User talk:Pancakefarm

Welcome!

Hello, Pancakefarm, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few links to pages you might find helpful:

You may also want to take the Wikipedia Adventure, an interactive tour that will help you learn the basics of editing Wikipedia. You can visit The Teahouse to ask questions or seek help.

Please remember to sign your messages on talk pages by typing four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically insert your username and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or ask for help on your talk page, and a volunteer should respond shortly. Again, welcome! Parsley Man (talk) 06:01, 30 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Your submission at Articles for creation: Carmarthen Bay Ferries Community Interest Company (November 15)

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed. Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by Timtrent was:

This submission is not adequately supported by reliable sources. Reliable sources are required so that information can be verified. If you need help with referencing, please see Referencing for beginners and Citing sources.

The comment the reviewer left was:

All inline links should be removed, please, and turned into references if appropriate, Wikilinks, or external links in a section so named. See Wikipedia:External links. There should be no links pointing to external sources until those in the 'References' section (with the exception of one optional link in any infobox). I think there is a potential that you have shown this to be notable, but please go the extra mile before resubmitting for review.

Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit after they have been resolved.

If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to Draft:Carmarthen Bay Ferries Community Interest Company and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
If you do not edit your draft in the next 6 months, it will be considered abandoned and may be deleted.
If you need any assistance, or have experienced any untoward behavior associated with this submission, you can ask for help at the Articles for creation help desk, on the reviewer's talk page or use Wikipedia's real-time chat help from experienced editors.

🇺🇦 Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 🇺🇦 22:16, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hello, Pancakefarm! Having an article draft declined at Articles for Creation can be disappointing. If you are wondering why your article submission was declined, please post a question at the Articles for creation help desk. If you have any other questions about your editing experience, we'd love to help you at the Teahouse, a friendly space on Wikipedia where experienced editors lend a hand to help new editors like yourself! See you there! 🇺🇦 Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 🇺🇦 22:16, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

November 2024

Hello Pancakefarm. The nature of your edits gives the impression you have an undisclosed financial stake in promoting a topic, but you have not complied with Wikipedia's mandatory paid editing disclosure requirements. Paid advocacy is a category of conflict of interest (COI) editing that involves being employed (or being compensated in any way) by a person, group, company or organization to promote their interests. Paid advocacy on Wikipedia must be disclosed even if you have not specifically been asked to edit Wikipedia. Undisclosed paid advocacy is prohibited by our policies on neutral point of view and what Wikipedia is not, and is an especially serious type of COI; the Wikimedia Foundation regards it as a "black hat" practice akin to black-hat search-engine optimization.

Paid advocates are strongly discouraged from direct article editing, and should instead propose changes on the talk page of the article in question if an article exists. If the article does not exist, paid advocates are strongly discouraged from attempting to write an article at all. At best, any proposed article creation should be submitted through the articles for creation process, rather than directly.

Regardless, if you are receiving or expect to receive compensation for your edits, broadly construed, you are required by the Wikimedia Terms of Use to disclose your employer, client and affiliation. You can post such a mandatory disclosure to your user page at User:Pancakefarm. The template {{Paid}} can be used for this purpose – e.g. in the form: {{paid|user=Pancakefarm|employer=InsertName|client=InsertName}}. If I am mistaken – you are not being directly or indirectly compensated for your edits – please state that in response to this message. Otherwise, please provide the required disclosure. In either case, do not edit further until you answer this message. You state that you are the company chairman, which is almost a disclosure. Please do the formal element too. 🇺🇦 Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 🇺🇦 22:19, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I see you have stepped down as chair. That does leave WP:COI with a different declaration, less you are connected, even broadly, with the company now, in a manner which creates a reward between it and you. A simple declaration will suffice, but please do retain your personal privacy. 🇺🇦 Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 🇺🇦 22:32, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Logo

Wikimedia Commons may not hold it. However, under the doctrine of Fair Use, Wikipedia may, but only with an accepted article. So you can deal with that issue later assuming future (likely) acceptance with BBC as a reference. Yes, it is pedantic.

Good choice using Robust Boats. 🇺🇦 Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 🇺🇦 22:26, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your feedback so far, as you can probably tell this is my first attempt a creating an article.

Logo has been removed.

I will remove direct links and place them under the citations/references and submit again over the weekend.

I have amended my profile page to no longer show that I am the Chairman of the company, I will also do what I can address potential COI regarding financial interest, any guidance here would be appreciated, we run as a not for profit community interest and none of the board of directors receive any financial reward and we are asset locked to a charity in the event that the company is dissolved.

This is somewhat overwhelming, but a learning curve, so thanks for your support. Pancakefarm (talk) 22:31, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I understand your role. I engage with similar charities, one of whom owns a Robust boat and a sailing club who also own one. 🇺🇦 Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 🇺🇦 22:33, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hi TimTrent,

Robust boats are great, have you been on any of their boats. I have to go know, get some rest as we are laying the boat up for the winter tomorrow morning. So edits will be made over the weekend.

Cheers again for your help! Pancakefarm (talk) 22:38, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

There is no deadline here, edits can be made when you wish. I'm happy to give you such guidance as I am able, so I suggest you might work with rather than just submit the draft. A reviewer's role is to accept any draft whcih we think has a better than 50% chance of surviving an immediate deletion process. The fewer things to criticise the better the chances. ALL depends on references:

We require references from significant coverage about the topic of the article, and independent of it, in multiple secondary sources which are WP:RS please. See WP:42. Please also see WP:PRIMARY which details the limited permitted usage of primary sources and WP:SELFPUB which has clear limitations on self published sources. Providing sufficient references, ideally one per fact referred to, that meet these tough criteria is likely to allow this article to remain. Lack of them or an inability to find them is likely to mean that the topic is not suitable for inclusion, certainly today.

I am very used to the one at https://www.dartsailability.org/our-fleet (scroll down until you see a large aluminium craft) whch has a load carrying deck on a planing hull. At my sailing club in the midlands we have a buoy lifting (once self powered) barge, with central well and derrick

Message me on my user talk page when ready and we'll work together. I have a busy weekend so am unlikely to be online, potentially until Tuesday. May the laying up go well. 🇺🇦 Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 🇺🇦 22:48, 15 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

We'll sort the logo out once the draft is accepted as an article. There are reasons why it cannot be done until then. I doubt you woudl wish to release it under a Wikipedia suitable licence for anyone to use.

Please read WP:YOUTUBE. I suggest yu use that under external links. WP:FACEBOOK needs checking, please. You may have to discard Facebook.

Any more than three references per fact will normally get this comment from me:

This is a prime example of WP:CITEKILL. Instead we need one excellent reference per fact asserted. If you are sure it is beneficial, two, and at an absolute maximum, three. Three is not a target, it's a limit. Aim for one. A fact you assert, once verified in a reliable source, is verified. More is gilding the lily. Please choose the very best in each case of multiple referencing for a single point and either drop or repurpose the remainder.

Obviously I'm sparing you that.

Your vessel behaves typically for its builder. A pair of 115s gives it spectacular performance. Dart Sailability's was designed for a pair of 90s, but we specified a pair of 40s, which still propelled it two up at 27knots. Usually she carries a dozen persons in total, reducing the number by weight of heavy wheelchairs, and can achieve 12knots fully laden. I'm slightly envious of your skippers! I used to be commercially qualified, had my own wildlife charter boat in Dartmouth, and skippered the Dart Harbour Yacht Taxi for many years. Today I'm a powerboat instructor, among other things, and let my endorsement lapse.

I've digressed. I think I can accept this after you make these small changes, though I will give it a hard stare first. After acceptance it is in the hands of others, with all that implies 🇺🇦 Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 🇺🇦 20:45, 18 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your reply, really appreciate it.

Noted re the logo, not in any mad panic
I will read the suggested WP articles re Facebook, YouTube etc. and will make change further and let you know
Same with WP:citekill, I'll trawl through references (and put the reference heading in, as well as another heading for external links, (is it ok to post our own site under external links if it is already in the company info panel, or is that uncessary repetition?). If per chance you noticed that I had provided too many citations for a particular facy, please could you advise of which ones to help.

Have you watched Glansteffan on the YouTube videos, the Cruising the Cut on shows just how nimble she is at speed, our skippers do enjoy being at helm! Dartmouth is a nice part of the world, visited there with work many years ago and that was my first experience of ferries on tidal estuaries. Will look up the taxi you mentioned. What sort of boat did you use for your wildlife charter?

Anyway, thanks for you help again. Pancakefarm (talk) 21:55, 18 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I had a Mitchell 31 with a 320hp Toyota lump.. A great design but mine was a dreadful boat. The hull was laid up too thinly and flexed. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZ5a37B1HG8 is what happened to her. That was a schoolboy navigation error! Many others have hit that rock.

I watched the two vids you used as references. Happy to watch more. 🇺🇦 Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 🇺🇦 22:02, 18 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Oh gosh, just watched that video, is that you on the bow when coming into the shore? Were the sirens coming to your aid as you came ashore?

I have tidied up my draft page (same link as before), I hope that I have not been too harsh trimming citations. I have also added reference and external links.

Any comments/feedback would be great, thanks in advance and hopefully close to being ready to submit.

Cheers, Pancakefarm Pancakefarm (talk) 14:32, 26 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hi @Timtrent, hope you are well.

Was wondering if you have had chance to review my revisions to my draft page for the Carmarthen Bay Ferries draft page - but totally understand if life gets in the way.

I believe that I have made it as good as I can at this moment, and have submitted, but any feedback given your previous involvement and experience would be a great help.

Finally, seasons greetings at this time of year!

Cheers,

Andrew Pancakefarm (talk) 20:38, 16 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I have now. My watchlist is 40,000 articles or so, so I would not have seen it had you not alerted me.

Be a father to the new article, not its mother. Let it run free and graze its knees, and resist the urge to wrap it in soft warm towels. Others will edit it now.

Yes, that was me on the bow. A sad day, proving that anyone v]can make a navigation error, however well they know the sea area. The sirens were the rock hoppers playing with their truck!

There should really be a south cardinal just off that rock, but there isn't. Instead the new is that a port lateral mark is sufficient, and that may well be a correct view. 🇺🇦 Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 🇺🇦 22:01, 16 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Brilliant thanks for your help. Agree, that it's best to let it run free and rather than molly-coddle it after I have looked at couple of things, I have edited the Ferryside page to link and will do so for Llansteffan article also.

Will also look to work on the note at the top of the page relating to "This article contains paid contributions. It may require cleanup to comply with Wikipedia's content policies, particularly neutral point of view." But that is something I will work on in due course. Hope that it should not be too difficult to address, but more reading required.

It is great to see the article loose and live! Your feedback has been great and certainly made me feel welcome as part of the Wiki Community.

Hope to see you onboard Glansteffan one day if you are ever in Carmarthenshire.

Cheers again! :-) Pancakefarm (talk) 22:19, 16 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I might ask to drive! The vessel is an attractive proposition and one can't get enough different vessel experience. A couple of years back I taught a powerboat L2 course to three 12 year old boys on an 80hp 5.5m RIB. I've also taught a very severely autistic 13 year old/o to the same level and on the same RIB. Now those were fun experiences

I should probably remove that banner, after your assurances 🇺🇦 Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 🇺🇦 22:28, 16 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Please do remove it, unless I can.

You are welcome to come along and view her anytime.

I only got involved in the company during covid after joining the local boat club, just before covid, just paid to do my PPR, I will do my PB2 next year, but not sure I will ever get my commercial endorsement (I am red-green colour blind). Pancakefarm (talk) 22:32, 16 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The colour blindness means you will be unlikely to pass an ENG1 or the less stringent ML5 medical. However the commercial endorsement might be able to be restricted to hours of daylight. The RYA can advise you prior to your shelling out on the First Aid, Professional Practices and Responsibilities, and Personal Survival courses. However, that does not prevent your helming under a qualified person's supervision. It just prevents your being the skipper if I recall correctly. 🇺🇦 Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 🇺🇦 22:39, 16 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I believe you are correct! I have helmed under supervision and thoroughly enjoyed it! The PPR I think will be relevant as director just as much as a crew mate or skipper. Pancakefarm (talk) 22:43, 16 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

You might think so now about PPR, but I suspect you will not when you see the syllabus. I recall it's being about the qualifications needed for all types of coded vessels including blue water. Coastal needs under 10% or the material and the multiple choice exam is a PITA. Your own risk analysis and method statements will be far more useful to you, plus the skipper's ability to perform a dynamic RA as weather and tide change.

I think the Personal Survival is most relevant to the org's needs. DSC Short Range VHF, too. Every seafarer should be radio literate, especially stand up paddle boarders! 🇺🇦 Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 🇺🇦 22:51, 16 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Your submission at Articles for creation: Carmarthen Bay Ferries Community Interest Company has been accepted

Carmarthen Bay Ferries Community Interest Company, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.

Congratulations, and thank you for helping expand the scope of Wikipedia! We hope you will continue making quality contributions.

The article has been assessed as Start-Class, which is recorded on its talk page. Most new articles start out as Stub-Class or Start-Class and then attain higher grades as they develop over time. You may like to take a look at the grading scheme to see how you can improve the article.

Since you have made at least 10 edits over more than four days, you can now create articles yourself without posting a request. However, you may continue submitting work to Articles for creation if you prefer.

If you have any questions, you are welcome to ask at the help desk. Once you have made at least 10 edits and had an account for at least four days, you will have the option to create articles yourself without posting a request to Articles for creation.

If you would like to help us improve this process, please consider leaving us some feedback.

Thanks again, and happy editing!

🇺🇦 Fiddle^Timtrent Faddle^Talk to me 🇺🇦 21:56, 16 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]