Talk:Michael O'Brien (Canadian author)

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This article was nominated for deletion on 18 April 2020. The result of the discussion was keep.

Untitled

This page originally read like blatant self-promotion, and much of it was lifted directly from O'Brien's official web site; we must watch that this page maintains a more neutral point of view. I've made a significant edit today to address that. 216.209.114.49 13:01, 8 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The edit sounds like someone who as an animus against O'Brien. This page needs to written just like any other modern author. And why the preface "conservative"? Do you think authors like Robert B Parker for example should be described as liberal, because many like Parker are just that? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 137.48.50.51 (talk • contribs) 22:17, 23 May 2006.

There did seem to be a slight bias detectable, but after looking through earlier versions of this article, it looks as if someone has edited this page to remove factual statements which they personally do not "like," therefore introducing their bias. A quick search of the Internet has provided references for these statements, and so I have reinserted them into the article with proper reference links. These are not statements of someone "out to get" Michael O'Brien, but in fact statements by O'Brien himself or his publisher: 1) O'Brien really does believe we are currently living in the "end times," and it is the reason he wrote Father Elijah, a story which he says came to him in a vision before the Blessed Sacrament.[1] 2) O'Brien really does have a dim view of the future of the Catholic Church.[2] 3) the publisher indeed describes Landscape with Dragons as a "controversial" look at the "paganization" of children's literature in its own promotional material.[3] 4) O'Brien definitely is one of the most outspoken critics of Harry Potter, and he did call it a "gnostic invasion."[4] Clearly these statements are factual, verifiable, and should not be deleted without discussion. Also, having read Landscape With Dragons, I can confirm that O'Brien is indeed "critical" of Lewis and Tolkien -- it doesn't mean he is "against" the books, but he does raise a lot of questions about aspects of Lewis' and Tolkien's writings which he believes are misguided or in error, from his point of view, and he cautions readers against reading them without careful spiritual guidance. (I also agree that it's important to note that he himself did not pen the list of "Recommended Reading" within that book, as people frequently make the mistake of believing he did... while it may be true that it is blatant self-promotion for Bethlehem Books/Ignatius, that's probably not particularly relevant to this article.) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 216.209.114.46 (talk • contribs) 21:12, 16 June 2006.

Umm.. if you actually look at the website you cited under [2], Michael D. OBrien proposes three different possible futures of the Catholic Church. He clearly states in bold all three are fiction. There also seems to a strange emphasis on Landscape with Dragons and relatively little on his novels, artwork, or magazine articles. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 128.183.22.24 (talk • contribs) 18:31, 29 June 2006.

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Mission statements of his publishers

@Beyond My Ken: Please see WP:IS#Why independent sources are required and WP:MISSION. I've never seen any Wikipedia article for an author or book quote from the publisher's mission statement. Mission statements are typically unduly self-serving primary sources. It's fairly common for a Christian publishing company to have a bit on its website about religious beliefs/purpose: e.g., InterVarsity, Randall House, Moody, Sophia Institute Press. It would be weird if I were to go add quotes from these statements to the BLPs of anyone who'd ever published through these companies.

Is there any particular relevance for O'Brien? I wouldn't expect that he had any say in his publishers' choices of mission statement. Nor do I think that the publishers' saying that they are faithful Catholics/publish books in line with Catholic teaching lends any extra weight or credibility to O'Brien's apocalyptic views or his opinions on fantasy literature. Cheers, gnu 57 14:40, 21 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The relevance is that he's a Catholic writer about Catholic subjects published by Catholic publishing houses and reviewed by Catholic publications (with one significant exception). He's part of a bubble, a "Catholic Echo Chamber", and the reader deserves to know that - not because it's a Catholic bubble, but because it's definitely a bubble, and that is significant in judging his notability, not for the purpose of Wiki-notability, which I've conceded, but for the reader to know exactly where the author stands in the world, what his influence (or lack thereof) is, and whether he's part of the general zeitgeist or not. He'ss had a lot of books published, which looks impressive, until one realizes that they're all published by a small number of publishers, all of whom share a particular religious orientation. Then his prolific output is put into context: it appears that one of those publishers will put out pretty much anything he writes, which dissipates the apparent impressiveness of his output. Beyond My Ken (talk) 14:52, 21 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I agree that the fact that his publishers are Catholic is worth mentioning, but disagree that the fluffy quotes from their mission statements are due. Please see this diff: I did not remove "Catholic". (It occurs to me that there might be some distinction made between "X calls itself Catholic" and "X is Catholic", but I don't think that's important here.) Cheers, gnu 57 15:33, 21 April 2020 (UTC)[reply]