Talk:Ukraine
This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Ukraine article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: Index, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12Auto-archiving period: 30 days |
Q1. Why is Ukraine listed as the second-largest country in Europe? France is. (Or alternately, Denmark is.)
It's an ambiguous statement, and depends on whether you include non-European territories or not, and whether you include disputed territories or not. The totality of France (which includes French Guiana) is larger than Ukraine, but the European part of France (Metropolitan France) is smaller than Ukraine. Although Denmark is in Europe, Greenland is in North America. Q2. Kyiv or Kiev?
This is a topic for discussion at Talk:Kyiv. The current transliteration is based on the Ukrainian spelling of the name: "Kyiv" (pronounced "KEE-ev"). The Russian version is "Kiev" (pronounced "KEE-ef") is associated with the Russification of Ukraine. Source:."Slownik geograficzny Krolestwa Polskiego i innych krajow slowianskich". Druk „Wieku” Nowy Świat. 1883. Archived from the original on 5 March 2022. |
Ukraine was one of the Geography and places good articles, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
This level-3 vital article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale. It is of interest to multiple WikiProjects. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Warning: active arbitration remedies The contentious topics procedure applies to this article. This article is related to the Balkans or Eastern Europe, which is a contentious topic. Furthermore, the following rules apply when editing this article:
Editors who repeatedly or seriously fail to adhere to the purpose of Wikipedia, any expected standards of behaviour, or any normal editorial process may be blocked or restricted by an administrator. Editors are advised to familiarise themselves with the contentious topics procedures before editing this page. |
On 28 July 2022, it was proposed that this article be moved from Ukraine to The Ukraine. The result of the discussion was not moved. |
This article has been viewed enough times in a single year to make it into the Top 50 Report annual list. This happened in 2014 and 2022. |
This article has been viewed enough times in a single week to appear in the Top 25 Report 11 times. The weeks in which this happened: |
|
This article links to one or more target anchors that no longer exist.
Please help fix the broken anchors. You can remove this template after fixing the problems. | Reporting errors |
2nd Largest country in Europe?
[edit]The claim in the introduction is that Ukraine is the second largest country in Europe after only Russia. This page lists its total area as 603,000 km², which is a figure including all occupied territories. The Wikipedia page for France gives it an area of 643,000 km². If occupied territories are excluded this may fall behind Spain and Sweden too but it's consistent to use internationally recognized borders. I think the claim should either be revised to 3rd or removed altogether as it doesn't seem important enough to state in the introduction. 75.252.22.168 (talk) 17:31, 30 December 2023 (UTC)
- Ukraine country profile - BBC News Europe's second largest country. ManyAreasExpert (talk) 17:33, 30 December 2023 (UTC)
- Please see List of European countries by area. I believe only the area in Europe is counted for size in Europe. Peaceray (talk) 19:33, 30 December 2023 (UTC)
- That is how this specific trivia item is calculated. I have also seen "largest country entirely in Europe". Not sure what either might inform the reader more than the raw area and the map does. CMD (talk) 03:51, 31 December 2023 (UTC)
- Why don't we just state that it is the largest country located entirely in Europe? This is clear and undisputed. --User:Khajidha (talk) (contributions) 06:37, 31 December 2023 (UTC)
- Because it's a specifically convoluted trivia item that mixes geographies with cultural conceptions to say very little. CMD (talk) 13:41, 2 January 2024 (UTC)
- I don't see how that objection applies to my phrasing and not to what is already in the article. Either take it out or phrase it clearly. The status quo is just poorly written. --User:Khajidha (talk) (contributions) 14:19, 2 January 2024 (UTC)
- It applies to both phrasings, and most other specific rank records. CMD (talk) 14:35, 2 January 2024 (UTC)
- I don't see how that objection applies to my phrasing and not to what is already in the article. Either take it out or phrase it clearly. The status quo is just poorly written. --User:Khajidha (talk) (contributions) 14:19, 2 January 2024 (UTC)
- Because it's a specifically convoluted trivia item that mixes geographies with cultural conceptions to say very little. CMD (talk) 13:41, 2 January 2024 (UTC)
- Why don't we just state that it is the largest country located entirely in Europe? This is clear and undisputed. --User:Khajidha (talk) (contributions) 06:37, 31 December 2023 (UTC)
- That is how this specific trivia item is calculated. I have also seen "largest country entirely in Europe". Not sure what either might inform the reader more than the raw area and the map does. CMD (talk) 03:51, 31 December 2023 (UTC)
- That area for France includes all of France's overseas territories. Metropolitan France (the part that's actually in Europe) is listed as having a land area of 543,940 km², which is clearly smaller than Ukraine. "2nd largest in Europe" is correct if nations' territory outside of Europe is excluded. The European portion of Russia is the largest, followed by Ukraine. — Red XIV (talk) 01:54, 2 January 2024 (UTC)
- I contend that "second largest country in Europe after only Russia" is still not clear. It could easily be misinterpreted as "second largest country with European territory" instead of the intended "second largest country by area counting only European territory". Using the first interpretation, the relevant country would be Kazakhstan. Again, just make it simple and indisputable: Ukraine is the largest country whose territory lies entirely within the European continent. --User:Khajidha (talk) (contributions) 13:17, 2 January 2024 (UTC)
- um no, Russia is the still the biggest country in Europe, even if you exclude Siberia Undashing (talk) 05:30, 6 February 2024 (UTC)
- Where does Khajida assert that Russia isn't the largest country in Europe? 80.193.98.150 (talk) 11:32, 16 April 2024 (UTC)
- um no, Russia is the still the biggest country in Europe, even if you exclude Siberia Undashing (talk) 05:30, 6 February 2024 (UTC)
- I contend that "second largest country in Europe after only Russia" is still not clear. It could easily be misinterpreted as "second largest country with European territory" instead of the intended "second largest country by area counting only European territory". Using the first interpretation, the relevant country would be Kazakhstan. Again, just make it simple and indisputable: Ukraine is the largest country whose territory lies entirely within the European continent. --User:Khajidha (talk) (contributions) 13:17, 2 January 2024 (UTC)
- Dear Sir/Madam
- I think Ukraine IS the largest country in Europe as I do not include Russia; for, in addition to her not existng in the EU her main part is in Asia. Therefore, Ukraine is first in size on that continent,i one considers the occupied territories as a part, which I do.
- Cheers, and GLORY TO UKRAINE! Mili Loves Ukraine (talk) 14:20, 13 August 2024 (UTC)
- EU membership has nothing to do with anything, the EU doesn't define what the continent of Europe is. Imagine making the same remark in 1950 when there was no such thing as the EU or in 1953 when only six countries were members. And Russia's part that's in Europe is in Europe. Largoplazo (talk) 11:41, 23 August 2024 (UTC)
- Hello Largoplazo: Thank you for the clarification
- Mili Loves Ukraine Mili Loves Ukraine (talk) 14:15, 30 August 2024 (UTC)
- EU membership has nothing to do with anything, the EU doesn't define what the continent of Europe is. Imagine making the same remark in 1950 when there was no such thing as the EU or in 1953 when only six countries were members. And Russia's part that's in Europe is in Europe. Largoplazo (talk) 11:41, 23 August 2024 (UTC)
- Handled it with a footnote stating that this figure only counts European territories. Terrariola 10:47, 7 September 2024 (UTC)
- Thanks, Terrariola!! From a… see my Username. Mili Loves Ukraine (talk) 13:55, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
Languages of Ukraine
[edit]In the "Language" section, there is no mention of the Romanian language. Hungarian is mentioned there, but Romanian is missing, although it has twice as many speakers. Romanian is the most spoken language in Ukraine after Ukrainian and Russian. Since the article is closed to new editors, it would be nice if someone could add it. 2A02:2454:62A:B200:F4CC:76FE:FF22:C9B5 (talk) 10:45, 20 October 2024 (UTC)
- Do you have a reliable source for that please? Chidgk1 (talk) 18:14, 26 October 2024 (UTC)
Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 8 November 2024
[edit]This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Can you add a romanization in the infobox add Ukraina in the infobox Depotadore (talk) 06:08, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
- Not done Please use the form "please change X to Y". Rsk6400 (talk) 06:10, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
- Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. M.Bitton (talk) 14:58, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
Formation of Ukraine
[edit]Why is the Soviet Union on the list? This is a strange list. Is it possible that Wikipedia now lists periods of occupation as formations? If so, please add other periods of occupation, such as the Reichskommissariat Ukraine, which is also a state entity. It is very strange that for some reason Poland does not have the Soviet Union in its formations in 1939, but they decided to list the period of occupation of Ukraine by the Soviet Union as a Ukrainian state.This is a double standard. In addition, for some reason I did not see a list of really important periods: West Ukrainian People's Republic or Unification Act. It is necessary to supplement and change! Нестеріна (talk) 01:23, 30 November 2024 (UTC)
- I don’t have an opinion on that but I see History of Ukraine is a long article. If you are interested and have time you could start by improving that and the more detailed articles you mention. After that you will likely have done enough editing to be able to change this article. Chidgk1 (talk) 07:16, 30 November 2024 (UTC)
- I don't think we should change this article: Reichskommissariat was never internationally recognized, but Soviet Ukraine was. The West Ukrainian People's Rep. (or Nestor Makhno's entity) was too short-lived to be relevant here. Rsk6400 (talk) 07:22, 30 November 2024 (UTC)
- De jure, Ukraine is the legal successor of the Ukrainian SSR. This is how it happened historically. At the same time, Ukraine, maintaining its historical relationship with the Ukrainian People's Republic of Ukraine, held a succession ceremony for the government in exile of the Ukrainian People's Republic of Ukraine (but without legal consequences). The Soviet Union is definitely an occupation of Ukraine. Therefore, there is no legal basis to exclude the Soviet Union from the formation, but it is also not entirely correct to leave the Soviet Union in the list. Regarding this issue, it is at the discretion of the community. I apologize for the excessive comparisons and emotionality, but I am concerned about this problems. Regarding other issues, such as the Western Ukrainian People's Republic, it is worth supplementing the article. There is nothing more to add Нестеріна (talk) 16:08, 30 November 2024 (UTC)
- Delisted good articles
- Former good article nominees
- Old requests for peer review
- B-Class level-3 vital articles
- Wikipedia level-3 vital articles in Geography
- B-Class vital articles in Geography
- B-Class Ukraine articles
- Top-importance Ukraine articles
- WikiProject Ukraine articles
- B-Class Europe articles
- High-importance Europe articles
- WikiProject Europe articles
- B-Class country articles
- WikiProject Countries articles
- B-Class Anthropology articles
- Unknown-importance Anthropology articles
- B-Class Oral tradition articles
- Unknown-importance Oral tradition articles
- Oral tradition taskforce articles
- Pages in the Wikipedia Top 25 Report