Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Shorty's Lunch

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Drmies (talk) 15:56, 16 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Shorty's Lunch

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Fails WP:ORG, most of the article looks a case of WP:SOAPBOX Night of the Big Wind _talk4th 01:03, 7 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Pennsylvania-related deletion discussions. —Tom Morris (talk) 01:12, 7 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Comment Looks kind of like Jimmy Wales' favorite South African restaurant. Shii (tock) 01:33, 7 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Keep - Five references from multiple independent reliable sources. Satisfies WP:N.--GrapedApe (talk) 02:27, 7 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Comment on nomination Exactly how does WP:1E (Wikipedia:Notability_(people)#People_notable_for_only_one_event) apply to a restaurant? PS: Welcome back yesterday from your 3rd block in 6 months.--GrapedApe (talk) 02:29, 7 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Oops, WP:1E is indeed for people. But the true mening is that the restaurant claims most of its notability due to a single event: the threat of closure. And all the five local newspaper source point to that fact. And welcome to the world of unneccessary personal attacks. Please remove that attack. Night of the Big Wind _talk 06:04, 7 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Food and drink-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 12:59, 7 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Business-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 12:59, 7 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. I can't see the fact that somebody reasonably famous used to enjoy eating there makes it sufficiently notable. Otherwise we'd have a heckuva lot of articles on restaurants. --Legis (talk - contribs) 06:28, 8 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Please clarify. There's nothing about a famous person in the article.--GrapedApe (talk) 02:04, 11 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Keep It seems notable for the campaign to keep it open, as recorded in the local press. NB Legis's reason for deletion (above) is erroneous because the cafe does not claim to be the favorite haunt of any celebrity. The article may well say too much about non-notable or promotional info, but that can be dealt with without deletion. Sionk (talk) 17:00, 8 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Delete strictly local campaign to keep open a strictly local eatery, fails WP:NOTNEWS. Stuartyeates (talk) 04:08, 10 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Except that all of the articles are from Pittsburgh, which is 30+ miles away from the restaurant. Further, the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, the source for 4 separate sources, is a major American newspaper. The campaign to save it garnered significant notice from major media, which makes it per se notable--they don't cover the threatened closure of non-notable restaurants.--GrapedApe (talk) 00:26, 11 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  - As I write this, I'm sitting about about 8600 miles from Pittsburgh; 30+ miles is nothing. The Pittsburgh Post-Gazette would have to double it's daily circulation to make the List of newspapers in the world by circulationStuartyeates (talk) 04:20, 11 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
    - It's the 35th largest newspaper in the US.List of newspapers in the United States by circulation--GrapedApe (talk) 14:58, 11 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Just 9940 internet hits for "Shorty's Lunch", 0 on Google News. Skipping the ballast (facebook linkedin wikipedia youtube yelp myspace download twitter review vimeo tripadvisor), your are left with 3860 hits. As it looks most of them addressbooks and reviews/descriptions. Excepts that fight to save their place in 2004, there is no relevant third party coverage. I did not find any relevant out of state coverage or special events. Night of the Big Wind _talk 01:18, 11 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Try Google News Archives There are like 15+ news sources, dating back to 1999.--GrapedApe (talk) 02:01, 11 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  - Do you have a working link? This one just gives 0 (zero) hits... Night of the Big Wind _talk 02:25, 11 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
    - The link works for me. Google News > Archives > search "Shorty's Lunch." 15 substantial hits on the first 2 results pages. There are more, too.--GrapedApe (talk) 02:34, 11 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
      - Please give me the link to the first result page, because I think Google News is doing weird here. I can find absolutely nothing. Night of the Big Wind _talk 02:45, 11 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
        Go to http://news.google.com/archivesearch and search for "Shorty's Lunch." Here are a bunch of those articles linked: User:GrapedApe/Shortyslunch. Some articles from the Observer-Reporter are paywalled, but they still count to consideration of notability. --GrapedApe (talk) 03:03, 11 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
        Hmmm, by now I have found some newspapers. I could not find anything special in it. Only non-local papers (Milwaukee) report about Shorty's Lunch-sponsored sports. Night of the Big Wind _talk 03:21, 11 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
        
        I have read through your links, thanks for the effort supplying them! Unfortunately, both papers are local one. Having noted that, I read through all your links. There is, to my opinion, absolutely nothing in those articles what supports the claim for notability. Sorry. Night of the Big Wind _talk 03:30, 11 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
        Where in WP:GNG's notability standard of "received significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject" say that "newspapers from the area don't count." Besides, the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette and the Pittsburgh Post (a now-defunct major Pittsburgh newspaper) aren't local to Washington, Pennsylvania. Different counties and 30+ miles away.--GrapedApe (talk) 03:38, 11 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
        See Wikipedia:Notability (events) and WP:NRVE. Night of the Big Wind _talk 03:53, 11 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
        A restaurant is not an event. Nor does WP:NRVE apply: WP:PAYWALL says verifiability implies nothing about ease of access to sources: some online sources may require payment, while some print sources may be available only in university libraries--GrapedApe (talk) 03:57, 11 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
        1) But the potential closure is, and half the article is about that! 2) True, but your sources add nothing to the notability. Paywalled or not. Night of the Big Wind _talk 04:11, 11 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
        
        To my opinion, you have failed to prove why Shorty's Lunch is notable. I stop my discussion with you now, and will wait at comments from others or the closing admin. Night of the Big Wind _talk 04:13, 11 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Bryce (talk | contribs) 02:08, 15 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Keep per news coverage found by GrapedApe. Seems to indicate some notability. HurricaneFan 25 — 02:21, 15 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Weak keep - It's well referenced and makes a colorable claim to meeting GNG, so I lean to keeping it.--Kubigula (talk) 05:31, 16 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.