Talk:Conceptual model

models of concepts and models that are conceptual

The term “conceptual model” is used in various disciplines and many areas of study. Across this spectrum the connotation and denotation of the term can be radically different. This is apt to be very confusing for the general reader. I think the current article can play a valuable role in the disambiguation of the term for the general reader.

I think a distinction needs to be made between “models of concepts” and “models that are conceptual”. This is a distinction that I made in one of my management papers, however, it may have been made by an earlier author that I have forgotten about. If anybody knows of such an author, please provide a reference.

Another factor is the intention of the people who developed the modeling method. Some conceptual models are intended to represent only concepts, others are intended to represent only objects and events in the physical world, a third type is intended to represent concepts and/or physical objects, finally the developers of some modeling methods are confused about whether they are representing concepts or physical objects.

If nobody objects I shall apply these distinctions to categorize the various models listed in the article.

For the moment I shall limit this work to the conceptual models used in information systems.--Logicalgregory (talk) 05:14, 13 January 2011 (UTC)

Discussion at WP Philosophy

The status of this article is currently being discussed at Wikiproject Philosophy--Logicalgregory (talk) 04:06, 11 February 2011 (UTC)

This whole article seems WP:Synth

This whole article seems WP:Synth... but it is well written and each part can have RS added to it, so I am in no way suggesting deleting it. It's a good place for many fields to hang their nonphysical models on, I just did. PPdd (talk) 02:15, 12 February 2011 (UTC)

Model disambiguation

In the model disambiguation page, a conceptual model is described as "a model that uses ideas to represent other ideas". This is similar to what I have been saying however, there are no citations so I do not know where the editor (whoever it was) got the idea from. Logicalgregory (talk) 10:11, 16 February 2011 (UTC)

I think it is supposed to mean "nonphysical model" as a catch all. This article is really just an advanced disambigation subpage for "nonphysical models". "Conceptual model" is actually often used in model selection in statistics applied to psychology, meaning statistical model, e.g., here[1], and in many other fields is synonymous with "mental model" in the sense of a model in the mind (not of the mind). 12:10, 16 February 2011 (UTC)

I did not know that. Perhaps it might be a good idea to mention the fact that the term "conceptual model" is used in statistics. Something like "In statistics the term 'conceptual model' is often used to refer to ... blah, blah, blah". In statistics however, I think one can also have models of mental events as well as physical events. For example, a statistical model of customer behavior (a model that is conceptual, because behavior is physical) and a statistical model of customer satisfaction (a model of a concept, because satisfaction is a mental not a physical event).--Logicalgregory (talk) 15:45, 16 February 2011 (UTC)

LOL, you got me. There can be a conceptual model "ofthe mind", as used in psychology when it uses sttistics to model the mind. Embarassingly, I picked up an incidental masters degree in operations research, which modeled just that kind of stuff, e.g., regarding queuing. I will get to including your suggestion re stats useage in a little bit. PPdd (talk) 15:54, 16 February 2011 (UTC)

Merger proposal

I propose that Modeling and Simulation: Conceptual Modeling Overview (M&S:CMO) be merged into Conceptual model. I think that the content in the M&S:CMO article can easily be explained in the context of Conceptual model, and the Conceptual model article is of a reasonable size that the merging of M&S:CMO will not cause any problems as far as article size or undue weight is concerned. While M&S:CMO has a name that reads like it is about a book, this is not the case, it is simply an article with a weird name. M&S:CMO is a little abstract, but will provide an overview and more references to Conceptual model. --Andrewaskew (talk) 23:27, 2 January 2013 (UTC)

Merger done. --Andrewaskew (talk) 04:37, 9 January 2013 (UTC)

"Semantic Model" and a model of concepts

I searched Wikipedia for the phrase "Semantic Model" and was surprised to be redirected half way down the page of the entry for "Conceptual model" (specifically to "Data Models") where I can find no reference to the term "Semantic Model" at all. I find this rather confusing as Wikipedia has a separate entry for "Semantic Data Model".

Also, I thought that a "Semantic Model" is a model or network of "concepts", not a conceptual model. This raises the question above under the title "models of concepts and models that are conceptual". Should Wikipedia have a separate entry for "Semantic Model" (separate from a "semantic data model") rather than a confusing redirect half way down this article? CoeurDeHamster (talk) 12:36, 19 March 2013 (UTC)

Clarification of semantics in lead

Before my edit:

Semantics studies are relevant to various stages of concept formation and use as Semantics is basically about concepts, the meaning that thinking beings give to various elements of their experience.

After my edit:

Semantic studies are relevant to various stages of concept formation. Semantics is basically about concepts, the meaning that thinking beings give to various elements of their experience.

Did I guess right? — MaxEnt 18:09, 25 March 2018 (UTC)

Merging General model theory into Conceptual model

There is a short but reliably sourced article on the theory of modelling under General model theory that would make a good fit for this page. It could be described in context here, and the Conceptual model page is itself not too long. Jarble (talk) 14:18, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

  Y Merger complete. Klbrain (talk) 09:28, 14 August 2022 (UTC)

According to Model, there are physical and conceptual models. The General model theory treats both. Should it therefore not be moved to Model? Oliver Gramberg (talk) 20:37, 9 March 2023 (UTC)

Moved to Model. Oliver Gramberg (talk) 16:51, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

Possibly incorrect definition

The lead section defines a conceptual model as a "depiction" of a system: in other words, a visual representation. Is this definition incorrect? Jarble (talk) 07:51, 21 January 2022 (UTC)

Etymology doesn't define meaning; wikt:depiction definition 3 describes the use in this context. Klbrain (talk) 09:23, 14 August 2022 (UTC)