Talk:Bionicle (video game)

Is it based on the film?

Quote from the opening section of the article: "The game is based on the movie Bionicle: Mask of Light and other parts of the Bionicle storyline, but the game not actually based on the film." There appears to be a contradiction here. --Super Shy Guy Bros.Not shy? 21:25, 4 January 2010 (UTC)

Move to "Bionicle (video game)"?

Much like how the article for Lego Bionicle (video game) isn't called by its development title of Lego Bionicle: Quest for the Toa despite most fans still calling it that, the real title of this game is just simply BIONICLE, with the "The Game" part of it being dropped during development, but fans still refer to it as such. For consistancy, it might be better to move this article to Bionicle (video game) or Bionicle (2003 game). --Jessietail (talk) 23:15, 11 August 2018 (UTC)

True. Lordtobi (✉) 13:29, 25 August 2018 (UTC)

Spliting Bionicle: City of Legends

The sequel to Bionicle, Bionicle: City of Legends was cancelled. However, this needs to be splitting to the new article. Longplay Watcher (talk) 13:28, 19 June 2021 (UTC)

City of Legends does not appear to be independently notable. A split would only lead to (at best) a rough stub. IceWelder [✉] 13:51, 19 June 2021 (UTC)

GA Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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This review is transcluded from Talk:Bionicle (video game)/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: TheTechnician27 (talk · contribs) 18:21, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

Hey, Toa Nidhiki05. I've gone ahead and made a preliminary review of Bionicle (video game) for GA status.

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not).

• Update 1: 2b is now met. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 18:51, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

• Update 2: 3a is now met; all criteria are now satisfied. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 19:38, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

1. It is reasonably well written.

   a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):

   No issues with grammar, spelling, prose, or formatting that I can see. Very solid.

2. It is factually accurate and verifiable.

   a (reference section): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR): d (copyvio and plagiarism):

   a) Well-referenced; total pass on this one, as every statement (except "culminating with a battle between Takanuva and Makuta", but that's trivial and totally acceptable [see, e.g.: GTA V#Plot]) is cited. References are well-formatted. b) Sourcing for last sentence appears shaky; was originally going to pass, but there's another issue – one regarding the Amazon citation. See overall comments for explanation. c) No OR that I can see. d) Checked for copyvio and plagiarism; none found.

3. It is broad in its coverage.

   a (major aspects): b (focused):

   a) The 'Development and release' and 'Reception' sections are very good. There might be more minor details to add if you wanted to do some FA-level extensive research, but I don't see anything missing, let alone anything major. From what I've seen, the plot of the game is fairly barebones, so I think you've captured the setting very well and the overall plot decently well in the one paragraph (unless there are broad plot differences in the GBA version). The gameplay overview for the main version is good as well, but I've marked 'major aspects' as 'no' because of the absence of any information how the GBA version, an isometric platformer, is different from the home console version in 'Gameplay and plot'. (see suggestion below in overall comments). b) Very focused; never strays into extraneous detail.

I've managed to find a handful of sources on the GBA version's gameplay, including the developer interview and IGN image article. I did cite one thing to the game itself - that Takanuva is in it. The plot is indeed the same. This is on the game's box packaging as well as said in the game itself. Beyond that, the Nintendo Power interview and a BZPower review (probably not reliable) are the only sources out there. Toa Nidhiki05 23:16, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

1. It follows the neutral point of view policy.

   Fair representation without bias:

   No issue here. If anything, I think you did a very fine job balancing the 'Critical' section based on the reviews I could find.

2. It is stable.

   No edit wars, etc.:

   None whatsoever.

3. It is illustrated by images and other media, where possible and appropriate.

   a (images are tagged and non-free content have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):

   Owing to copyright issues etc., Wikipedia articles on games often aren't very illustrated. While I think there's an argument to be made that a screenshot of the GBA version would be encyclopedically valuable (maybe in the 'Development and release' section, or maybe directly alongside the home console version), that's a nitpick better left for a FA review, not something that would affect a GA review. Copyright and captions are in order.

I could find and add an image if needed; it might be self-evident that it's isometric. Toa Nidhiki05 23:16, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

1. Overall:

   Pass/Fail:

   Leaving assessment as a '?' until I've heard back from you, as I think a 'Fail' is too strong given how good this article is, but a 'Pass' is too iffy given the following two issues. If there's not enough to merit its own subsection (if you wanted to create one, you'd almost certainly have to get your hands on the full Nintendo Power review), I think there at least needs to be one or two sentences addressing the differences in the GBA version for the 'Gameplay and plot' section to be well-rounded, as the GBA version – less important than the home console and personal computer versions though it may be – is a major aspect under the purview of this article. While rounding out the 'Gameplay and plot' section, it might be worthwhile to mention the Mask of Light and its use, as it seems to be the story's big, important MacGuffin.

The last sentence of the 'Commercial' section has me conflicted. For starters, that the footage was leaked in 2012 doesn't seem to be substantiated by the sources provided (and such a direct claim would need to be validated by a fairly reliable source or simply removed), and it would be really nice if any reliable outlets had more information on the leak. On the other hand, I don't think it's contentious enough that these sources aren't reliable enough to verify it, thus I was originally just going to pass 2b. However, another issue cropped up. Although according to WP:RSPAMAZON, Amazon is an acceptable source for release dates, the date listed on Amazon for the OS X release date is objectively wrong according to Feral Interactive. According to them, they released a trailer October 15, announced pre-order deals on October 29, went gold November 12, and showed it off at Macworld 2005.

All in all, your improvements are excellent, and the article is very close to GA quality. Just give a bit of attention to addressing the GBA version's gameplay differences (and maybe address the MacGuffin, since that seems bring about Takanuva for the final boss), and either fix the release date or – if all else fails – just say when it went gold and when it was shown off at Macworld – and there's no obstacle to me passing this immediately. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 18:21, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for the speedy review, TheTechnician27! For the demo section, I've slightly modified it; it now says the tech demo was "later leaked online" rather than a specific date, and notes the builds claim to be from those dates. For the Mac title, that's very problematic - I'd take what Feral says over what Amazon does. I'm trying to find an exact date from Feral, but I can't seem to on their archived site even. I would assume still the date was in 2004 - this from Macworld notes the release was slated for November, and obviously the game came out. Toa Nidhiki05 23:47, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

@Toa Nidhiki05: Yeah, I would be shocked if the release date were anytime past December 2004. Between the release date announced as November in October to it going gold November 12, I'm betting December or late November. According to Games4Mac (make of it what you will), it was released in German during winter 2004. Like you, I was surprised Feral didn't have an article announcing the game's release. I'll try to do a bit more digging and see if anything turns up on this front. For now, I commented out the OS X release date in the infobox and the prose and simply stated when it went gold as a stopgap. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 01:53, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

Yeah it's especially bizarre that there's no firm date given Feral made a pretty big deal out of this game, TheTechnician27. I think the gold date suffices along with a mention of its showcase at Macworld. If no information is available, that's not ideal but it can be worked around. Toa Nidhiki05 02:28, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

Update: I haven't found the release date yet, but I did find a review from MacAddict. It's fairly positive, so might be worth adding. Toa Nidhiki05 12:29, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

Update: I've found a separate Amazon link citing the UK release date as December 28, 2004. TheTechnician27. Toa Nidhiki05 12:39, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

Definitely worth adding the MacAddict review, insofar as it's easily the most broadly positive review of the game I've seen from a reliable source (btw, that Nyko controller on the same page looks rad); I'll see if I can find a good place for it in the last paragraph and add it in. Although I'd take the Amazon date with a grain of salt, it at least actually seems plausible and isn't completely impossible like the September 2004 date is. If nothing else, if we could find another reliable source substantiating that it released in December, we could reasonably use both sources to say "and released in December 2004". I'm going to look through BZPower's archives and see if anything crops up. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 15:42, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

Update 1: @Toa Nidhiki05: BZPower lists the release date as January 22, 2005. Ironically, the blurb from 'Mark' of BZPower announcing the game links to the very same Amazon page that asserts the OS X version came out in September 2004. Also, if you ever want some preliminary sources for Maze of Shadows, that same page has a bit of information. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 15:49, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

Another site, Mask of Destiny, also lists that date as well and cites it to the Feral website itself. Seems to be the right date to me, TheTechnician27. As for Maze of Shadows - I did find a single review from Planet GameBoy, which is reliable, as well as a listing for one from a magazine called 64 Power. Both are German sites, oddly enough. I also recall finding a source that announced the release of images from the game. It's a shame there's not more coverage because it's actually, imo, the best of the Bionicle games. But like a lot of late-stage licensed GBA games, it didn't get a lot of attention. Toa Nidhiki05 16:00, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

Another site, Mask of Destiny, also lists that date as well and cites it to the Feral website itself. Seems to be the right date to me, TheTechnician27 Toa Nidhiki05 16:00, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

@Toa Nidhiki05: I dug up this archive of the Feral page, and unfortunately, no date release date is listed on the main page. I'll dig around and see what can be found. The only thing I can find that even mildly controverts January 22 is the phrasing in this Feral press release which states: "We’ll be located at the heart of the gaming area, so head on down and enjoy a hands-on experience with all of our latest releases, complimented by the latest Logitech force-feedback steering wheels and joypads. Get to grips with Bionicle..." Macworld took place from the 10th to the 14th, so the phrasing is a bit fuzzy, but it's still seeming like January 22. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 16:12, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

Pinging IceWelder, who's very experienced with game articles and has watched this article for some time. I personally think that, in lieu of any plausible, controverting evidence, the combination of Mask of Destiny and BZPower should be enough to reliably substantiate that the OS X version was released January 22, 2005. Therefore, I'd have no problem changing 2b) to 'yes', but I wanted to know what you think. PS: @Toa Nidhiki05: I accidentally found yet another Amazon page, this time claiming the game was released for OS X on January 11, 2005. It's like we're finding new Amazon pages that are getting asymptotically closer to the correct date. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 16:29, 25 June 2021 (UTC) Update: Both are attributed to 'Mark', so it could actually be the same person. However, the short articles are different and do lead to different links. Gosh, this is getting ridiculous. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 16:38, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

@Toa Nidhiki05 and TheTechnician27: It is likely that Mark from Mask of Destiny and Mark from BZPower are the same person. In both cases, the author noticed that the game's webpage was updated to read "Out Now", which could infer that a) they noticed it late or b) the site was updated on delay or just to reflect its online availability, not retail which might have happened earlier. We can positively say that the game was released sometime between November 12, 2004 (RTM) and January 22, 2005, based on these sources, but not much more than that, unfortunately. Amazon as a source is generally a no-no and the dates there are rarely accurate. I would suggest that you place no date or a vaguer "2005"/"2004–2005" in the infobox and in the body use something akin to "The game was released via Feral Interactive's online store by January 22, 2005". If you do not want to use either of the two Bionicle-centric sources, the Macworld review confirms its release as of April 2005. Aside from this, I found another review here and would mention Zonic as the port's developer per [1]. Feral only published this version. Regards, IceWelder [✉] 18:06, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

@IceWelder: Alright, I'll go ahead and do "by January 22, 2005". It's disappointing we couldn't definitively find the actual date, but maybe someday, an ambitious editor will get in touch with Feral and see what the actual date was. At any rate, that satisfies 2b. I also added Zonic, as I'd completely missed that information. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 18:27, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

Just as a last-ditch, I checked out the archives for the MacGameStore, who say the game was released December 15, 2004 (unfortunately, I was unable to find the date on the official Apple store archives). December 15 lines up both with the Feral's claim November 12 claim that the game would be released "within weeks" and the December 17 Macworld announcement calling Bionicle one of its "latest releases". I'm just leaving it here in case a future editor tries to pick up where we left off. Nevertheless, for the time being, I've simply left it as "by January 22, 2005", which satisfies 2b. One down, one to go. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 18:46, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

Appreciate it as always, TheTechnician27. As far as I can see, other remaining issue is the GBA release information, correct? I have added some of that to the article, specifically developer comments on its differences as well as information on playable characters. The Takanuva bit is cited to the game as it is advertised directly on its box packaging. I could find additional information if necessary, perhaps - there is a review from BZPower, which is not notable as a review but may be notable at bare minimum for mentioning basic gameplay progression. There aren't any scans of the game manual online, but there are a few eBay listings that include the manual - I might jump on one of those. A gameplay image might also be useful here as that says a lot about how the game operates. Toa Nidhiki05 18:51, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

@Toa Nidhiki05: If you have a scanner and really want to find more sources, this listing has Nintendo Power Volumes 172–175, which includes both the GBA (174) and GameCube (175) reviews. I would myself except that I have no scanner and would want them to go to someone who could actually preserve them. That said, with one exception, the paragraph you have is fine for the sake of a GA review; filling it out more with e.g. the Nintendo Power review would probably be more of an FA thing. The exception is that I think we should at least note that it's an isometric platformer. Given the extremely low threshold for verifiability of this claim, I think using IGN's screenshots page (which are the ones provided by THQ, given they both have the same date and were uploaded pre-release) works just fine. At that point, I see all major aspects as having been covered. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 19:26, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.