Talk:Saiga semi-automatic rifle

Saiga semi-automatic rifle was a Warfare good articles nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There may be suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.

Article milestones
Date	Process	Result
April 20, 2010	Good article nominee	Not listed
April 26, 2010	Good article nominee	Not listed

Current status: Former good article nominee

Russia: Technology & engineering / Military Low‑importance

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This article has been checked against the following criteria for B-class status:
Referencing and citation: criterion not met Coverage and accuracy: criterion met Structure: criterion met Grammar and style: criterion met Supporting materials: criterion met

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This article was the subject of an educational assignment that ended on 2010. Further details are available here.

comments

Good job, Weepy, but IMO, some of the info, like cleaning, seems too informal and out of place in an encyclopedia.

Bolt hold open

Article says that the bolt does not stay open after last shot. This is not true. While it is true that removal of the magazine will release the bolt (defeating the whole point of a bolt hold open) nevertheless bolt stays open on last shot. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.205.10.0 (talk) 06:57, 6 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The article is correct in that the bolt does not stay open after the last shot. The "bolt hold open" device on the Saiga line of rifles must be engaged manually using a small lever located on the right-hand side of the receiver, above the trigger location. It does not engage automatically. Source: I own a Saiga chambered for 5.45x39.

As far as I know, the only AK pattern rifles that do incorporate a "bolt hold open" after the last shot do so by using a certain type of magazine. The action is not a feature of the rifle itself but of the type of magazine that is used. 70.119.53.63 (talk) 09:29, 3 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks

Hey thanks for the advice, I appreciate any criticisms and help that would make this article better. Weepy89 (talk) 21:42, 2 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

comments

A good start. I found the infobox for weapons, and you'll need to fill that out more. I did what I could, but there isn't enough info in the article to complete the specifications (and there should be). You need a section or subsection that clearly differentiates the changes between the combat rifle and the sporter version. I have no idea what the list at the end is for. Grammatically, this needs to improve somewhat. I'm going to add this to the list on the military history project, to see if someone will give you an assist. Auntieruth55 (talk) 00:26, 16 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The "See Also" section should be removed if at all possible; it tends to hold articles back the higher up the chain they climb. TomStar81 (Talk) 09:19, 16 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The sources are raggedy and not properly formatted; print sources would really be better for this piece. The prose needs a lot of work. Factually, it is not bad, though.--Mike - Μολὼν λαβέ 18:20, 16 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Peer Review

It seems like you did a good job with your information, but there were a little glitchy spots in the description and Operation section. I would suggest trying to reword some sentences to give the section more sentence variety in the Operation section. Also, you should go through your wiki links and ensure they direct to the page you want them to because a few were not going to places intended. For example, barrel I think you want to link to [gun barrel|barrel]]. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mzwhiz21 (talk • contribs) 14:11, 22 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Saiga semi-automatic rifle/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Wizardman _{Operation Big Bear} 17:27, 20 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

This article isn't too bad so far, but it's a way from good article status. The biggest concerns is the lack of citing, with many sections being unsourced. Anything controversial should be cited, and at least one cite per paragraph. There are some sentences that are rather confusing as well. Namely, "The rifle is different in that many aspects as well." where I think 'that' is an unnecessary word to add in, doesn't make sense as is. Also, the sporter rifle definition feels a little clustered without wikilinks, cites, etc. in the first long paragraph. As a result I'm failing the article as is. When the issues are fixed, it can be renominated at GAN. Wizardman _{Operation Big Bear} 17:27, 20 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Saiga semi-automatic rifle/GA2. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: –MuZemike 19:57, 26 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Prose issues

The paragraphs in the "History" section are too short and choppy. I would combine the first two and the last two paragraphs in that section into a set of two fuller paragraphs, which will make the prose look more professional to readers.
Please go over the prose again in the article as there are still quite a bit of areas that are very wordy and lead readers astray in the aspects.
The "Sporter rifle definition" subsection is not written very well at all. The first paragraph goes on for too long, which makes readers lost interest in what they're reading. You also seem to go back and forth describing that an assault rifle does and what a sporter rifle does instead of sticking with what makes a rifle a sporter and not an assault rifle. As I noted above, the overall wordiness does not help any.

Coverage issues

The article could be expanded a bit more after doing a quick Google search. this may help better in the description of the Saiga as well as this instruction manual. I don't know if this is reliable enough of a source, but it may provide you with more information about the conversion of a Saiga. This may also be of interest. Also keep in mind Izhmash's offical site, which provides official descriptions of the Saiga (though their manual is also OK to use) is here. Finally, Google Books comes back with some other good print sources that go over the Saiga which may be of a good help (and don't forget Google Scholar as well).

Verifiability issues

This is currently in the article what I noticed.

The first and fourth paragraphs in the "History" section are comletely unsourced. You will need to verify that information.
In the "Design and Operation" section, Some shooters believe the rifle is more reliable than other semiautomatic rifles because of this. → I doubt this is in the rifle's manual; this claim needs to be backed by a reliable source or else removed.

Stability issues

The merger proposal to move the "Sporter rifle definition" into the sporterising article has not been addressed or completed (with a merge or not merging).

Conclusions

Failed – I'm sorry, but despite the improvements from the first GAN several days ago, this article still has quite a ways before it can reach GA. I noticed the peer review in the article didn't do terribly much to suggest further improvements to the article or to indicate whichever shortcomings there were, and that's not your fault. Here are my suggestions as to what you can do to help get the article up to GA standards:

Make the improvements that I suggested above.
Try and get another peer review in there, in which hopefully somebody will be more thorough and complete and will be able to offer suggestions that I didn't cover.
Nominate the article for B-Class assessment for WP:MILHIST and WP:FIREARMS. Ideally, an article should at least be checked that it makes B-Class before nominating for GA.

Hopefully this helps you out a bit more. –MuZemike 19:57, 26 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Statement that AK magazines do not work is not entirely true

For Saiga rifles chambered in 7.62x39, a magazine designed for an AK-47 and not a Saiga rifle will not fully engage due to the thickness of the material used on the magazine catch of the Saiga rifle. However, an AK-74 style magazine, such as the steel ones used on Polish Tantal rifles, and Bulgarian synthetic magazines, fit and engage just fine on Saiga rifles chambered in 5.45x39. 70.119.53.63 (talk) 09:34, 3 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Additionally, Saiga rifles chambered in 7.62x39, 5.45x39, and .223, will function and have the ability to chamber and remove a round (although possibly not reliably, though results vary) using non-Saiga magazines (such as ones made for the AK-47 and AK-74 series of rifles) AND without the use of a bullet-guide, which is not a feature of the Saiga rifle as this feature was built into the design of the Saiga magazine. A common issue associated with using non-Saiga magazines in a Saiga rifle without an aftermarket bullet-guide installed is a failure-to-feed the last round of the magazine, with the other 29 rounds (if we're talking about a 30 round magazine) cycling in an acceptable manner.

Therefore, stating that the Saiga line of rifles cannot function without a bullet-guide or without a Saiga-specific magazine is wrong. Due to this, I modified the wording of the article to state that the rifle may not function reliably, instead of using will not function reliably which seems to denote that all Saiga rifles behave the same 70.119.53.63 (talk) 05:02, 11 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Caliber

Can we shoot 5.56 nato cartridge on saiga 223 Rem rifle ??? 203.135.45.46 (talk) 01:48, 10 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]