Talk:New flamenco

This is NOT "Nuevo Flamenco"

I'm Spanish and I can tell that what is said in this page is not what we call in Spain Nuevo Flamenco.

To start with, Lole y Manuel, Camarón and Paco de Lucía are properly Flamenco, not Nuevo Flamenco. It´s true that they, especially Camarón and Paco de Lucía were a revolution in Flamenco, but nobody calls it Nuevo Flamenco.

As Nuevo Flamenco we reffer to a fussion between flamenco and other musics, like jazz, rock, etc, and the most representatives of this style are of course, Pata Negra and Ketama.

Precursors of Nuevo Flamenco are Smash (with manuel from Lole y Manuel), Las Grecas, Triana, Alameda and Veneno. But in the 70's nobody used the expression Nuevo Flamenco. It started to be used when Ketama started to make success.

What is said here that only Gerardo Nuñez, Diego el Cigala etc. can be considered as Nuevo Flamenco is not like that. Ketama, Pata Negra, Navajita Plateá and that kind of bands are ussually refered in Spain as Nuevo Flamenco. They are Gypsy people, who are used to play pure flamenco, and some of them even have make success as flamenco artists, but they like to mix Flamenco with other styles. For example Niña Pastori, who was a very successful flamenco singer, but she decides to make New Flamenco, like Juanito Valderrama, Rocio Jurado and Manolo Caracol decide to sing copla copla, even being great flamenco players.

Gerardo Nuñez, Jorge Pardo, etc. are more similars to jazz, but they are also Nuevo Flamenco.

Gypsy Kings are not flamenco not Nuevo Flamenco. They make rumba, that is not properly flamenco. And Alejandro Sanz, of course, has nothing to do with flamenco. Only some kind of influence.

Lately, there are some bands that make rumba mixed with pop, very flamenco influenced, like El Barrio, Fondo Flamenco, etc. People calls it Flamenquito.

 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.56.118.126 (talk) 17:14, 27 July 2010 (UTC) 

What happened here?

Anyone know what happened here? Isn't new flamenco a music genre? This article shows something about a tv show on Nickelodeon.

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This is an outrage.! To say Alejandro Sanz is related in anyway to New Flamenco is opposite to accurate! Only musicians who stick to the flamenco tradition of improvisation, placing sound first and virtuosism while mixing it should be included here! Otherwise you should regard Gypsie Kings as New Flamenco.

This section lacks BIGTIME!!! Time to expand!

I disagree with the article entirely. It gives the uninformed reader a very false impression, while offending readers whom are familiar with flamenco music. From the "compas" perspective of flamenco, only Gerardo Nuñez, Diego El Cigala comply. Ketama and most of the other musicians mentioned should be more correctly called "flamenco pop".

I am changing the "New Flamenco" section as follows. I am deleting the introductory sentence "The group Ketama has a salsa derived New Flamenco style and has become one of the most important New Flamenco groups from Spain.", and replacing it with an introduction to a concept which does slightly more justice to the subject "new flamenco".

I am deliting the sentence "Saxophonist Jorge Pardo, pianist Chano Dominguez and guitarist Gerardo Nuñez are all Jazz inspired New Flamenco musicians, and can be called acknowledged flamenceros." Because I am not sure if the mentioned musicians are supposed to be jazz inspired flamenco musicians, or flamenco inspired jazz musicians, or both. The term "flamenceros" does not exist. It is simply "flamenco".

I am deleting Diego El Cigala from the following sentence, and replacing the term "fused flamenco" with the term "fused latino" because using the word "flamenco" to describe anything of such nature is misleading.

"More multi-faceted artists, such as singers Pata Negra, Alejandro Sanz, Diego El Cigala, Martirio and guitarists Lyloly, Jesse Cook, Ottmar Liebert, Young & Rollins, and Luis Villegas have fused flamenco with such diverse styles as latin jazz, salsa, rock, pop, blues and so on."

--PeterZ 05:09, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

Flamenco Nuevo?

I thought the prefered term was "Flamenco Nuevo". Shouldn't that be the title? I'm not aware of this being confused with "latino" or "mariachi music". Is there any evidence to back up this statement? The article seems completely out to lunch to me. Flamenco Nuevo is the newest style of Flamenco music (Gypsies/Andalusia). Its foundation is traditional Spanish Flamenco. Latino and Mariachi are both American styles with completely different instrumentation. I don't know how anyone in their right mind could confuse them. The primary outside influences are Fusion Jazz and Traditional North African Music. Am I wrong?

Steve Lowther 09:10, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Nuevo Flamenco.

There seem to *far and few in between* visitors to this discussion, likely in part due to the title, which should be changed to "flamenco nuevo". It should also be linked to the main flamenco article. I removed a whole lot of ideas that seemed not related to the focus of this article and added many links at the bottom. This I believe is a step in the right direction. Thanks

I agree, this article should be called "Nuevo Flamenco". Kenshin (talk) 11:42, 3 December 2009 (UTC)

Original "Research" about a fictitious "new movement of music" - DELETED

The following very debatable piece of text has been lying in the article long enough, challenges unheeded:

There is also, particularly in the United States, a movement of music which is derived in part from flamenco, as well as world, jazz, and Latin music influences, among others. While these influences have as much an impact on this music as flamenco, it is a common misconception among the public to refer to it as "flamenco."

I have deleted it from the article, as there is sufficient basis to believe it's just a silly invention. --AVM (talk) 14:21, 22 February 2012 (UTC)

Removal of the Gypsy Kings official site from external links

They are mentioned in the article but I visited their site and was presented with a contact booking page. If it was an interview with them discussing how they drew upon flamenco traditions then maybe - and even if that was the case looking at the fact that the external links contain more words than the article itself I probably would still remove them just to refocus the content back to the article rather than the extensive list of musicians.

Every single person listed in the external links section proclaims to be associated with New Flamenco but this article is minimal and needs work. Yet not one of these New Flamenco artists has taken upon themselves the responsibility of bringing this article up to a standard expected of a scholarly encyclopedia - why the hell should we let any of you advertise when as "experts" you have done nothing to improve this article.

To the artists I've removed from the external links:

Please join Wikipedia and apply your decades of knowledge to this article - its the right thing to do and very much needed.

Thanks

Sluffs (talk) 16:39, 9 June 2013 (UTC)

Removal of external links

I've removed quite a few of the external links and the posting above gives some reasons for that but I feel as though I need to explain fully to all the artists I've removed.

I know how hard you all worked and I know what its like to play to audiences. All the links I removed had CD releases and were provided by notable musicians but this article has nothing of worth and I can't see it getting any attention from editors (many of whom may be excellent musicians themselves) due to that.

The best thing would be if some of you joined Wikipedia and used your decades of experience and knowledge to improve the article. Not only would that be useful for readers but also would allow you to develop a presence on here which can be used to your advantage. Each editor is provided with their own user page and I can't see any other editor complaining if you link to your external site on your user page especially if you've provided material for the articles that cover your main interests.

We need editors who know flamenco music and you all "know" flamenco music. I understand how busy you may be but please consider what I say. Not only do you get to reach the next generation of guitarists but also can apply your knowledge in a way that is a testament to your art. Think of Llobet, Sor, Tarrega - all were musicians who shared their knowledge with others. Wikipedia's flamenco articles are minimal to say the least.

Please accept my apologies for the removal of your links but it was strictly done with the intention of refocusing the article towards the readers needs.

Sluffs (talk) 23:34, 9 June 2013 (UTC)

Rock-and-roll ??

Traditional flamenco had been displaced in Spain in the 1950s and 1960s by rock-and-roll.[4] Artists..

This is a mistake — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.21.172.244 (talk) 10:10, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress

There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Lindy hop which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 07:31, 27 June 2015 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress

There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Lindy Hop which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 17:46, 27 June 2015 (UTC)

Jesse Cook should be added to this article.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesse_Cook 67.204.247.30 (talk) 20:03, 29 March 2024 (UTC)