated with the Sapho 1900 group.

In the meantime, it is worth noting that Vivien was born in London. Her mother was American and her father British.

American poet?

Born in England, to an American mother and a British father; grew up in both Long Island, London and France; spent significant amounts of time in all three countries; she wrote in French. Does that make her "an American poet who wrote in the French language"? Did she identify herself as a particular nationality? In the absence of choice by her to identify as one nationality or another, I would be inclined to call her an British/American/French poet (in whatever order) -- or even just "a poet who wrote in the French language". The rest of the article discusses her (complicated) national status enough; adding the adjective "American" is not only questionable but also redundant.