Talk:Valencia CF

article quality

This article needs a lot of clean up. I wish I could do it, but I don't have the time and I'm too lazy. First of all, this article is written like a fan page, especially the 70s section. Second, there is a lot of grammar errors and improvement on word quality. Overall, the article has a lot of good information and by revising, this could easily be a featured article. Ricardoread —Preceding comment was added at 19:58, 15 July 2008 (UTC)

I agree but I too am short of time, hopefully in the near future we can sort it out. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Senyor Pirotecnic (talk • contribs) 09:47, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

I agree with the fan page bit. There is also only a phrase on the devastating financial crisis that almost saw the team forced to sell most of their stars and the reason their payroll has decreased significantly. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.68.83.171 (talk) 11:33, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Transfers

I have removed the list of recent transfers, as Wikipedia is not a news service. Maurimarzal 16:11, 9 September 2006 (GMT)

Marzal, you should notice that almost all teams articles have that section Jor70 13:18, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

I think you should move it back. The transfer list is useful and, furthermore, all the other teams (most of them) have it .Tris2000 12:30, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

As stated by Maurimarzal, Wikipedia is no news source. The transfers have been moved to Valencia CF season 2006-07. Poulsen 23:52, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Nickname

Could someone explain origin of the nickname Los Ches . Too many Argentines? Jor70 13:18, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Nothing to do with Argentina. Che is a common term of address or exclamation in Valencia. As a nickname it is a lot more popular with the media than the fans. Xoto (goat in Valencian) is a derogatory nickname for Valencia fans used by fans of city rivals (in their minds at least) Levante UD.

I've removed Xotos as only the granotas in Levante use it, to wind us up. It's not right that it appears as one of our nicknames. It would be like saying "Blueshite" is a nickname for Everton. So I've removed it. I HAVE added "The Bats" though, as this is becoming seen more and more in the English language media and it's starting to stick. Tris2000 01:47, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

I beg to differ. Just because some ill-informed foreign media invent a nickname does not mean it exists. Bats/Murcielagos/Rat-Penats has never been used as nickname by Valencia fans or indeed anyone in Spain. If the Levante page has Sapos as a nickname (which it does) then the VCF one should have Xotos but I do not know the Wikipedia line on this matter.

I don't know who wrote the paragraph above as it wasn't signed, but this is rubbish. Even Valencia CF daily newspaper Superdeporte often calls them murciélagos. And here in the UK the fans call them the bats. I should know, I'm president of the 400+ strong Valencia fanclub in the UK!Tris2000 23:35, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

Chotos is a valid and ancient nickname, in fact the press of Madrid began using the nickname "che" in years 70 to refer to the team, but nickname used before is "chotos" or "merengots", appear to several chronicles of the epoch and although you: LEVANTE'S HOOLS DID NOT INVENT IT, it's a popular misnomer that the people invented when Valencia CF inaugurated Mestalla's field where the chotos (young goats) pastured, equal merengot were because Valence CF dressed white. Besides, also another valencian teams take the rat the penat in the shield and his fondness uses the interjection "che". . Choto are historic and used nickname, also it is used internationally: Dynamo Kiev - Valencia CF http://uncoltuitatdelume.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/dinamo-kiev-1-1-valencia-2009-02-19_144025.jpg . Greetings. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.43.182.186 (talk) 10:55, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

club colours

is there any information on the Valencia club colours, or more accurately - their history. Did they start wearing white at home after 1980 for example? And in the early 2000's, I noticed orange was a common colour for them.

Valencia have always worn white shirts as first choice kit though the colour of the shorts and socks has alternated over time (either black or white). Orange is an away shirt that first appeared in the late 80s but has been more used in the last decade. Blue and red/yellow stripes are two other away shirt options. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Senyor Pirotecnic (talk • contribs) 09:45, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

Club logo

The club logo of this team is missing. Can someone please insert the logo as quickly as possible? --Siva1979^{Talk to me} 15:56, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

Who keeps changing the club logo?? The current one with the real looking bat is NOT the official club logo.

Well, that's your opinion. The logo with the real looking bat IS the official club logo, as you can see if you read the official magazine of the club, the documantation that the club edites when there is a general assembly of the society or the official flag (since 1923) that was kept in the club offices before it was stolen. The logo that is visible now is better than the one that was last months, and looks like the one that is embroided on the shirt. But the official one is the one that, as you say, is realistic. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.58.71.212 (talk) 11:25, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

You can visit this page (http://www.soyche.com), an official website of an official sponsor (Telefonica), and you will notice that the València CF logo that you can see is the one with the realistic bat. Please, don't change it by your own: I will be happy if anyone want change opinions about it, but with arguments and facts, please, not just with opinions. Thank you. User: josepgv6

Are you sure this isn't out of date? I do not see the logo anywhere on the club's site besides the history section, it does not appear on the kit, an '07 branding website (not official from the club so really not that much of an argument) shows the bat with some detail but black, the website you mention is not the club's and the logo has a darker bat. Organizations update their logos. Clubs do it here and there. I would love to find better sources that say in writing "THIS IS OFFICIAL" since that would make it much easier. Official mag and documents are close enough. Are these close but slightly different(ie darker and a little less detailed)? Do you have anything we can find through googling since at least a couple editors seem concerned about this inclusion?Cptnono (talk) 07:44, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

Altough my arguments weren't "this is official", but was to give you a link of an sponsor with a contract with Valencia CF, I must say that the logo that is now in wikipedia is not that awfull version that I found weeks ago. You are right, Valencia CF doesn't show an official version on the web, and in the magazine you can find the "Valencia Logo.gif" version and the "Valènciacf.jpg" (the realistic bat version), for example in the "Telefonica" announcements. If you want I can ask Valencia CF an official confirmation, that would be a official font. What I don't understand is why you remove the realistic bat logo: is used by the club (like the other one), is nice, and is like the one that was on the original flag (stolen and lost)... For your information I'm from Valencia, and I saw that flag when it was in the old offices in Avda. Aragón. Anyway, thank you for the interest in keep the VCF info updated. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Josepgv6 (talk • contribs) 14:38, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

I think if we can find a logo inline with their current branding guidelines it should go in the infobox to represent the team correctly. The historical one is great it just might be better suited in a colours and badge section. The article should also follow Wikipedia:WikiProject Football/Clubs closer.Cptnono (talk) 02:21, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

Another question: can you put the VCF logo in http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valencia_Club_de_F%C3%BAtbol. I've tried but I can't. Thank you. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Josepgv6 (talk • contribs) 10:50, 26 August 2009 (UTC)

I was going to. I saw somehting that looked like it was mentioning images (I don't speak Spanish) and when I got a little confused poked around several footy pages. Does that Doesn't look like they use the logos on that Wikipedia.Cptnono (talk) 01:54, 28 August 2009 (UTC)

Revamped

Huge Valencia fan and i have added more depth to the history.

Who are you? Are you in the UK? The history is very good, by the way. Tris2000 10:13, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

Numbers

The squad numbers section, despite claims in that section, does not show the same data as the offical Valencia site, and the La Liga site.

Silva, for example is set at 10 on here, but 9 on his own page, and 21 on both the official sites.

Arizimendi is 21 on here, and has this on the official Valencia site, but no number on the league site, but has 16 on the squad box at the bottom of his own page.

I guess this needs some clarification, which will only be done when their first game is played, or there is some sort of official announcement Malcuthrad 15:27, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

Presumably the squad numbers will be confirmed following the game with IF Elfsborg next Tuesday... Signed, Silvilla.

Foreigners

As I know, Edu has Portuguese passport. It is listed in footballers with dual nationality page. If he hadn't that passport, how could he play in England before? Ario_ManUtd 23:45, 1 September 2007 (UTC)

Names

The real name of the stadium is "Camp de Mestalla". The alias is written "Els Xes". An ten name is "Ciutat Esportiva de Paterna", not "Ciudad Deportiva..." —Preceding unsigned comment added by 147.83.83.195 (talk) 10:51, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

Els Xes? Rubbish. I'm all for writing Camp de Mestalla in the Valencian language, but you don't see "Xes" anywhere. Look in a local sports paper, eg Superdeporte, and count out how often Xes are used. One of the very few times you see "Xe" written with an X is in the chant "xe que bo", but even so, Google throws up 2,030 references of "xe que bo" versus 6,160 of "che que bo". Some things I am all for writing in Valencian, but "Xe" is not one of them and the fans would tend to agree with that! Or else, how come most Penyes (supporters clubs) of Valencia have "che" in their name rather than "xe"?? In cases like these, one must go with the popular spelling, rather than try and use Valencian grammar to prove an unpopular point. Tris2000 10:08, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

I'm a Valencia fan, and this is nonsense. It's Che. (Fadiga09 17:07, 28 September 2007 (UTC))

Cañizares, Albelda and Angulo

Please don't remove this players from the current squad, they are in the team at least until the end of this season. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.7.170.44 (talk) 23:03, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

why the people continue deleting this players from the current squad? please they are players of Valencia CF!!

Ramos10 (talk) 15:38, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

I will tell you why...Because they aren't in te Team —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.232.23.14 (talk) 21:31, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

So...? They are still part of the current squad. Xeron220 (talk) 17:58, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

please stop deleting this players please! look at the oficial web http://217.116.5.146/equipo/equipo.asp?Idioma=1& they are part of valencia cf

Ramos10 (talk) 10:10, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

I agree, these players still are Valencia CF players, once they are transferred out of the club then we can alter.

If they were reinstated, why is only Albelda and Angulo listed still as Valencia players? 77.99.186.110 (talk) 23:52, 6 July 2008 (UTC)

Because Canizares has left the club on a free.

Canizares is still listed as a Valencia player - [1] 77.99.186.110 (talk) 02:58, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

Fairs Cup

I've combined them with the UEFA Cup results, it's a pre cursor tournament and their is no evidence for official or unofficial sources, it's not a UEFA sanctioned tournament but it doesn't make it unofficial, i didn't think this needed a mass debate, all i did was combine them with the UEFA Cup results, seeing as other Fairs Cup winners on Wikipedia have their articles collated together too. regarding the Fairs Cup (Fadiga09 (talk) 10:28, 6 May 2008 (UTC))

nationality

regarding Stephen Sunday.

As per many other football articles, where there is a player with dual nationality.

The team pages shows their adopted nationality. ie. Manchester United article shows Evra as French, Arsenal article shows Eduardo as Croatian - the article devoted to the player, not the team explains their original nationality, place of birth etc

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eduardo_da_Silva

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arsenal_F.C.#Current_squad

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrice_Evra

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Man_utd#First-team_squad

Sennen goroshi (talk) 03:06, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

I agree, he plays for Spain now. (Fadiga09 (talk) 09:47, 13 June 2008 (UTC))

Waiting list

I have removed reference to a waiting list for season tickets as it doesn't exist. Could the person who reinstates it please provide proof if (s)he belives there is one? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Senyor Pirotecnic (talk • contribs) 09:49, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

Rivals

Villarreal may be from the same region but they are not historical rivals of Valencia, there is far more tension in games vs Hercules and Castellon. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Senyor Pirotecnic (talk • contribs) 09:51, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

Renan Brito

Renan Brito is now a Valencia CF player his name should be added to the list of players. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.22.156.9 (talk) 04:10, 18 August 2008 (UTC)

Article length

A few days ago, an IP editor made two edits which removed content from the history and stadium sections with the indication that the removed content exists in exact the same wording at History of Valencia CF and Estadio Mestalla. He was harshly reverted by User:Fadiga09 with the edit summary of "Shut up."

I'd like to point out that the article in its current state is around 100 kB. According to the Wikipedia guideline on article sizes, articles should definitely be split up once they have reached this limit. Since this obviously happened a long time ago, keeping the outsourced content in this article is unnecessary and redundant.

Hence, I have removed the outsourced content from this article again in order to significantly reduce its size AND readability. However, I would propose that someone with better knowledge of the subject provides a very brief summary for the history of this club at this article since this section should not be left with just a link. Hockey-holic (talk) 17:09, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

I agree. This info should be moved and replaced with a very brief summary. Fadiga needs to discuss this here instead of reverting. Valenciano (talk) 19:32, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

I've restored the original content. I would rather content be there than none at all but it needs summarising and vastly shortening. Peanut4 (talk) 21:50, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

This is an outdated discussion but wanted to mention: The article is closer to 75k of readable prose. Weight may or may not be an issue in certain sections but overall length may be justified.Wikipedia:Splitting Cptnono (talk) 11:52, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

£465 million debt not even mentioned!

Valencia is in huge debt and is getting ripped apart and their current financial situaion is barely adressed except for a very faint and unclear sentence. Please put more info about this on the article as it is a defining moment for Valencia. --66.36.140.169 (talk) 04:59, 18 June 2009 (UTC)

Page should be moved!

Can't somebody move this page to Valencia C.F.. This is the correct way to spell it, and it is hideous that a important page like Valencia C.F. is under a page name, that is incorrect! Can somebody move it?

I don't know who you are because you didn't sign your comment, so therefore I would normally ignore your comment. HOWEVER, this is just the way we have done all the clubs in Wikipedia. For sure, Valencia C.F. works also, but all the clubs in 2009-10 La Liga have as their default the name without the periods (full stops) between the club-related epithets, with the exception for some reason of Real Madrid.Tris2000 (talk) 10:06, 20 October 2009 (UTC)

Home Shirt

The Home Shirt that appear in the article are a special shirt, only for "special" matches. Normally, they play with the shirt without the bat in the centre.--84.123.113.44 (talk) 12:23, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Copyright problem removed

Prior content in this article duplicated one or more previously published sources. Infringing material has been rewritten or removed and must not be restored, unless it is duly released under a compatible license. (For more information, please see "using copyrighted works from others" if you are not the copyright holder of this material, or "donating copyrighted materials" if you are.) For legal reasons, we cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or published material; such additions will be deleted. Contributors may use copyrighted publications as a source of information, but not as a source of sentences or phrases. Accordingly, the material may be rewritten, but only if it does not infringe on the copyright of the original or plagiarize from that source. Please see our guideline on non-free text for how to properly implement limited quotations of copyrighted text. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously, and persistent violators will be blocked from editing. While we appreciate contributions, we must require all contributors to understand and comply with these policies. Thank you. Andy Walsh (talk) 04:56, 18 January 2011 (UTC)

Most points overall

The i.p. argues that: "It;s discovered that in the LFP's web the points counts is wrong! Let's collect: Valencia: 1157 wins * 3 = 3471 + 593 draws = 4064 (LFP 3273!)" The LFP article isn't "wrong." The difference between that and the transfermarkt calculation seems to be because transfermarkt have just allocated 3 points for a win, however, for most of its history, La Liga awarded 2 points for a win. In 1995, in common with a lot of football competitions around that era, they switched to 3 points for a win. So we can't retrospectively award phantom points to teams that they didn't earn in the actual competitions. To be honest, I think it would be better if that line was removed altogether, since it's not really the fairest comparison and the info can date very quickly. Valenciano (talk) 19:28, 15 March 2015 (UTC)

Dear Valenciano, Firstly, we are here to present facts whatever teams we support. Actually I appreciate your removing for the all-time table information in Valencia profile. As even by 2 points system. The total counts of points will be more for Atletico because it has more wins than Valencia. So, I feel strange that the official source like LFP make wrong point counts as per their historical ranking here: www.lfp.es/estadisticas-historicas . Thank you 95.187.127.40 (talk) 11:59, 16 March 2015 (UTC)

No, sorry, but the LFP is not wrong. It says that overall Atletico have won more games than Valencia. Okay. But most of those wins were under the old 2 points for a win system. Since 1995, when 3 points for a win was introduced, Valencia have been a far more successful club than Atleti. Remember that Atletico even spent two seasons (2000-2002) in Segunda during that period.

3 points for a win era 1995/6 to 2013/4 seasons inclusive:

Valencia won 350 games (1050 points)

Atletico won 288 games (864 points)

2 points for a win i.e. up to 1994/5

Atletico won 879 games (1758 points)

Valencia won 791 games (1582 points)

TOTALS (from games won)

Valencia 1050+1582=2632 points

Atletico 864+1758=2622 points

So Valencia have more points, even though Atleti have won more games, since Valencia won more games at a time when more points were given for wins. Given how close it is, and given that the overall La Liga table doesn't tell the full story, I think we're best leaving it out. Valenciano (talk) 20:48, 16 March 2015 (UTC)

Nice information. Thank you man. Good luck for both teams. 5.41.191.107 (talk) 21:16, 16 March 2015 (UTC)

You're welcome, good luck versus Leverkusen! Valenciano (talk) 21:20, 16 March 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 7 April 2015

To remove this sentence: Valencia are the third most supported football club in Spain, behind heavyweights Real Madrid and FC Barcelona.[2]

Because the source [2] since 2007 which is too old. While there is a newer source 2013 with different results. http://www.insidespanishfootball.com/86229/real-madrid-named-most-popular-football-club-in-spain/

It can be: Valencia are the fourth most supported football club in Spain.

213.230.30.90 (talk) 06:33, 7 April 2015 (UTC)

I think the info should be removed from the lead altogether or changed to "Valencia are one of the most supported teams in Spain." Saying third or fourth is information which can date quickly. We should mention both the 2013 and 2007 sources in the body of the article. Valenciano (talk) 11:50, 7 April 2015 (UTC)

Not done: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit semi-protected}} template. Kharkiv07^Talk 11:52, 7 April 2015 (UTC)

"2023–24 Valencia CF season" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect 2023–24 Valencia CF season has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2023 June 21 § 2023–24 Valencia CF season until a consensus is reached. Steel1943 (talk) 19:11, 21 June 2023 (UTC)