User talk:Someone another/Genres suggested layout

Management sims

I would suggest renaming Construction and management sims to just Management sims, and include Artificial life games there. Here is the MobyGames category on the subject. SharkD (talk) 23:35, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

CMS is established here[1]. The article already mentions "management games" as an alternative title. I don't think we should waste time with renames until we're going to try to tackle them all. Right now, it's more important to pull the mess apart.

The same source distinguishes artificial life games from management games. [2] Artificial Pets and Life Sims / Social Sims are subgenres of artificial life.

It would also be helpful if someone could create a vehicle simulations article. [3]. Vehicular combat games are a subgenre of this genre, according to this reliable source. 65.95.157.129 (talk) 23:18, 10 December 2007 (UTC)

Sorry, I've been meaning to create that article, but I've been up to my eyeballs and I wanted to find at least some cites to start it off so it's not deleted on sight. I'll take a look now to see if I can find some and get it started. Someone another (talk) 01:27, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

Real life first :) I've been swamped too. Had some free time today. I'll probably have more free time on the weekend. I can definitely help fill it out, assuming you can keep it alive for a few days whenever you create it. 65.95.157.129 (talk) 05:37, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

Discussion

Hey. Sorry I've been busy, but I think the work you're doing here is really helpful. I won't have much time to pitch in, but I can discuss here and there. Maybe over the holidays I'll have more time. I think the most interesting thing you've done here is pull out "video game types". I think that's two steps forward, but one step back. What makes something a "type" and not a genre? It's fuzzy, and I think it will lead to a lot of edit wars as articles are tagged with one or the other. That said, these "types" are different from the other genres we have. Take "Adult Video Game" and "Adventure Video Game". Some games can be both. Some games are one or the other. Many games are neither. Look at the article on film genre. You'll realize that genres aren't a tree structure, but more like a matrix structure. There are multiple ways to slice up the world of films, games, books, and so on. We've done a great job of slicing up games by their gameplay. The reason these other "types" don't fit is because they have nothing to do with gameplay. We're slicing in some other direction. I would recommend sorting a few of the "types" into another set of categories.

• Video game genres by gameplay
  • (what we have now)
• Video games by purpose
  • Adult video game (any type of gameplay, for erotic of sexual purposes)
  • Advergame (any type of gameplay, for the purpose of advertising)
  • Educational game (any type of gameplay, for the purpose of education)
  • Exergaming (for the purpose of exercise)
  • Christian video game (for religious purposes)
  • Casual game (for soccer moms)
  • Serious game (usually to make a political or social comment)
• video games by hardware
  • Arcade game (any type of gameplay, but in a public setting in a giant casing)
  • Audio game (purely auditory games, with no visual component)
  • Light gun
  • Console game
  • PC game
  • handheld game
• video games by view point
  • Text game (e.g.: requires a keyboard)
  • 2D
  • 2.5D
  • 3D

There's also a few sort of "binary categories" or "one dimensional measurements"

• (Non-Game & Sandbox game & Software toy) VS Linearity --> how linear or goal-oriented is the game?
• Simulation game VS Fantasy --> how realistic is the game?
• Traditional game VS well, anything that's actually a video game --> is it an adaptation of a non-video game?

It's not perfect. But I feel like I'm onto something. 65.95.157.129 (talk) 18:42, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

It's Simulation vs. Abstraction, not Simulation vs. Fantasy. A detatiled fantasy wargame is an accurate simulation of fantasy warfare. SharkD (talk) 23:18, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

Also, a text game (according to the article), doesn't require a keyboard. I'm sure a developer could easily make a text game which uses a gamepad as input. Also note the mention of Quake in the article. SharkD (talk) 23:22, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, maybe text games should be included with other viewpoints. 3D game, 2D game, and so on. Whatever the distinction is, the simulation article has evolved towards an article on game realism rather than an actual genre. Apparently there are real time strategy simulations and first person shooter simulations too, now. Next they'll probably call The Incredible Machine a puzzle-sim, because of its realistic physics. At any rate, that's an article/category that needs some attention. 65.95.157.129 (talk) 00:29, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

Separating video games from other games

I think it would be helpful for this "genre" mini-project if we separated video game content from other game content. One example is Strategy_video_game (which is being redirected currently) vs Strategy game. It's strange for people to click on a link in the "video game genres" template and end up at a non-video game (e.g.: board game) article. Some articles only mention video games deep in some subsection. Besides being unintuitive, some users are currently being misdirected to information they don't want. Thoughts? 65.95.157.232 (talk) 03:29, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

In this case, there's not really much different that you can write about video games than non-video games. It makes no sense to have the same content spread across multiple articles. SharkD (talk) 03:52, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

I think the section Strategy_video_game#Computer_strategy_games shows otherwise. It's really an article within an article, with important differences in content. When someone interested in strategy board games is looking for information on Chess, Go, and Mastermind, concepts like Real-Time, 4X, and Artillery are irrelevant. Vice versa, someone who clicks on this article looking for video game information aren't trying to understand chess.

Also, the current strategy board games article emphasizes this distinction between skill and luck. (e.g.: versus board games that are all about dice rolls.) That's just not the relevant distinction for strategy video games, which have plenty of "dice rolls". Strategy video games are more about distinguishing twitch gameplay versus planning.

There's an obvious relationship, and these articles should continue to be linked. But the differences are as obvious as the 7 sections embedded in the middle of a board game article. 65.95.157.232 (talk) 20:28, 29 December 2007 (UTC)

It's certainly something to aim for, but it would be extremely useful if the strategy game article were expanded first. The videogame material is repetition of individual strategy genres and the general strategy information is totally undernourished. If enough material could be produced to split them then it would leave two half-decent start articles instead of a stub (strategy games) and repetition (strategy video games). It's the kind of thing I've been meaning to do but things have distracted me recently >.< Someone another (talk) 15:21, 1 January 2008 (UTC)