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== "Believing" ??? ==
== Category "[a]ge controversies" ==


One sentence reads as follows:
Could anyone please tell me if, given the uncertainty of Asimov's birthday, this page should fall under that category? [[User:Thylacine24|Thylacine24]] ([[User talk:Thylacine24|talk]]) 22:46, 12 December 2022 (UTC)
:Uncertain doesn't mean it's controversial. [[User:Richard75|Richard75]] ([[User talk:Richard75|talk]]) 23:02, 12 December 2022 (UTC)


"''When the family arrived in the United States in 1923 and their name had to be spelled in the Latin alphabet, Asimov's father spelled it with an S, believing this letter to be pronounced like Z (as in German), and so it became Asimov.''"
== Date of birth ==


This is a ''ridiculous'' statement, because S '''is''' often pronounced like a Z.
How is it possible for his parents not to have known in which year their son was born? Can we have an explanation of this? [[Special:Contributions/82.36.70.45|82.36.70.45]] ([[User talk:82.36.70.45|talk]]) 23:57, 12 April 2023 (UTC)
:Well, there was [[Russian Soviet Federative Socialist Republic#History|a lot going on in Russia at that time]]. [[User:Schazjmd|<span style="color:#066293;">'''Schazjmd'''</span>]]&nbsp;[[User talk:Schazjmd|<span style="color:#738276;">''(talk)''</span>]] 00:03, 13 April 2023 (UTC)
::I know that, but if you are a parent you must know that political and economical turmoil won’t make you forget if you had your son in 1919 or 1920… There’s something really strange going on there… Maybe it’s due to cultural differences. I know a hundred years ago people had 12 children and 6 died in infancy, so birth years were maybe less important back then… still, modern readers are baffled if left without and explanation… <!-- Template:Unsigned IP --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/82.36.70.45|82.36.70.45]] ([[User talk:82.36.70.45#top|talk]]) 01:31, 15 April 2023 (UTC)</small> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
:::It's a combination of things, including their use of a different calendar (in which the range of possible dates were all in the same year). [[User:Richard75|Richard75]] ([[User talk:Richard75|talk]]) 10:02, 15 April 2023 (UTC)
::::Oh, that’s an excellent point, didn’t know all the range was in the same year in the Old Calendar! <!-- Template:Unsigned IP --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/82.36.70.45|82.36.70.45]] ([[User talk:82.36.70.45#top|talk]]) 03:00, 16 April 2023 (UTC)</small> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->


Consider the words "is", "as", "was", "does", "words", "trains", "cars", "cans", and many, many others that are not even slightly exceptions to any rule.
== Big Three -Vandalism ==


So Isaac Asimov's father did not merely "believe" that S is pronounced like a Z in English.
The Big Three are, according to Brian W. Aldiss in Billion Year Spree, Isaac Asimov, Arthur C. Clarke and Ray Bradbury. Robert A. Heinlein never was one of them, this claim is "alternative facts" and this vandalism doesn't seem to be recent. Please correct. [[Special:Contributions/2001:7E8:C29C:2400:983E:960F:67FC:EB6|2001:7E8:C29C:2400:983E:960F:67FC:EB6]] ([[User talk:2001:7E8:C29C:2400:983E:960F:67FC:EB6|talk]]) 15:37, 19 June 2023 (UTC)
:On which page do you see this? I did a search for "Big Three" in a PDF copy of ''Billion Year Spree'' and I don't find that phrase. Also there are numerous sources that say that Heinlein rather than Bradbury was the third member of the Big Three, so even if Aldis did say this, I don't know that we should give it a lot of weight. [[User:CodeTalker|CodeTalker]] ([[User talk:CodeTalker|talk]]) 15:56, 19 June 2023 (UTC)
:''[https://books.google.com/books?id=MtCyDAAAQBAJ&pg=PA300 The Big Book of Science Fiction]'' identifies the "big three" as Asimov, Clarke, and Heinlein, as does ''[https://books.google.com/books?id=tPuzDwAAQBAJ&pg The Rise and Fall of American Science Fiction, from the 1920s to the 1960s]'', ''[https://books.google.com/books?id=p5U2EAAAQBAJ&pg=PA33 Science Fiction Literature Through History: An Encyclopedia]'', and ''[https://books.google.com/books?id=V-CNAgAAQBAJ&pg=PA8 Fifty Key Figures in Science Fiction]'' (which notes that van Vogt was replaced as one of the "big three" as his popularity waned and Clarke's grew). (See also: [[Talk:Robert_A._Heinlein#Big_Three_-Vandalism]] and [[Talk:Arthur_C._Clarke#Big_Three_-Vandalism]]) [[User:Schazjmd|<span style="color:#066293;">'''Schazjmd'''</span>]]&nbsp;[[User talk:Schazjmd|<span style="color:#738276;">''(talk)''</span>]] 15:58, 19 June 2023 (UTC)
::As I stopped reading SF around 1995, never ever Heinlein had been related to as one of the Big Three of SF; Asimov, Clarke and Bradbury was canonic and never questioned, so that now I have difficulties finding written sources ... actually, I learned that from one of my teachers. Bradbury was known for the TV-serial Martian Chronicles and the Truffaut-movie Fahrenheit 451, Heinlein had nothing comparable until late 80s action flick Starship Troopers. And Heinlein wasn't read in Europe due to his political views.[[Special:Contributions/2001:7E8:C29C:2400:BCE9:F89E:C42E:1B87|2001:7E8:C29C:2400:BCE9:F89E:C42E:1B87]] ([[User talk:2001:7E8:C29C:2400:BCE9:F89E:C42E:1B87|talk]]) 15:22, 20 June 2023 (UTC)
:::It doesn't matter, you still need a source, not just something your teacher told you. And Heinlein started writing in 1939, and it's irrelevant which films were being made in the 80s. [[User:Richard75|Richard75]] ([[User talk:Richard75|talk]]) 21:21, 20 June 2023 (UTC)
:(copying from [[Talk:Robert A. Heinlein]] as the IP started the same conversation on multiple articles.) I finally got hold of a copy of ''Billion Year Spree''. I cannot find the phrase "big three" anywhere in the book. I looked up each mention of Bradbury in the book, and it is never paired with Asimov and Clarke in any meaningful way. Do you have a page number for your reference? [[User:Schazjmd|<span style="color:#066293;">'''Schazjmd'''</span>]]&nbsp;[[User talk:Schazjmd|<span style="color:#738276;">''(talk)''</span>]] 19:49, 27 July 2023 (UTC)


Rather, it very frequently '''is''' pronounced like a Z.
== Talking after death ==


(Conversely, there are many cases where a Z is pronounced like an S, like "waltz". In its plural, "waltzes", the Z has an S sound and the S has a Z sound.)
In the bibliography section there is a quote of him in 1994...well he died in 1992. [[Special:Contributions/194.65.43.51|194.65.43.51]] ([[User talk:194.65.43.51|talk]]) 08:04, 17 August 2023 (UTC)
<!-- Template:Unsigned IP --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/2601:200:c082:2ea0:9cf0:82c3:f2ea:74c4|2601:200:c082:2ea0:9cf0:82c3:f2ea:74c4]] ([[User talk:2601:200:c082:2ea0:9cf0:82c3:f2ea:74c4#top|talk]]) 18:33, 5 December 2023 (UTC)</small>
:The date is the date of the source, not the date he made the statement that is quoted. That is, the book in which the quote is printed was published in 1994. This is the correct form for citations albeit potentially confusing I agree. [[User:MarcGarver|MarcGarver]] ([[User talk:MarcGarver|talk]]) 08:31, 17 August 2023 (UTC)


== "Believing" ??? ==
== Misbegotten sentence ==


"''Asimov refused early suggestions of using a more common name as a pseudonym, believing that its recognizability helped his career.''"
One sentence reads as follows:

This sentence contains no antecedent for the pronoun "its". <!-- Template:Unsigned IP --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/2601:200:c082:2ea0:9cf0:82c3:f2ea:74c4|2601:200:c082:2ea0:9cf0:82c3:f2ea:74c4]] ([[User talk:2601:200:c082:2ea0:9cf0:82c3:f2ea:74c4#top|talk]]) 18:36, 5 December 2023 (UTC)</small>
:Nobody is going to be in any doubt about what it is referring to. [[User:Richard75|Richard75]] ([[User talk:Richard75|talk]]) 21:23, 5 December 2023 (UTC)

== Suggested new section: "Controversy" ==

The following paragraph is hidden in "Writings > Other Writings," and I would strongly recommend that a new "Controversy" section be created to house it. I had to search the word "harass" to find it, so a reader who doesn't already know may not see it, and it's important. The wording of the paragraph itself is already very mild compared to the extent of his behavior, but at least it should be in a more logical category.

"Particularly in his later years, Asimov to some extent cultivated an image of himself as an amiable lecher. In 1971, as a response to the popularity of sexual guidebooks such as The Sensuous Woman (by "J") and The Sensuous Man (by "M"), Asimov published The Sensuous Dirty Old Man under the byline "Dr. 'A'"[181] (although his full name was printed on the paperback edition, first published 1972). However, by 2016, Asimov's habit of groping women was seen as sexual harassment and came under criticism, and was cited as an early example of inappropriate behavior that can occur at science fiction conventions.[182]" [[Special:Contributions/142.115.97.35|142.115.97.35]] ([[User talk:142.115.97.35|talk]]) 20:06, 19 February 2024 (UTC)
:There is a "sexual harassment" section already. [[User:Schazjmd|<span style="color:#066293;">'''Schazjmd'''</span>]]&nbsp;[[User talk:Schazjmd|<span style="color:#738276;">''(talk)''</span>]] 20:30, 19 February 2024 (UTC)
::There is indeed, and it isn't hard to find. Look, there it is in the table of contents. You didn't need to do a word search. [[User:Richard75|Richard75]] ([[User talk:Richard75|talk]]) 00:10, 20 February 2024 (UTC)

== Picture used ==


Isaac wore big sideburns for most of his adult life. Is there any particular reason to use this atypical image? If not, should we use an image with his common look? [[User:Big Money Threepwood|Big Money Threepwood]] ([[User talk:Big Money Threepwood|talk]]) 04:44, 29 February 2024 (UTC)
"''When the family arrived in the United States in 1923 and their name had to be spelled in the Latin alphabet, Asimov's father spelled it with an S, believing this letter to be pronounced like Z (as in German), and so it became Asimov.''" [[Special:Contributions/2601:200:C082:2EA0:9CF0:82C3:F2EA:74C4|2601:200:C082:2EA0:9CF0:82C3:F2EA:74C4]] ([[User talk:2601:200:C082:2EA0:9CF0:82C3:F2EA:74C4|talk]]) 18:23, 5 December 2023 (UTC)
:It is probably because it is the only, or best, free image. Check the Commons category [https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Isaac_Asimov here]; [[:File:Isaac Asimov, RIT NandE Vol13Num29 1981 Sep24 Complete.jpg|'''''this''''']] is the only other image that is suitable. [[User:MarcGarver|MarcGarver]] ([[User talk:MarcGarver|talk]]) 08:45, 29 February 2024 (UTC)
::I found a stack of cc 4.0 non commercial licensed images of him, I've updated the page with one. Please revert if it isn't up to snuff. I think wikimedia has some sort of clipping capability to improve the image I will look into [[User:Big Money Threepwood|Big Money Threepwood]] ([[User talk:Big Money Threepwood|talk]]) 07:22, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
:::Non-Commercial No Derivatives License (CC BY-NC-ND) are not acceptable I'm afraid. Wikimedia projects require commercial and derivative licenses. [[User:MarcGarver|MarcGarver]] ([[User talk:MarcGarver|talk]]) 12:53, 1 March 2024 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 12:53, 1 March 2024

Former featured articleIsaac Asimov is a former featured article. Please see the links under Article milestones below for its original nomination page (for older articles, check the nomination archive) and why it was removed.
Main Page trophyThis article appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page as Today's featured article on March 21, 2005.
Article milestones
DateProcessResult
March 13, 2004Featured article candidatePromoted
April 4, 2005Featured article reviewKept
July 13, 2007Featured article reviewDemoted
December 23, 2017Peer reviewReviewed
October 31, 2022Peer reviewReviewed
Current status: Former featured article


"Believing" ???

[edit]

One sentence reads as follows:

"When the family arrived in the United States in 1923 and their name had to be spelled in the Latin alphabet, Asimov's father spelled it with an S, believing this letter to be pronounced like Z (as in German), and so it became Asimov."

This is a ridiculous statement, because S is often pronounced like a Z.

Consider the words "is", "as", "was", "does", "words", "trains", "cars", "cans", and many, many others that are not even slightly exceptions to any rule.

So Isaac Asimov's father did not merely "believe" that S is pronounced like a Z in English.

Rather, it very frequently is pronounced like a Z.

(Conversely, there are many cases where a Z is pronounced like an S, like "waltz". In its plural, "waltzes", the Z has an S sound and the S has a Z sound.) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:200:c082:2ea0:9cf0:82c3:f2ea:74c4 (talk) 18:33, 5 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Misbegotten sentence

[edit]

"Asimov refused early suggestions of using a more common name as a pseudonym, believing that its recognizability helped his career."

This sentence contains no antecedent for the pronoun "its". — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:200:c082:2ea0:9cf0:82c3:f2ea:74c4 (talk) 18:36, 5 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Nobody is going to be in any doubt about what it is referring to. Richard75 (talk) 21:23, 5 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Suggested new section: "Controversy"

[edit]

The following paragraph is hidden in "Writings > Other Writings," and I would strongly recommend that a new "Controversy" section be created to house it. I had to search the word "harass" to find it, so a reader who doesn't already know may not see it, and it's important. The wording of the paragraph itself is already very mild compared to the extent of his behavior, but at least it should be in a more logical category.

"Particularly in his later years, Asimov to some extent cultivated an image of himself as an amiable lecher. In 1971, as a response to the popularity of sexual guidebooks such as The Sensuous Woman (by "J") and The Sensuous Man (by "M"), Asimov published The Sensuous Dirty Old Man under the byline "Dr. 'A'"[181] (although his full name was printed on the paperback edition, first published 1972). However, by 2016, Asimov's habit of groping women was seen as sexual harassment and came under criticism, and was cited as an early example of inappropriate behavior that can occur at science fiction conventions.[182]" 142.115.97.35 (talk) 20:06, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

There is a "sexual harassment" section already. Schazjmd (talk) 20:30, 19 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
There is indeed, and it isn't hard to find. Look, there it is in the table of contents. You didn't need to do a word search. Richard75 (talk) 00:10, 20 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Picture used

[edit]

Isaac wore big sideburns for most of his adult life. Is there any particular reason to use this atypical image? If not, should we use an image with his common look? Big Money Threepwood (talk) 04:44, 29 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It is probably because it is the only, or best, free image. Check the Commons category here; this is the only other image that is suitable. MarcGarver (talk) 08:45, 29 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I found a stack of cc 4.0 non commercial licensed images of him, I've updated the page with one. Please revert if it isn't up to snuff. I think wikimedia has some sort of clipping capability to improve the image I will look into Big Money Threepwood (talk) 07:22, 1 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Non-Commercial No Derivatives License (CC BY-NC-ND) are not acceptable I'm afraid. Wikimedia projects require commercial and derivative licenses. MarcGarver (talk) 12:53, 1 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]