Jump to content

Wikipedia talk:Wikipedia Signpost/Newsroom/Archive 18

Page contents not supported in other languages.
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Newsroom discussions prior to May 2018 are archived at WT:POST.

Archive 15Archive 16Archive 17Archive 18Archive 19Archive 20→Archive 25

Pageviews

  • January 31, 2021 issue 7 articles 6 articles 1st day 1,823; 2nd day 4,601; 3rd day 4,745; 5th day 7,178; 7th day 8,090; 14th day 9,559;
  • February 28, 2021 9 articles: 1st day 1,014. 2nd day 3,513; 7th day 6,126; 14th day 7,513; 21st day 8,437
  • March 28, 2021 5 articles 6 articles. 2nd day 4,296; 4th day 6,182; 7th day 7,497; 14th day 8,995; 21st day 9,966; 28th day 11,420.
  • April 25, 2021 issue - (9 articles): 2nd day 4,241; 4th day 6,262; 7th day 9,082; 14th day 10,996; 21st day, 12,609;
  • June 27 issue 5 articles;6 articles 2nd day 4,703; 4th day 7,101; 7th day, 9,133;

Special issue about Wikipedia (She Ji)

Well, a half or a third is about Wikipedia, counting... Minor plug since it includes two pieces by me, and one by User:Pundit (if the other authors have Wikipedia accounts, I am not familiar with them and can't ping them, sadly). Well, Ken Friedman, the journal editor who initiated this research project, had an account but is no longer active. Open access here https://www.sciencedirect.com/journal/she-ji-the-journal-of-design-economics-and-innovation/vol/7/issue/2 Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 07:58, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

Thanks, we'll make sure to mention these in "Recent research" (I also just tweeted them from @WikiResearch). Btw interesting to read professor Friedman's research finding that "As a commercial venture, with taxes and business costs to pay, [Wikipedia] might well collapse."
PS: Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Newsroom/Suggestions is the default location for tips.
Regards, HaeB (talk) 14:36, 25 June 2021 (UTC)
HaeB, Thanks. I think his piece is interesting and valuable, but the sentence you quote is more of speculation (untested hypothesis...) than a research finding. Just a nitpick :P Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 06:16, 26 June 2021 (UTC)
HaeB, PS. I assume they'll be mentioned in the new issue, since today's doesn't do so? Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 05:37, 28 June 2021 (UTC)
I've put them on our todo list. They will definitely be covered, but when and at what length depends on how many folks volunteer to do writeups ;)
Regards, HaeB (talk) 08:41, 28 June 2021 (UTC)

Publishing should be on schedule

I think there will be 11 articles, so all copy editors will be needed! Smallbones(smalltalk) 04:18, 26 June 2021 (UTC)

Smallbones, great! Thoughts on the Wikinews submission? Ganesha811 (talk) 13:56, 26 June 2021 (UTC)
Also, if there's any particular article you'd like to assign me to copyedit, I'm happy to! Ganesha811 (talk) 13:57, 26 June 2021 (UTC)

@Ganesha811, Bri, and Isaacl: As usual, I'm running late with the stories I'm writing. But

  • In the media is ready for CE but the Video and podcast section will need to be updated. Unfortunately, with two months of material, I've had to remove some - so no more stories there.
  • Humour is ready for CE
  • News from the WMF just needs some formatting - CE should be limited to very obvious spelling and grammar mistakes, since it's been published elsewhere already
  • Traffic report is always a challenge for me -the June sections (near the bottom( could use a 2nd or 3rd set of eyes). Note that the authors have their own style, which we need to respect, but occasionally it does get a bit convoluted. Word choice can be a bit odd at times - but please take the time to think it through before changing. One thing that's really my job is checking to see if any WP rules have been broken, particularly WP:BLP. Any help there appreciated.
  • Please leave the obit alone for now. Obits can be a minefield - this one in particular.
  • Recent research is almost always the last submission - right on the deadline. @HaeB: is a former Signpost EiC, so he knows what he is doing. But I check quickly just to make sure he hasn't lost his glasses or unintentional included his file on my life history.
  • There will be more. Smallbones(smalltalk) 15:14, 26 June 2021 (UTC)
    Smallbones, ok! I've copyedited News from the WMF (very minor changes) and the June section of the traffic report (slightly more substantial changes). Ganesha811 (talk) 16:08, 26 June 2021 (UTC)

We're doing pretty well. There are just 3 more articles to come. 1 I'm having 2nd thoughts, nut pretty much have to publish it. 2 Disinformation report - one section to go, plus checking out another source that may add a bit here and there. Done in 2 hours. 3 News and notes - not really started yet. There are about 5 stories to go in there. Feel free to start a section and take a shot.

@Ganesha811: thanks for your work on Traffic report. The pic you changed got removed as non-free by a bot, so I put the old one back. We can't use non-free images on The Signpost because we're not in mainspace.

As far as removing material, I'm agnostic on most of those. Some folks come down more on one side or the other in Israeli-Palestinian matters. I try to avoid getting caught in the middle. I'll ping @Bri and Igordebraga: to see if they agree with your changes. Like I said Traffic report can be a challenge. Smallbones(smalltalk) 19:01, 26 June 2021 (UTC)

If you are talking about this then yes, I found the original distasteful and it stuck out as picking sides. But I don’t know what our editorial policy is on material we pick up from other portions of project space. ☆ Bri (talk) 19:13, 26 June 2021 (UTC)
Bri, Smallbones yes, I struck out some material related to Israel-Palestine. I have strong opinions on the issue myself, but I really don't see the point raising the conflict in such an opinionated way in the Traffic Report - it gains us controversy and discord in exchange for no benefit to anyone. Thanks for the note on the image, didn't know that rule. Ganesha811 (talk) 19:58, 26 June 2021 (UTC)

Thanks @Bri and Ganesha811:. I don't know that we have a specific policy on outside (previously published) material. I do check things before I go out and ask somebody if they want to reprint something here. With Traffic report it's a bit different, since they've been publishing here a long time. If I'm not sure about something there, I tend to ping Igordebraga. Note that he doesn't write everything there, but as far as I'm concerned, he's in charge of the submission. So same rules for TR as anybody else, taking into account their stylistic differences. But this doesn't come in under "style". If Igordebraga doesn't get back to us, or if he agrees with you that the material is offensive, then it stays out. If he disagrees, I'll look at it again. Smallbones(smalltalk) 20:31, 26 June 2021 (UTC)

@Smallbones: Just noticed the same passage has been edited in the published Top25 Report. I will copy-paste it into ours. Disregard, it still has issues. Self-reverted. ☆ Bri (talk) 21:36, 26 June 2021 (UTC)
We agreed that I had the last edit. If he objects to anything, he's got my email. I think I'll take the bolded intro off the top - do you think we're being too nasty? Smallbones(smalltalk) 00:08, 27 June 2021 (UTC)
Smallbones, if you'd like. Neither of you were shy about your opinions, and while I definitely wouldn't want to edit your words (or his), I figured it was worth having an additional clarification that a vigorous exchange of ideas is what the Forum column is for. Ganesha811 (talk) 01:35, 27 June 2021 (UTC)

Should be ready in about 4 hours

@DannyS712 and HaeB: we should be ready to go on timr in about 4 hours. I'm still working on News and notes, so could use some help and copy editing there. I'll update the CE status soon, with one request - lots of people are very sensitive about the obit, It looks like is in equilibrium now, but please *don't* copy edit it now.

Smallbones(smalltalk) 15:52, 27 June 2021 (UTC)

Thanks - "Recent research" will morph into a publishable shape before 20:00 UTC. Regards, HaeB (talk) 16:21, 27 June 2021 (UTC)
@Smallbones: I'll be ready to publish, just let me know which order to put the articles in DannyS712 (talk) 19:14, 27 June 2021 (UTC)
@DannyS712: Thanks - the order can be approx, the same as in The Newsroom. The only absolute is that the OBIT is last as always - a place of honor and always easy to find . Smallbones(smalltalk) 19:21, 27 June 2021 (UTC)

Back in 10 minutes. Smallbones(smalltalk) 20:07, 27 June 2021 (UTC)

@Smallbones:  Doing... DannyS712 (talk) 20:08, 27 June 2021 (UTC)
Yes Sent --DannyS712 (talk) 20:15, 27 June 2021 (UTC)
Fantastic @DannyS712: You are accurate and fast too! I think we're all done here! Smallbones(smalltalk) 20:27, 27 June 2021 (UTC)

Thanks everybody

Reader feedback

View reader feedback on issue 5 (June)

All: You can use the button above to monitor feedback on the June 27 issue. ☆ Bri (talk) 21:13, 27 June 2021 (UTC)

Passing of Sherwin Siy

Sherwin Siy, Lead Public Policy Manager of the Wikimedia Foundation, died on Wednesday 7 July 2021.

On Facebook his sibling said that he died "while having a great time on a vacation with friends". I posted on his meta page. meta:User_talk:SSiy_(WMF)#Sherwin_is_passed

Sherwin had many professional relationships and Wikimedia projects, but I am unaware of most of them. I knew Sherwin to be a strong supporter of Wikimedia LGBT+ and an advocate of safety for vulnerable online user communities. Wikimedia LGBT+ is a small distributed community and losing a friend and advocate in the Wikimedia Foundation is a major setback the growth of community infrastructure and projects.

I am unsure how anyone will immediately reflect on his life, but I wanted to post here to say that among other memories, he supported our LGBT+ community. I would like to get a brief obituary for him but I am pausing a bit because I knew his minor but significant LGBT+ activities, but I am unaware of his major projects. If anyone steps up to describe his main projects then those should be the focus. Being a lawyer doing off-wiki advocacy, it might be the case that his major interaction with volunteers was in the LGBT+ space, but I am unsure. Blue Rasberry (talk) 15:49, 9 July 2021 (UTC)

Life goes on, job posting for his position, it is the way that corporations respond to death.
Lead Program Manager, Legal Department
https://boards.greenhouse.io/wikimedia/jobs/3177156?gh_src=d5b6b1831us
Blue Rasberry (talk) 15:17, 22 July 2021 (UTC)

The essay I submitted

Sorry if it's poor form to make a post like this, but I was wondering if anyone wouldn't mind taking a look at Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Newsroom/Submissions#Rambling (title is a work in progress). Thanks! Enterprisey (talk!) 08:46, 20 July 2021 (UTC)

Publication on Sunday July 25th, 2021, 20:00 UTC (4pm New York Time)

@HaeB, DannyS712, Bri, Isaccl, Ganesha811, and Blue Rasberry: and all. It looks like we'll be ready to go on time (knock on wood) Sunday pm, with at least 7 articles. Sorry for the delay and lack of feedback, but I've just been swamped. I have cleared the time from tonight to deadline entirely for The Signpost.

  • Danny - can you publish at the same time as last month?
  • Blue Rasberry - I won't be able to get to the obit - do you want to write it up?
  • I'm hoping the Special Report will be especially special this month, but the story is still developing, so we'll see.
  • There's more than enough material for Itm, I'll try to finish it tonight!
  • News and notes and the Board elections should have some material.
  • All-in-all, SSDM.

Smallbones(smalltalk) 15:13, 23 July 2021 (UTC)

Smallbones, sounds good, I should be writing up the humor piece tomorrow, I've got a draft document on my computer that just needs some editing. Ganesha811 (talk) 15:42, 23 July 2021 (UTC)
Thanks. I forgot to ping @Mikehawk10 and 3family6: Smallbones(smalltalk) 16:38, 23 July 2021 (UTC)
@Smallbones: SSDM? What does that mean? I should be able to publish - order is the same as in the newsroom page? Thanks, --DannyS712 (talk) 00:36, 24 July 2021 (UTC)
@DannyS712: - "Same situation, different month" i.e. this issue's publishing may look a lot like last month's publishing. Different content of course. Yes, I'll put the articles in the proper order on the newsroom page. Smallbones(smalltalk) 01:58, 24 July 2021 (UTC)
I assume the issue isn't being published 21 years ago ;-). Also note you've pinged someone else. isaacl (talk) 20:19, 24 July 2021 (UTC)

Call for copy editors

  • Traffic report and the Special report are ready for copy editing. More will follow quickly, Smallbones(smalltalk) 14:31, 24 July 2021 (UTC)
    Smallbones, I should be able to copyedit the traffic report. The Humor column is now ready for copyedit. Ganesha811 (talk) 21:41, 24 July 2021 (UTC)
    • Fantastic - I'll take a look at humour and suggest a light touch on Traffic (unless of coutse ...) Smallbones(smalltalk) 22:07, 24 July 2021 (UTC)
      Smallbones, traffic report copyedit is done, with the exception of a missing image which I can't find on Wikimedia Commons, so have removed from the article for now. Ganesha811 (talk) 23:03, 24 July 2021 (UTC)
    • I have the following technical comments on the poetry. The usual form for limericks has the first, third, and fifth lines rhyming. For the quatrain, the third line is a bit awkward to read in an iamb pattern (which is presumably the intent based on the first two lines), as "Or as a" and "-ner in a" are all unstressed and both "more gent-" are stressed. The reader can make it work, but it's harder the more irregularities have to be accommodated. The last line is hard to know how to read correctly (and I'm guessing it's missing a dot before the final 5?) and has eight feet to it if read "Hear nine two six five four nine five", as opposed to the seven feet for the other lines. Of course many people say "dot" when reading IP addresses, which throws off the meter. isaacl (talk) 22:13, 24 July 2021 (UTC)
      Isaacl, feel free to improve the poetry directly! I don't mind it being a collaborative effort and I'm certainly not much of a poet, just wanted to try something fun. Ganesha811 (talk) 22:52, 24 July 2021 (UTC)
      I can spend a little time on the stress patterns and rhyming, as that's purely mechanical. I'm not that adept at matching sound to sense, though, which is the real art of poetry. isaacl (talk) 23:00, 24 July 2021 (UTC)
      Isaacl, ok! I made a couple changes to the quatrain and will now step back to let you take a crack at either of them, and then they can go to Smallbones for final approval. If you make any substantial changes don't hesitate to add your name to the author line. Ganesha811 (talk) 23:02, 24 July 2021 (UTC)

(EC)How about?

  • The Co-Founder's Lament
  • There once was a learnèd philosopher,
  • Who was Nupedia's first ex-officer,
  • But over the years,
  • His hopes turned to fears,
  • "We need an expert cartographer!"
  • But now the co-founder's lament,
  • Has hardened his heart to cement,
  • He sees puppeteers,
  • So now he leads jeers,
  • "The lefties my rules circumvent!"

Does that help anything? Smallbones(smalltalk)

As I'm biased towards my own writing, I hate to say that I like the connective through line you've introduced in the last three lines of the second limerick. ;-) isaacl (talk) 00:02, 25 July 2021 (UTC)
Isaacl, Smallbones, I like the flow of the second limerick better than before, but I think the last line of the first limerick doesn't make a lot of sense and weakens the meaning of the poem. The reference to cartographers comes out of nowhere. Ganesha811 (talk) 12:16, 25 July 2021 (UTC)
Ganesha811 Check out Wikipedia:Wikipedia Signpost/Next issue/Humour now (or maybe clear yout cache) Isaacl made some changes last night. BTW Elections and Special report are ready for copy editing. Smallbones(smalltalk) 12:37, 25 July 2021 (UTC)
Smallbones, I can copyedit the Special Report, I'll do that now. Ganesha811 (talk) 14:27, 25 July 2021 (UTC)
Regarding these edits: my version of the fifth line in the first limerick was chosen to mimic the stress patterns of the first line. Limericks have two weakly stressed syllables between strong syllables, and matching the patterns in the rhyming lines is key to their rhythmic feel. Regarding the quatrain, my change to the quote was to maintain the weak-strong stress pattern (that is, the iamb). I also thought the IP's comment ending in an ASCII smiley felt more true-to-life than an exclamation point, while giving a similar uplifting sense to the end of the line. isaacl (talk) 14:06, 25 July 2021 (UTC)
Isaacl, I've restored the smiley, you're right, it works well. As to the rest, well, as you say, we all have a bias towards our own writing, so I prefer the version I had written, but it's not a big deal which version gets published in the end. Ganesha811 (talk) 14:29, 25 July 2021 (UTC)
The hiccup in the meter for the quatrain isn't too big a deal. However I would suggest you look for a way to adapt the last line of the limerick, as maintaining the same rhythmic pattern is a key part of the charm of limericks. In particular, the three consecutive unstressed syllables ("-pert mustn't") is awkward to read. Thanks for your consideration! Note there's no need to ping me in this conversation. isaacl (talk) 14:36, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

In the media

Discussion is invited on a potentially controversial item for ITM: "Make NO Mistake – Wikipedia is at WAR with the Jews", on view since a few days ago at The Jewish Press, a 60 year old NYC-based newspaper with >2M online views per month. I know there's just three hours to publication but I thought this might be newsworthy. ☆ Bri (talk) 16:56, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

Bri, probably worth mentioning in "In Brief", but it should be noted that it's a blog post and not a journalistic piece. Ganesha811 (talk) 17:14, 25 July 2021 (UTC)
Thanks for reviewing it. Due to the time pressure, I'll post just what I did above, and it's eligible for copyediting w/o any acrimony from me. ☆ Bri (talk) 17:20, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

I just added a quote to it - but am now having second thoughts. @Bri and Ganesha811: it's all up to you. I'm not worried that we can or have reported it truthfully, it is or will be true coverage. I'm just worried at how are readers will understand it at first glance. It could result in some strange antisemetic reaction, or we could be accused of creating a straw man, or even Sanger could be an unfortunate target, or .... I'm leaning to self-reverting the quote, but you might deal with this better than I can now.

BTW: News and notes could use at least one paragraph on Wikimania. And another on the Board election. Smallbones(smalltalk) 18:27, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

Smallbones, I reverted the quote, I don't think it's needed and could lead to issues as you suggest. I'm afraid I can't add anything to News & Notes as I really don't know anything about either topic. Ganesha811 (talk) 19:21, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

On time publishing expected - in about 90 minutes

@DannyS712 and HaeB: will you be ready at 20:00 UTC? We're trying to finish 2-3 stories at Itm And even getting something for News & notes (like Wikimania!) but I'd rather dump the incomplete sub-stories than be too late. I love deadlines ;0) Smallbones(smalltalk) 18:35, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

Yes, should have RR in publishable form at that time. Note that (as mentioned earlier) it will have a review of the Tripodi paper, I will mention the NPR interview briefly but not otherwise go into news media coverage of the topic. Btw, likewise apropos ITM, this might be worth mentioning. Regards, HaeB (talk) 18:40, 25 July 2021 (UTC)
@DannyS712 and Smallbones: Sorry, I might need 10-15 minutes longer - got interrupted. My apologies! Regards, HaeB (talk) 19:48, 25 July 2021 (UTC)
I'm ready I believe but will take 10 minutes now. Smallbones(smalltalk) 20:15, 25 July 2021 (UTC)
@DannyS712 and Smallbones: Should be good to go now, sorry again (took me longer to sort out the various edit conflicts and a spam blacklist issue - turns out linking to Twitter search result is considered dangerous for some reason). Regards, HaeB (talk) 20:37, 25 July 2021 (UTC)
Sorry about the edit conflict. ETA 15 minutes. Smallbones(smalltalk) 20:41, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

News and notes

I cant find SSR – there is no such user on enwiki or ru? ☆ Bri (talk) 19:41, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

Ssr. Sorry, I'll get it Smallbones(smalltalk) 19:51, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

Board of trustees candidates

Sorry for the late note; I've not had any opportunity to look at the content submitted today until now. The Board of trustees article says "It's believed this method will result in a diverse group of candidates being elected." Is this from some statement made by the WMF? Generally speaking, single transferable vote favours candidates who can appeal to multiple constituencies and so have a broader base of support. So in theory it helps candidates with more consensus support being elected, which I'm not clear is what is meant by the use of "diverse". isaacl (talk) 20:29, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

Yeah, I'll take a look at it. I've never seen a good explanation of this Smallbones(smalltalk) 20:36, 25 July 2021 (UTC)
Voting methods where you can express your relative preference between candidates do encourage voting for a more diverse set of candidates. But in a case like this where there are no slates of candidates, it's not clear to me if compared to, say, approval voting, that the chosen trustees will be more diverse. However the article could note, as stated at m:Wikimedia Foundation Board of Trustees/Call for feedback: Community Board seats, that such systems are "designed to best capture voters’ preferences." isaacl (talk) 21:07, 25 July 2021 (UTC)
"designed to best capture voters’ preferences." is what mean when I say that I've never seen a good explanation of the method. What does that mean? I've spent a few hours over the year looking at this and just never figured it out. I do have a PhD in a very math oriented subject (not math itself) and I'm still clueless! Smallbones(smalltalk) 21:23, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

Going to write an essay on WikiLaw

I recently made a pretty remarkable breakthrough at the Testing site for the proposed WikiLaw. Of course, I'm rather excited by this development and want to share some of my proof-of-concepts with the wider community in the next Signpost issue. –MJL ‐Talk‐☖ 05:08, 2 August 2021 (UTC)

MJL, this looks like really cool work. I am honestly surprised that something like this doesn't already exist, so it's cool to witness you and others making it happen! I'm not the editor in chief, so ultimately it's up to Smallbones, but I'd want to read that article. Ganesha811 (talk) 12:47, 2 August 2021 (UTC)
It sounds a bit early to me. From what I can tell. it's something like a repacement or compliment for Lexis/Nexis with some micropayments/blockchain possibly involved to start a new project falling somewhere in between WikiSource and WikiData. I'd need to see a full write-up of the proposed Signpost piece when it gets closer to a Board of Trustees vote. Until then keep in touch. Smallbones(smalltalk) 14:59, 2 August 2021 (UTC)
@Smallbones: Not sure where you got the micropayments/blockchain part of it from (unless you mean Lexis/Nexis has those features). To give you a better idea for what I am proposing for the next issue, it would be a follow-up piece to my 2019 article in Wikisource:News. It'd go over the things I have now been able to prove possible (for example, compiling entire chapters of statutes which themselves are compiled from various subsections and subdivisions). –MJL ‐Talk‐☖ 20:54, 2 August 2021 (UTC)
@MJL: Sorry, but search for "Martin001" on Meta page m:WikiLaw_(3). I don't know where the topic 1st came up, but micropayments, blockchains, and bitcoins are in the comments. Smallbones(smalltalk) 12:59, 3 August 2021 (UTC)
@Smallbones: Oh, lol. That's all just some guy's idea for how WikiLaw should go. You could do well to ignore that stuff (like I have). –MJL ‐Talk‐☖ 21:49, 3 August 2021 (UTC)
IMO it would be a good addition for a Signpost piece to let readers know how this project can help keep updates to comprehensive lists like List of bills in the 117th United States Congress, or focused lists like this one. - Bri.public (talk) 16:16, 3 August 2021 (UTC)

3+ weeks to deadline

Things look pretty good for the next issue. Here are some possible stories. Let me know where you can pitch in.

  • Bosnian Wikipedia has some recognizable problems - [1] probably just for Itm, but if anybody has Bosnian contacts it might go further.
  • Haaretz on Polish - Croat - Jewish WWII. I'm personally a bit tired of never being able to figure out what's going on here. Paywalled. Somebody should give this one a try if....
  • Three possible opinion pieces - I need to contact all of them still
  • A possible COVID disinfo piece
  • Board election delayed 2 weeks - maybe just a few paragraphs in News & notes
  • Wikimania - please register (free) so you can watch and participate - I see 2 stories. 1 a general overview, e,g how well does a virtual Wikimania work? 2 - reviews of 1 - 5 individual sessions. We can't cover the whole conference, but this combo should give our readers a taste.
  • There may be even more on the Olympics - beyond Itm and an Opinion piece.
  • Let's get a better News & notes column this month - all you need to do is add a paragraph or 2 to get it started. Smallbones(smalltalk) 15:32, 5 August 2021 (UTC)
    Smallbones, added a small item to News & Notes that will be expanded. I also am planning on another Humour column this month, haven't decided what form it will take yet. Ganesha811 (talk) 17:32, 6 August 2021 (UTC)
    I've put in an item too. - Bri.public (talk) 20:57, 6 August 2021 (UTC)

Regarding the News and notes item on the WP:Paid-contribution disclosure page: I'm not sure it's worth discussing in the Signpost, given that as of now it's a conversation between just ProcrastinatingReader and me. (It's an issue to me and perhaps Smallbones, but the reality is it probably doesn't affect anything happening day-to-day.) Leaving that aside, I think it's odd to use a quote from ProcrastinatingReader to support the idea that the entire page is not policy, as he's the one who added the page to the list of alternative paid contribution disclosure policies on meta, and he's the only one I know who's ever considered the page to be an alternative policy. No one involved in the creation of the page considered it to be so, as an earlier initiative to try to have an RfC on creating an alternative policy failed.

The disagreement on the status of the paid-contribution disclosure page is not new; it dates back to its creation in 2015, as can be seen from the talk page archives. In this discussion from 2017, Smallbones expressed the view that the entire page was policy and four other editors including me felt that only the parts copied from the terms of use and other policy pages (the terms of use FAQ and WP:What Wikipedia is not) were policy (almost all of the rest of the page is drawn from the conflict of interest guideline, which has failed to gain policy status several times). I don't want to rehash the arguments here; I only bring it up to show that it's not a new disagreement, and since no one paid it much attention back then (and no one seems to be paying attention now), I'm not sure it warrants attention in the Signpost. isaacl (talk) 02:50, 7 August 2021 (UTC)

I was actually hoping that having it appear in The Signpost would garner more community involvement in the discussion. The outcome could be "yes, we already decided this, no more RfC is required". Or it might be the reverse. Either outcome would be an improvement on the current uncertainty. In short, The Signpost is a good way to improve involvement. ☆ Bri (talk) 18:27, 8 August 2021 (UTC)
I guess a discussion between now three people doesn't feel like news to me, and that it's more editorial coverage than news coverage—making the news versus reporting the news. I appreciate, though, that some may see a role for the Signpost to shape discussion. In any case, the description of the quoted editor doesn't match their opinion, as they think that the page is an approved alternative paid contribution policy. isaacl (talk) 20:52, 8 August 2021 (UTC)
Slightly related: Lexi Wilson et al.? --- Vysotsky (talk) 20:56, 8 August 2021 (UTC)
You didn't mention it, so maybe you didn't notice -- that AfD was initiated by me. It concerns about 100 beauty pageant bios created by a few sockfarms, at least one of them is probably controlled by the pageant org. I've been fighting uphill to bring some sanity to the beauty pageant stuff for about 18 months. ☆ Bri (talk) 16:49, 9 August 2021 (UTC)
@Vysotsky: - what would the real Vysotsky say? I'll just guess "Let them eat salo!" @Bri: you may have have to write an op-ed on either or both topics. Smallbones(smalltalk) 00:03, 10 August 2021 (UTC)
We'll see if more people weigh in, but as of now, the three participants (which include us) seem to agree on altering the page layout to clarify which parts are backed by the terms of use as policy. So there may not be any issue to draw attention to by the time the next issue goes out. isaacl (talk) 00:19, 10 August 2021 (UTC)
It's a lot of work summarizing what I've done. You can start with this (2015) and this (2019) and this (ongoing) for a taste. ☆ Bri (talk) 03:17, 10 August 2021 (UTC)

Wikimedians of the year

See https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvWgO0X1Un4 There are 7 of them! Does anybody know one of these folks well enough to get an interview or a quote? Smallbones(smalltalk) 02:49, 16 August 2021 (UTC)

Here’s the list in text form: https://diff.wikimedia.org/2021/08/15/meet-the-2021-wikimedians-of-the-year/ ☆ Bri (talk) 04:05, 16 August 2021 (UTC)
Honoree Lodewijk Gelauff (m:User:Effeietsanders) has made some nice contribs to Wiki, such as being the original initiator of Wiki Loves Monuments. Vysotsky (talk) 12:44, 16 August 2021 (UTC)
If we really had labor to do something for the other five, then I could format these two into profiles or stories. Blue Rasberry (talk) 13:02, 16 August 2021 (UTC)
@Bluerasberry: how about you write 2-3 paragraphs on those two, we can take a quote from the video for others. I'll set up a page "Wikipedians of the year" Smallbones(smalltalk) 19:11, 17 August 2021 (UTC)
@Smallbones: Can do! Blue Rasberry (talk) 19:27, 17 August 2021 (UTC)
I put a button up on the newsroom development page for you, Bluerasberry. Look for "Wikipedian of the Year" at the end of the columns list. - Bri.public (talk) 22:46, 17 August 2021 (UTC)
Thanks to @Smallbones: for carrying the weight on this one when I failed to submit. Blue Rasberry (talk) 16:40, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

In the Media

Swastikas displayed on celeb biographies

We don't usually note random vandalism at ITM, but this might be enough out of the ordinary to report on. Yahoo News, CNET, The Independent. The Independent said it "appears to have been the result of an attack on the infrastructure of Wikipedia rather than on those pages using their public editing tools" though this may be a misunderstanding of how oversighting works? - Bri.public (talk) 17:18, 16 August 2021 (UTC)

Bri.public, I agree it should be given a line at 'In Brief' - the vandalism was actually to the line-break template (wbr), affecting about 50,000 pages. Ganesha811 (talk) 17:25, 16 August 2021 (UTC)
Certainly include it Smallbones(smalltalk) 19:13, 17 August 2021 (UTC)

Editing scholarships from Argentinian wine association

I haven’t dug into this much, just enough to find a single press release [2] stating an Argentinian industry association Fecovita is planning to pay for articles in Russian Wikipedia. The press release characterized it as a scholarship. We don’t normally run press releases in ITM, so this needs some other source. ☆ Bri (talk) 13:39, 21 August 2021 (UTC)

We have an embarrassment of riches for ITM this month, so we don't need it. I was just parking it there as backup in case 2-3 stories fell through. In general I could see 1-2% of the stories there being PR releases. Sometimes they are refreshingly honest, in a PR sort of way. Smallbones(smalltalk) 22:03, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

Bangladesh editor recognized

A national publication, The Independent (Bangladesh) described Sayef Turan as the first Bangladeshi wikipedian to be verified on Facebook... ruling the Internet through his social media strategy and creative writing on several international platforms [3]... kinda promotional but maybe worth a mention in ITM? ☆ Bri (talk) 00:24, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

I've done some more research on this and withdraw the mention. It looks like some kind of PR campaign has been in the works. ☆ Bri (talk) 00:31, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Publishing next issue in one week!

It looks to me like we'll have a good issue. but there is a lot of writing to do.

  • There's a lot of material to put into News and notes, e.g a report on Portuguese WP banning IP editing.
  • Also a report on a paid editing/sock/meat/vote-buying scandal for a Russian ArbCom election. (With video - in Russian) No solid connection to the Kremlin, but everybody is kind of assuming some indirect connection. IMHO. I was going to put it into N&n, but it will probably be a special report.
  • 2 Wikimania - video supported articles
  • Somebody should check the gallery to see if the format works for the subject matter.
  • Maybe 6 other articles.
  • You can certainly help writing at "Wikimedians of the year" (I'll very carefully change the rubric!) or by adding your favorite Wikimania 2021 videos to the Wikimania article. The idea there is just a short review of maybe 10 videos with a discussion of whether this will work for next year

Smallbones(smalltalk) 22:27, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

Smallbones, great. I'm going to transfer the Humor column over to wikispace tomorrow, and I should be available to copyedit as well. Ganesha811 (talk) 13:58, 26 August 2021 (UTC)
@Ganesha811: Thanks. Smallbones(smalltalk) 19:07, 26 August 2021 (UTC)

Publication tomorrow (Sunday 29th)

In about 31+ hours (3pm Eastern time) if I can find a publisher (a few hours delay otherwise) @Eddie891: can you publish as scheduled? @Bri, HaeB, Ganesha811, and Isaacl: There lots of writing left to do, but lots of CE can be done now. Smallbones(smalltalk) 12:32, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Smallbones, I'm copyediting the traffic report now. Ganesha811 (talk) 15:31, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
@Ganesha811: good thing to let me know, to avoid edit conflicts. I'll leave the field open for you. There are a mix of topics this month that may not mix well, Afghanistan, Olympics, movies. I'll suggest being more tasteful than usual this month. I'll move on to the 2 Wikimania articles. Smallbones(smalltalk) 15:42, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
Smallbones, I've gone through and copyedited. I think it should be ok for taste, but you get to make the final call. Also, unfortunately, I wasn't able to finish the Humor column off-wiki and so it'll have to be delayed to next month. Ganesha811 (talk) 16:01, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
@Ganesha811: no problem with the hunour this month. I'll check Traffic report now Smallbones(smalltalk) 16:23, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
  • The Traffic report tables are mis-formatted. I can fix them. ☆ Bri (talk) 16:26, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
    • Please do it! Smallbones(smalltalk) 18:12, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
      • Just finished copyedit. Items for possible editorial correction concern factual errors: 1) (August 15 #7/#8) the Doha Agreement (linked in the op-ed text) is not a treaty as the piped text states – the document's recitation of parties explicitly states the U.S. does not recognize the Emirate as a state; and 2) (August 8 #6) the 2021 Taliban offensive takeover of cities did not start "immediately" on commencement of the withdrawal of United States troops from Afghanistan (2020–2021) (linked in the op-ed text), which according to the full article began in March 2020, as required by Doha. ☆ Bri (talk) 18:43, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
        • Thanks, @Bri: I just did my almost final review (why didn't we edit conflict?) I hope everybody realizes that this article will be bound to offend somebody a whole lot, no matter what we do, whatever slant we take, so we might as well minimize the damage before publication. I'll check Bri's fact checking tonight. I changed the title for the article. Please discuss here. The last section title confuses me a bit. Does anybody have any suggestions. Let's keep this discussion open. Sometimes a few "meaningless" words changed here or there can mke all the difference to somebody else. Smallbones(smalltalk) 19:47, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
  • @HaeB, Bri, and Ganesha811: Eddie will be ready to publish shortly after 3pm New York Time Sunday. Smallbones(smalltalk) 18:12, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
  • I made the minor changes suggested by Bri above. Ihe last thing I want to examine is the section heading "US Forces give the nod, it's a setback for your country (August 15 to 21)" I don't think the majority of readers consider the US to be their own country, so this should be changed. @Igordebraga and Bri: How about changing it to a somple "The fall of Kabul"? Smallbones(smalltalk) 12:13, 29 August 2021 (UTC)
"Your country" in this case would be Afghanistan. But hey, it's just me using song lyrics as titles - and even if it's a song about American military intervention, felt using that to about troops leaving instead fit (they're nodding away and the setback is Taliban returning). But who am I to say, not American and this 'musical appropriation' is just the minimum effort to have titles in the Signpost when I stopped doing them in the Top 25 Report. igordebraga ≠ 15:25, 29 August 2021 (UTC)
The song reference eluded me, I do have some trepidation that readers will see it as some kind of taunt (against either country). Probably best to change it in this instance. ☆ Bri (talk) 18:36, 29 August 2021 (UTC)
I miss almost all the song reference. The Stones one I got - and it works real well. Sorry about all the careful steps. But if I don't take care now, when would I ever ... ? Smallbones(smalltalk) 19:09, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Ready to publish in 1 hour?

@HaeB, Bri, and Eddie891: will everybody be ready to go in an hour? I'll do the final cleanups and approvals. I want to complete one more section for News & notes, and if I have 15 extra minutes I should be able to make it -if somebody can copyedit it! Smallbones(smalltalk) 18:12, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

On standby Eddie891 Talk Work 18:25, 29 August 2021 (UTC)
Ready to roll whenever... Eddie891 Talk Work 19:08, 29 August 2021 (UTC)
@Smallbones: Yes, I hope to have RR in a publishable state by then. FYI, I'm working on a brief review of this paper and will link to your writeup in N&N of the somewhat contrasting results of the ptwiki change. Regards, HaeB (talk) 18:29, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Back in 5 minutes. Smallbones(smalltalk) 19:12, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

@Smallbones: Should be good to go now. Regards, HaeB (talk) 19:28, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

@Eddie891: you might as well start nw. I've only got the 1 last approval Smallbones(smalltalk) 19:32, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Going thru preliminary checks as we speak Eddie891 Talk Work 19:33, 29 August 2021 (UTC)
Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/enwiki/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia_talk:Wikipedia_Signpost/Newsroom/Archive_18&oldid=1113470193"