Wikipedia:Mediation Cabal/Cases/2006-12-26 Decline of Buddhism in India

Wikipedia Mediation Cabal
Wikipedia Mediation Cabal
Article	Decline of Buddhism in India, Pusyamitra Sunga
Status	closed
Request date	Unknown
Requesting party	User:Tigeroo
Parties involved	User:Freedom skies
Mediator(s)	User:SebastianHelm
Comment	looks like we're half done

Shortcut

WP:MEDCAS/DoBiI

[[Category:Wikipedia Mediation Cabal closed cases|Decline of Buddhism in India, Pusyamitra Sunga]][[Category:Wikipedia Mediation Cabal maintenance|Decline of Buddhism in India, Pusyamitra Sunga]]

Quick info about this case

This section can be edited by all parties. Please explain any edits on the talk page. Mediator may revert any edits without discussion.

Notices

There has been another edit war. To avoid such wars in the future, please agree on a procedure to do edits. I just proposed a new procedure, please comment and support or oppose. — Sebastian 22:44, 30 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Utcursch offered to take over or help with the mediation. Please, both parties, indicate if you agree there. Thank you. — Sebastian 23:52, 2 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Request made by: Tigeroo 12:28, 26 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Where is the issue taking place?

Decline of Buddhism in India (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)
Pusyamitra Sunga (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)
(Obsolete: Wikipedia:Neutrality Project#Decline_of_Buddhism_in_India_.28edit.7Ctalk.7Chistory.7Clinks.7Cwatch.7Clogs.29 (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs))

Who's involved?

Freedom skies (talk · contribs)
Tigeroo (talk · contribs)

What's going on?: Revert war, Non-communication. Initially there was bad article. We both agree. The difference is over how to resolve NPOV and what material should be included and if the presentation is NPOV, relevant and accurate.
What would you like to change about that?: Inviting uninvolved third parties to take a look and help us arrive at an amicable solution that actually results in the improvement of the quality of the content in the article. We appear to have had a communication breakdown, can this be mended?

Would you prefer we work discreetly? If so, how can we reach you?: User page. Which ever method is the most effective will be fine.

Administrative notice

No activity. Closing. --Ideogram 02:47, 19 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, I had asked about this last week and was going to close it after an appropriate time, which I deemed to be a week. But it's OK, we can keep it closed. — Sebastian 06:25, 19 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Updates

Date/time (UTC)	Status
08:42, 30 December 2006	Case accepted by mediator SebastianHelm (talk · contribs), parties have been informed
06:59, 2 January 2007	Waiting for requestor; requestee has replied earlier
04:44, 3 January 2007	Adding issues table; requestor has replied earlier today
03:15, 12 January 2007	First item closed (#8: But @ Islam). Other items seem like they can get closed soon, too. Added status column in issues table that list who we're waiting for.
around 27 January	Freedom skies created several new issues
22:51, 30 January 2007	There has been another edit war. To avoid such wars in the future, mediator proposed a new procedure; please comment and support or oppose.
23:53, 2 February 2007 (UTC)	Utcursch offered to help. Please, both parties, indicate if you agree there. Thank you.

It's fine.--Tigeroo 00:40, 3 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Goal oriented issues table

Please, any party who sees an issue, write it in the list below.

Under "Issue" please write a name which we can use as a reference. Please select a name that the other party is likely to agree with. If there is no consensus we'll just use a number, but I prefer names because I forget numbers. If the issue applies to a certain section, add the (abbreviated) section name, separated by "@", as in "4 Evangelization @ Sungas". In this column, please also provide a link to a diff where applicable. To be clear, this should not be a description of the issue, it's just a name we can agree on.
status is maintained by mediator. It can contain the following abbreviations:
- Ti: Waiting for Tigeroo.
- Fs: Waiting for Freedom skies.
- me: Waiting for mediator.
Under "solution", please limit any proposed wording to a short phrase that catches the gist of it. You can always use the discussion page to write the full phrase.
Under "goals", please state the goals that you want to address with this solution. Please be brief; use keywords if possible. I am specifically looking for goals that allow us to find common ground. Therefore, please:
- Be generic enough to allow the mediator to find common ground
- Be specific enough to distinguish your goal from the current situation. If you just write "NPOV", it may not be obvious to everybody what you want.

Mediator may shorten entries after explaining it on talk page.

Issue	status	Tigeroo's solution	Tigeroo's goals	Freedom skies' solution	mediator's proposal
#1: Dalits @ intro	open	Mention mass conversions of the dalits in intro	Follow WP:LEAD, round up the intro	give equal weight to three pioneers	move sentence to B. R. Ambedkar
#2: Brahmanism	waiting for Ti	Use "Brahmanism" instead "Hinduism" where appropiate.		Brahminism is a deragotary term and may be a myth. I suggest use Hinduism; it has the same meaning and the word is used what, three times?
#3: Buddhism outside @ Sungas	resolved	Describe that Buddhism flourished outside towards Bactria in contrast to its experience in the gangetic plains	accurately render the meaning of the sources.		Fs proposed similar, but slightly improved version
#4: Evangelization @ Sungas [1]	open	Delete statement that Hinduism does not evangelize		Keep the staement. The persecution is not found anywhere else except in the Buddhist "book of legend" and is rejected due to lack of evidence by historians including Etienne_Lamotte	Deleted first sentence; 2nd sentence is covered in #9
#5: 400-1000 @ Causes		Quote BBC about historical Buddhism and Hinduism interaction between the 400 BCE and 1000 CE		The BBC text is about periods already covered. Incorporate the citations in the early periods.	Ti's text looks good to me
#6: Decline @ Qasim		Describe that Muhammad bin Qasim is not part of any "decline of Buddhism".		Describe that Quasim initiated Jihad, desecrated holy sites, implemented head tax Jiyza and was responsible for the decline of Buddhism to an extent.	adding Ti's version back
#7: Pipes @ Ref	resolved	Do not quote Daniel Pipes, find better sources		additional references
#8: But @ Islam	resolved	Find citation for current description of term "But"		removal	removal
#9: Hinduism @ Islam	open	Delete reference to Hinduism from Islam chapter		Mention the native religion of India in contrast to the religion of the Muslim conquest of the Indian subcontinent.	I tend to agree with Ti
#10: Decline @ South	waiting for Fs	Describe the different development in Southern India according to [2]		The citation given is speculative and underground in nature. Remove the text.

The entire conflict listed above by me can be captured this one diff--Tigeroo 21:18, 3 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks! I'll look at that tomorrow. — Sebastian 08:43, 4 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Compromise offers

This section can be edited by all parties. Please explaining any edits on the talk page. Mediator may revert any edits without discussion.

This section is for listing and discussing compromise offers.

Discussion

Please discuss this page on the Discussion page.

References