Jump to content

Talk:Halo (TV series)

Page contents not supported in other languages.
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Danhash (talk | contribs) at 13:40, 18 July 2023 (→Vandalism targeting Pablo Schreiber: source of vandalism). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for speedy deletion:

You can see the reason for deletion at the file description page linked above. —Community Tech bot (talk) 20:22, 5 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

No response necessary

@YoungForever: "Will premiere" is not a "violation of WP:CRYSTAL" as it was sourced and is really no different than "is set to premiere". Let's not disrupt articles just to needlessly nick-pick, mm-kay? Have a nice day - wolf 00:43, 31 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Excuse me? I have been told by many veteran editors that "will premiere" falls under WP:NOTCRYSTAL and that "is set to premiere" or is scheduled to premiere" should be used. — YoungForever(talk) 00:48, 31 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Tomato, ta-mah-toe... - wolf 02:51, 31 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Especially after how many times it's been delayed... Tyrone Madera (talk) 18:50, 31 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Budget figure seems wrong

The budget is listed as being $10 million per episode, but further down the article it mentions a $200 million dollar budget linking to an article about the budget bring $90 million for the 10 episodes.

Why is there mention of a $200 million budget? Rmanke (talk) 05:14, 27 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The Variety article definitely doesn't mention $200 million, but there are articles that do: https://movieweb.com/halo-renewed-season-2-ahead-series-premiere-paramount/ https://www.pcgamer.com/among-microsofts-surprises-is-that-the-halo-tv-series-is-real-and-coming-2022/. Not sure what's going on there. Stevewonderbelt (talk) 19:18, 31 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

That's old information, and there are many more articles stating it is $90m. Plus, these aren't the articles linked in the wikipedia article. Rmanke (talk) 19:37, 31 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

True, but those articles seem to all cite this Variety article. In any case, I would be inclined to trust Variety on this, at least until an equally reputable site contradicts it. Stevewonderbelt (talk) 21:37, 31 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Someone should reference the correct article then. Rmanke (talk) 22:18, 31 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Character summaries

So, my edit on the article was deleted even though I tried to write information about the characters in the show. I ask: what the hell? How are we gonna inform readers about the changes the characters go through? Leader Vladimir (talk) 18:09, 16 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Are there secondary sources that discuss those differences? Wherever possible that’s what we should be using, both to cite the content and to determine whether it should be included in the first place and to what degree. Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs talk 13:57, 17 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I'm not using secondary sources, I'm only interpreting what has been delivered by the show itself. What are we supposed to do? Make a separate article that lists the characters appearing on the show? Leader Vladimir (talk) 15:11, 17 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Why is it important to have a character summary beyond what's needed to detail the plot of each episode? More detail probably isn't appropriate for wikipedia given our position on detailing fictional subjects and probably is better detailed at a dedicated fan wiki like Halopedia.org. Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs talk 19:03, 19 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Plenty of TV shows do this. Leader Vladimir (talk) 22:43, 19 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Again, the point is to demonstrate that it's important enough for inclusion. Everyone on Wikipedia should be reliant on secondary sources. If you add a bunch of primary source-cited stuff, there's no indication it's relevant. Plenty of other TV show articles probably do this; plenty of other TV show articles are terrible and that's not a really good argument for this one. Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs talk 16:59, 21 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

How to credit Jen Taylor as Cortana in the Halo (TV series)#Cast section

If you look at this interview that Jen Taylor did with Sydnee Goodman on her role as Cortana in the TV show, Taylor clearly states that not only did she voice the character, but she actually did motion capture (or as she specifically quotes, performance capture), even interacting directly with Pablo Schreiber so the producers could map her rendering on-screen. How is that simply a vocal credit?

@Bluerules: thoughts on this interview? I just want this resolved as amicably as possible, and may also call for a request for comment to see what others think. --WuTang94 (talk) 03:16, 8 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Where does it say she interacts directly with Pablo Schreiber for her motion capture? She said the scenes are filmed with her off-camera and she does the motion capture work alone in a warehouse.
This comes down to whether other editors consider the motion capture work to be more cast work or crew work (i.e. being a stunt double, who usually aren't acknowledged on here). Bluerules (talk) 12:18, 8 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Official RfC on how to credit Jen Taylor as Cortana

As stated above, how should Jen Taylor be credited in the cast section, as a vocal role, or just like other characters due performing motion capture work for her performance? Also, is this interview a good source or should there be a better secondary source to back this up?

Examples:

"Voice of Cortana" can be a little misleading as it might be equated with voice only, even though Taylor is also performing motion capture work. In the intro it already says she stars as Cortana without mentioning voice-only or not. CurryCity (talk) 05:16, 8 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
The lead says she's "reprising her role from the video game series", which was a voice role. It's not something that needs to be spelled out.
Like I mentioned above, this comes down to whether other editors consider the motion capture work to be cast work or crew work. Stunt performers, by definition, are also performing, but we don't acknowledge them as part of the cast. The fact that Taylor was doing the motion capture work separate from her vocal performance and separate from the rest of the cast is why this seems more like the latter category for me. Bluerules (talk) 12:54, 8 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, we don't have a separate category for "motion capture actors", and she's much more than a mere voice actor in this series. I say she stars in it, but add footnote. —Confession0791 talk 19:54, 8 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Given the nature of the role (the character is CG, she is performing mocap and voicing it) I think it makes sense to have her in the cast section. She is billed cast in the credits. It seems weird to draw a distinction in "classes" of performance when there's nothing in the sourcing that I've seen that does. Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs talk 22:35, 8 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I don't think anyone here is advocating for her to be in a different section. The question is whether we should say "Jen Taylor as the voice of Cortana" or "Jen Taylor as Cortana". Bluerules (talk) 23:26, 8 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Alright, I found a secondary source from The Seattle Times right here. This one also mentions that Taylor does mo-cap for Cortana, and Taylor even compares what she did to Andy Serkis's work portraying Gollum in The Lord of the Rings. I was thinking of modeling the prose of her casting on how Serkis is credited in the articles for The Two Towers, The Return of the King, and The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey, even considering Josh Brolin as Thanos in pages for Marvel Cinematic Universe films that feature him like Avengers: Infinity War. Either way, I do think at least a footnote mentioning Taylor's mo-cap work should be there, no matter how this is worded. WuTang94 (talk) 16:16, 9 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I added mention of her providing motion capture for the character in the prose. If other editors want to remove the "voice" part, I won't argue with consensus.
As I mentioned in an edit summary, we're not supposed to directly model prose from other articles because that falls into WP:OTHERSTUFF. I don't always agree with that policy, especially because I'd prefer consistency across Wikipedia, but I understand it's difficult to maintain consistency with all of the various editors writing here. Bluerules (talk) 02:12, 10 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Cool, thanks. I think I'll add the Seattle Times source to back up the motion capture part as it's a secondary source, but will otherwise leave the "voice of" prose as is until a consensus is fully reached here. WuTang94 (talk) 05:26, 10 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I would just say "as Cortana" and either elaborate with a single line in the cast or leave it to a dedicated section. If there were another person doing the role or other aspects of the performance (in the games, for instance, there was someone different doing mocap in Halo 4 while Taylor did the voice) I think it would make sense to be more precise and limited in language, and that's not the case here. Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs talk 11:09, 11 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
No problem. I'm interested in hearing what others have to say. Bluerules (talk) 12:14, 10 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • B. Jen Taylor as Cortana
    Including the motion capture is fine, but optional, and shouldn't go into much detail. Detail should be elaborated on in the Filming/Production section, as needed. Another example is Andy Serkis's portrayal of Caesar (Planet of the Apes), which made big news over whether he deserved acting nominations (plural) for an Oscar. Yes, the animators do a large part in creating the character as well, but the credit to the actor should not be diminished, imo. Especially if Taylor is simply credited as Cortana, which seems to be what David Fuchs alludes to above. You may want to include a bit more explanation about this near the top, since an RfC will draw eyes not necessarily familiar with the subject of the article. E.g... me! =P -2pou (talk) 05:54, 10 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    Keep in mind this is a TV series, so the main actors aren't credited as their characters - their names simply show up in the credits. Taylor isn't credited as the voice of Cortana or just Cortana; her name appears by itself to save time. On the series Other Space, Trace Beaulieu's name appeared in the credits without any mention that he was voicing his character, not physically appearing in the series. Bluerules (talk) 12:22, 10 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • B. Jen Taylor as Cortana...Though, it appears that the edit has already been made?Writethisway (talk) 00:14, 30 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

and the mischaracterizing of certain characters;[39][40][41][42][43][44][45][46][47][48] the Master Chief has been described as acting out of character compared to his core canon counterpart

A lot of these are from the same source Paul Tassi. Are they all necessary?

Also slightly odd critique for characters clearly stated to be from a different setting. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:8084:A120:4B00:E508:E23A:5F7:76CB (talk) 16:37, 1 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

They are not. Tassi should get cited at most once; if it's really important to cite that many the refs should be bundled. But in general given that the article is currently tilted heavily towards negatives despite the generally positive critic consensus, it needs a thorough recasting and rewrite before I'd bother with that. Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs talk 18:30, 1 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]
To address the "negative tiled sources", I will start to look for more positive article/sources and feedback later tonight or tomorrow, and edit the article accordingly. I've seen the acting praised, the action scenes praised, and the production design and special effects receive positive-to-mixed reception, so I have somewhere to start.
As for the source bundling, well I'm new to Wikipedia so I don't know how to fix that yet/link same sources together. Duyneuzaenasagae (talk) 18:58, 9 June 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Wokeness

Should not there be a section about the wokeness of the show as it is a perfect example of the genre, with cast, script, gender swap, lgbt narrative being ever so present in this entire show? MetalRemi (talk) 20:48, 8 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I wouldn't think so. There aren't any gender swaps in the casting, there's no particularly notable LGBT+ content and certainly nothing that would constitute a narrative, the script deviations are clearly explained by crew as motivated by a desire to give both continuities room to grow on their own terms, and "wokeness" is a term so broad and indefinite as to be useless to any serious platform. But that said, if you can find a reliable source, you go for it! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.25.5.10 (talk) 23:01, 6 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

A character's name

The one who's represented as "Mercy" in the subtitles — seems to be called something like "Ìtu" while spoken aloud

הראש (talk) 21:13, 19 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Reception Section

Overall I would say the reception section skews more negatively than the show's actual critical reception (which is more mixed-to-positive at worst) with three negative reviews sourced (Paul Tassi for Forbes, Gene Park from The Washington Post, and Todd Martens from The Los Angeles times) compared to the one positive (Jesse Schedeen for IGN). There is also a lot of focus on the sex scene in the second paragraph of this section despite the entire fourth paragraph being devoted to that topic.

Moreover, the summary of Tassi's review in the second paragraph is written rather poorly: "Tassi criticized Kwan Ha's disjointed side story, Master Chief/John being helmet-less for a majority of the series, the brief nudity involving Master Chief/John, finding the childhood flashbacks as uninteresting, the visual effects, and the sex scene between Master Chief/John and Makee."

In general Tassi gets a lot more weight than other critics as well - he is cited both for his negative reviews and also in the section about the sex scene, for example, which seems a bit redundant. Personally I do not see why this topic needs an entire paragraph devoted to discussing it when many TV shows and films feature sex scenes that do not get discussed in such a way but I do understand that within the context of this show and John as a character it was seen as controversial. Not to be too pedantic about it but even criticizing the sex scene as a war crime due to Makee being a prisoner of war is a bit of an oversimplification considering the connection between her and John was emphasized thoroughly throughout the series and she deliberately went to the UNSC on her own under the guise of escaping the Covenant rather than being captured as a prisoner. This might just be my own bias, however, and I don't want to take away from my overall point that the reception section is skewed much more negative than actual reception of the show. 2607:FEA8:E1C1:200:1C27:1165:368D:5357 (talk) 20:45, 13 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I would definitely agree with this comment, the article does few skewed towards the criticisms of the show. There seems to be a wider agro directed at the show from members of the Halo community and accusing it of being a disaster. However with a Metacritic rating of 61 and a Rotten Tomatoes one of 70, and user ratings on those platforms being largely polarised- it's not quite the case. Jonjonjohny (talk) 23:47, 13 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The Forbes/Tassi ref has been removed per WP:RSP. - wolf 03:07, 14 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
When I was making edits to the Reception section a while back and adding sections, I did add the Forbes/Tassi articles as references to paragraphs without putting Tassi in the actual paragraphs of the section. For example, Jesse Schedeen from IGN, Gene Park from The Washington Post, and Todd Martens from The Los Angeles Times, all have their specific commentary and references in the article, in the current iteration of the article at least (Jesse Schedeen was the only of the 3 authors specifically named when I was making edits. Conversely, when I added the Tassi articles, I only added them as references to the other commentary without putting Tassi's words specifically into the article.
However, apparently in between my edits and this recent removal edit, someone else decided to add and edit in the Tassi commentary/paragraph into the article itself, which upon reading that older version I can agree leans into the more negative bias and I can agree was a bit excessive. That said, it was a review, and I though those belonged in the Reception section
However, was it really necessary to remove the Forbes articles as references completely themselves? When I made the edits, the 3 articles in question, "Paramount's 'Halo' Show Is Not Going Great". "The 'Halo' Show Crosses The Final Line With Its Master Chief" "Paramount's 'Halo' TV Show Season 1 Review: No, That Did Not Go Well", provided context to the reception, and my edits did not specifically use "Tassi" in the article itself, but rather only used as references. Just for comparision, I did add other references from other sources that are still in the article, but the Forbes articles are all scrubbed and removed. That too me seems excessive, and just with the problem of too much negative bias with the Tassi paragraph in the Reception article, removing those references/sources takes away more resources for people to read and find context.
My suggestion is to not add in the Tassi section in the article which I agree is correct to make sure not to give too much negative bias, but at least edit back in the references and link them to the other paragraphs to provide context (which was how I did the original edits in the Reception before someone else changed them to the Tassi overkill which led to the total removal of the references altogether.) Duyneuzaenasagae (talk) 19:39, 21 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]
"...was it really necessary to remove the Forbes articles...?" - You replied to my post and the link it contained, but did you actually read it? Tl;dr: yes. - wolf 22:22, 21 January 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Semi-protected edit request on 29 March 2023

In the section "Filming", please change "Filming for the second season began on September 15, 2022 in Iceland, with the additional country Hungary (Budapest) to be occurred filming later in that year", so that the second half of the sentence is not gibberish. Perhaps something like "with additional filming planned in Budapest, Hungary, later in the year", as described in the source. 78.55.49.153 (talk) 01:37, 29 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

 Done. I've removed that information as the source speculates but does not confirm that filming was undertaken in Budapest. As the relevant time period has now passed, a source should be provided to confirm if filming did take place in Budapest. — Manticore 03:27, 29 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Vandalism targeting Pablo Schreiber

Pablo Schreiber has been semi protected (by Courcelles) due to BLP violations. There have have been two disruptive edits here regarding him today as well. (reverted by Renewal6, Crashedata) What is going on? Why all the negative attention? Edward-Woodrow :) [talk] 18:06, 17 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Not sure, but the edit I reverted was made by an unregistered user. Crashedatatalk to me 20:09, 17 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Additionally, I just reverted another where someone changed his name in the Starring section to "Jimmy Rings". This page may need semi protected as well, as it appears all the disruptive edits are coming from unregistered users, and there have now been several on this article today. Crashedatatalk to me 20:13, 17 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Courcelles semi-protected it. I wish I knew why, though. I can't find any news stories or special media attention. Edward-Woodrow :) [talk] 22:21, 17 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I wish I knew as well. Unfortunately, it looks like the same thing happened about a 3 months ago though. Crashedatatalk to me 22:52, 17 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
It's targeted vandalism based on a thread in the Facebook group "Halo Plasmaposting", which is also targeting the pages Pablo Schreiber, Bonnie Ross, and List of Halo characters —danhash (talk) 13:40, 18 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Talk:Halo_(TV_series)&oldid=1165956307"