Talk:List of shapeshifters

What is this page actually supposed to be about? Most of it seems to pertain to mythology, as the category implies, but then you get entries like "Animagus" and "Cybertronian" which are definitely not mythological. Maybe it would help to have an introductory paragraph to clarify? 209.136.39.130 (talk) 16:11, 28 March 2018 (UTC)

yes 2600:6C40:0:1AA:D09D:5E4:15A2:B5A (talk) 19:32, 28 January 2023 (UTC)

Since the request in 2018 this article has gotten an introductory sentence which makes clear the list includes both shapeshifters appearing in legend and folklore as well as in fiction. I hope that's sufficient for clarity. Daranios (talk) 11:37, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

@Daranios It definitely is better, though there are still some issues. (For example, the myrmidons were NOT shapeshifters, but animals who were permanently turned into humans; since they could not thereafter change their form in any way, they don't belong on this list any more than merpeople do. Similarly, in what way is a Hellhound or a Unicorn a shapeshifter??? Even a mananggalan isn't a shapeshifter any more than a Crawling Hand would be.) Also, some entries involve not true shapeshifters, but those who can stretch body parts or reshape their body, like Jake the Dog and SpongeBob. these are not truly shapeshifters as known in mythology and folklore, and inclusion in the list generally implies they are true shapeshifters. I would suggest either removing them, or making subcategories in the Fiction heading to distinguish stretching abilities. Mastakos (talk) 17:35, 5 December 2024 (UTC)

Also it had Otherkin listed under it which is a real culture/subculture and none physically shapeshift (Source: My own dysphoria) SoldierBluejay (talk) 17:30, 24 October 2024 (UTC)

@Mastakos: I think there are two separate questions involved here: a) Is the introductory sentence fine to define the scope of this article? b) Do the current list entries conform to this definition? I have no problem with someone removing examples which are here in error, but ideally one would take a closer look before any removals. For example, I would have readily believe that hellhounds are here just by error. But taking a look at that article, there's a sourced claim that legends in Latin America equate black hellhounds with shape-changing sorcerers. In such a case, in my view it would be best to include an explanatory sentence and especially a reference. (There is also the corresponding "needs citations" tag here.) Everthing where no reference can be found after a decent search should be removed. Daranios (talk) 11:27, 6 December 2024 (UTC)

Merpeople?

Merpeople are listed under humans turning into animals. Although some specific merfolk might shape shift (and can be added individually), most are part-humans hybrids. I am this deleting that item. Mastakos (talk) 17:22, 5 December 2024 (UTC)

Werebat, Werecoyote; werebear?

Werebat and Werecoyote are listed with no linked page and no source. additionally. "werebear" is included as part of the entry for Berserker

I don't know if any historical source that refers to berserkers as Werebears; this seems added based on recent popular culture such as Dungeons and Dragons. the same is true of Werecoyote and (especially) Werebat, which are not historical terms that I have seen anywhere outside of RPGs.

I suggest remove "werebear" from the listing for Berserker; and suggest removing both Werebat and Werecoyote unless someone finds enough legitimate material to give them their own pages; or movinf them to the Fiction section at the end. Including them in the first list is confusing and misleading. Mastakos (talk) 17:27, 5 December 2024 (UTC)

@Mastakos: My feeling is that werebat and werecoyote are from more modern fantasy, and the former especially linked to Dungeons & Dragons. There are, however, some some secondary sources for e.g. werecoyote, it seems. So again I think we should look first, see if sources can be found and add them. And only remove when they cannot be found.

For the "werebear" I have a feeling that it is more linked to Tolkien's Beorn, shapechanging into a bear and showing berserkerlike attitude, than Dungeons & Dragons coming later. But again, if you check out the Berserker article, you do find the opinion that berserkers appeared as shapechangers in nordic sagas from some scholars. (And that was very much Tolkien's area of interest, so he would have been aware of that and most likely this was one inspiration for Beorn.) Daranios (talk) 11:27, 6 December 2024 (UTC)

@Daranios As for werebear, it is the word itself I felt to be out of place, not the entry. Sorry if I wasn't clear. Mastakos (talk) 06:55, 7 December 2024 (UTC)

Merge with Shapeshifter?

Just now realized that Shapeshifting contains embedded lists which are pretty much directly a WP:Content fork of our list here. Also, List of shapeshifters in myth and fiction redirects there. For time-reasons I would not be the one to perform a merge, but I do think merging would be the sensible thing to do. What does anyone else think? Daranios (talk) 16:08, 17 December 2024 (UTC)