User talk:OwenBlacker/Archive 6

This is an archive of past discussions with User:OwenBlacker, for the period February 2009 – December 2010.
Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

Archive 1

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Archive 4

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Wikimedia UK Newsletter - February 2009 Issue

Summary: The chapter is now up and running, and we have now opened our bank account. We have a new website, and are putting plans in place for the first Annual General Meeting. Meanwhile, February has seen the successful Wikipedia Loves Art at the Victoria and Albert Museum, bidding to host Wikimania 2010 has opened, and the Government's Intellectual Property consultation has closed. We also bring the regular news of meet-ups, and a new feature highlighting press coverage of Wikimedia in the UK.

In this month's newsletter:

Wiki UK Limited is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and Wales, Registered No. 6741827. The Registered Office is at 23 Cartwright Way, Nottingham, NG9 1RL.

Delivered by Mike Peel (talk) 20:07, 2 March 2009 (UTC)

Please assume good faith

With your comment here [1] I ask that you assume good faith. Yes I claim to be a "deletionist" but I am more an anti-spam anti-advert /ist. Many CMS and other software products do not meet the notability guidelines for inclusion to wp. wikipedia is not a free webhost or ad server. I also believe it is the Afd nominators responsibility to see an afd go forth, and thus I may come off a little rough with , in my opinion, bad keeps to articles I nominate. I apologize if that is how my question/statement to your keep was taken. 16x9 (talk) 22:12, 5 March 2009 (UTC)

Why should he "assume good faith" when you show none? "Assume good faith"? Why? Even when the evidence points otherwise? OwenBlacker is quite right, you're clearly on a mission to delete CMS articles, especially Windows based proprietary ones. I hadn’t seen the terminology deletionist before, but clearly it fits. According to you, everybody else has to prove why the article should be kept. Well, you haven't made a case that it should not be kept. As the nominator, the onus is on you to make your case, not the other way around. Proxy User (talk) 23:38, 5 March 2009 (UTC)

Speedy deletion of Template:Swabian League

A tag has been placed on Template:Swabian League, requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done for the following reason:

the information in this template is historically wrong. Two leagues, that didn't have anything to do which each other, and which also had different membership and different intentions are thrown together to apear as one. The "Swabian City League" 0f the 14th century and the "Swabian League" of the late 15th and early 16th century. Also see the discussion here

Under the criteria for speedy deletion, articles that do not meet basic Wikipedia criteria may be deleted at any time. Please see the guidelines for what is generally accepted as an appropriate article, and if you can indicate why the subject of this article is appropriate, you may contest the tagging. To do this, add {{hangon}} on the top of the page and leave a note on [[Talk:Template:Swabian League|the article's talk page]] explaining your position. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself, but don't hesitate to add information to the article that would confirm its subject's notability under the guidelines.

For guidelines on specific types of articles, you may want to check out our criteria for biographies, for web sites, for bands, or for companies. Feel free to leave a note on my talk page if you have any questions about this.

Sorry, I just saw the template used in the article Memmingen. The information given in "your" template is just incorrect and misleading, because Memmingen was member of two different leagues, centuaries appart, with for the time, uterly different motives. --Wuselig (talk) 16:40, 20 March 2009 (UTC)

Wikimedia UK Newsletter - March 2009 Issue

Summary: With everything in place for the chapter, other than charity status, we have organised the first Annual General Meeting - your chance to influence the chapter's future and stand for the board. The bid to hold Wikimania 2010 in Oxford is coming on nicely. We also bring you the usual details of meet-ups and news coverage, and details of how to propose a project, and possibly get funding.

In this month's newsletter:

Wikimedia UK is the operating name of Wiki UK Limited. Wiki UK Limited is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and Wales, Registered No. 6741827. The Registered Office is at 23 Cartwright Way, Nottingham, NG9 1RL.

Newsletter delivered by Mike Peel (talk) 18:24, 21 March 2009 (UTC)

Wikimania 2010 Oxford bid

Thank you for supporting the Oxford bid to hold Wikimania 2010! We're currently in the final stages of the bid process - the jury will be announcing their decision by the 16th April. We're currently putting together the local team for the bid (who will do what if the bid wins); if you're able to be on the local team, please put your name in the appropriate place on m:Wikimania 2010/Bids/Oxford/Team. We'd also welcome anything you can do to help refine the bid in these last few days. If you have any questions, please let me or User:Seddon know. Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 21:37, 10 April 2009 (UTC)

Wikimedia UK Newsletter - April 2009 Issue

Summary: Wikimedia UK has held it's first AGM! The AGM included numerous speakers talking about a wide range of topics, ranging from collaboration with the BBC to reaching out around the world with Wikipedia on a DVD! A number of official actions were also taken - including the passing of six Resolutions, the election of the new seven-person Board, and the first new Board meeting! Also this month, an overview of the Chapters meeting in Berlin, of which two of our number were present, and details of the upcoming meetups this month!

In this month's newsletter:

Wikimedia UK is the operating name of Wiki UK Limited. Wiki UK Limited is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and Wales, Registered No. 6741827. The Registered Office is at 23 Cartwright Way, Nottingham, NG9 1RL.

Wikimedia UK Newsletter - May 2009 Issue

Summary: Whilst our application to HMRC has not yet been successful, we're after your views on the proposed New Chapters' Agreement, your suggestions for a Wikimedia UK conference next year and your ideas for initiatives to start! We also bring you updates on Wikipedia Loves Art, Other Chapters' Activities, Meet-ups and Press coverage.

In this month's newsletter:

Wikimedia UK is the operating name of Wiki UK Limited. Wiki UK Limited is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and Wales, Registered No. 6741827. The Registered Office is at 23 Cartwright Way, Nottingham, NG9 1RL.

Delivered by Mike Peel (talk) 20:25, 21 May 2009 (UTC)

Principality of Stavelot-Malmedy

Hi OwenBlacker,

Can I suggest that you withdraw this article from WP:GAN at the moment. Its a good article, but not a WP:GA (see Wikipedia:Good article criteria). I can review it for you but it will Quick Fail on the basis of WP:verify. All of your references except two are taken from the French and English versions of Wikipedia; and wikipedia articles are not acceptable as references (sources) for other wikipedia articles. (Its a circular "argument" problem).Pyrotec (talk) 16:25, 3 June 2009 (UTC)

On the same basis, i.e. lack of WP:verify, its not a B-class article, its a C-class (or Start-class); you've miss-assessed it.Pyrotec (talk) 16:32, 3 June 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for your comments; I'll withdraw it for now, then, and seek out some more sources Thanks again! — OwenBlacker (Talk) 22:07, 3 June 2009 (UTC)

It looks an interesting article. I'm happy to review it some other time at WP:GAN. Sorry, I can't help with referencing, since it is not in the 'area of interest' for which I hold any sources.Pyrotec (talk) 22:22, 3 June 2009 (UTC)

Thanks; I've really enjoyed working on it, so I'll probably enjoy finding more refs :o) — OwenBlacker (Talk) 22:24, 3 June 2009 (UTC)

The article appears to be well-referenced and of apparently GA-standard. However, references 1, 11, 14, 21, 27 & 35 are Circular References taken from the English and French versions of Wikipedia; and therefore these fail the test of WP:verify. You could put the article up for WP:GAN, but to ensure that it is not failed, you would need to replace all of these with acceptable references, within a timeframe set by the reviewer (typically one week). The article could still be Quick Failed, on WP:verify; in which case you would need to improve it and resubmit.Pyrotec (talk) 22:19, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

Ah, do all references need to be non-Wikipedia ones, for every statement? That sucks slightly, but I'll see what I can do… — OwenBlacker (Talk) 23:58, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

Anyone can put anything into a wikipedia article; therefore, wikipedia articles are not considered to provide verification for other wikipedia articles. However, if a statement in article 'A' is being used to verify a statement in article 'B' and the statement in 'A' is verifiable then the corresponding statement in 'B' is (technically) verifiable. If article 'A' is a GA or FA then statements aught to be verifiable. So, check whether the statement in article 'A' is verifiable, where possible verify the reference, and then use it in article 'B'.Pyrotec (talk) 08:12, 16 July 2009 (UTC)

commons:File:Map Schwabisch Hall.png

Hello, OwenBlacker. I'm Qbay in Japan. I really must apologise to you for my misstake. The file of commons:File:Map Schwabisch Hall.png will be delete soon, because of copyright violation. I made the first version in inappropriate procedure without awareness. One user point out me, and give a caution. So, I do delete my maps from Wikimedia Commons, immediately. Please re-upload your file after deletion of my first version if you can. Please forgive me. Regards --QBay (talk) 08:35, 20 June 2009 (UTC)

Wikimedia UK Newsletter - June 2009 Issue

Summary: This month, we have details on our response to HMRC, updates on our Initiatives and Membership drives, as well as our regular sections on Press Coverage, Upcoming Meetups, and activities from the other WMF Chapters around the globe. We're also pleased to announce that we now have a Paypal account! We also want your input on the future of this newsletter - get involved! We are hoping to get the July issue out very early in July in order to fit with our new distribution schedule, so don't be surprised to see two newsletters in quick succession.

In this month's newsletter:

Wikimedia UK is the operating name of Wiki UK Limited. Wiki UK Limited is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and Wales, Registered No. 6741827. The Registered Office is at 23 Cartwright Way, Nottingham, NG9 1RL.

WikiProject LGBT studies Newsletter (June 2009)

Newsletter delivery by xenobot 17:37, 24 June 2009 (UTC)

Speedy deletion of Template:Rename

A tag has been placed on Template:Rename requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section T3 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because it is a deprecated or orphaned template. After seven days, if it is still unused and the speedy deletion tag has not been removed, the template will be deleted.

If the template is intended to be substituted, please feel free to remove the speedy deletion tag and please consider putting a note on the template's page indicating that it is substituted so as to avoid any future mistakes (<noinclude>{{transclusionless}}</noinclude>).

Thanks. - ALLST✰R▼^echo _{wuz here} 03:22, 27 June 2009 (UTC)

Formatting of Names of European cities in different languages

Owen, the Names of European cities in different languages should be italicised (but not bolded) if they are in a non-Latin European alphabet, such as Greek or Cyrillic. They should not be either, if they are in a non-European script such as Arabic, Armenian, Chinese, Georgian, Hebrew, Korean, etc. This was discussed in detail and settled a long time ago. It just looks better that way. Pasquale (talk) 16:18, 29 June 2009 (UTC)

Wikimedia UK Newsletter - July 2009 Issue

Summary: This month, we bring exciting news about our Wikimedia Foundation Grant, as well as news on our chapter Initiatives (get involved!) and our opt-out of Phorm. We also talk about Business Cards, a recent interview of our Secretary for use in university courses and Wikimania 2013 - which seems a long way off! We also include our regular features of chapter activities from around the globe, press coverage, and meetups!

In this month's newsletter:

Wikimedia UK is the operating name of Wiki UK Limited. Wiki UK Limited is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and Wales, Registered No. 6741827. The Registered Office is at 23 Cartwright Way, Nottingham, NG9 1RL.

Delivered by Mike Peel (talk) 20:12, 15 July 2009 (UTC)

Adam Lambert straw poll on including/removing "Order #" and "Results" columns from the performances section

Hi, this may seem rather trivial but I'm trying to gauge community consensus on including or removing "Order #" and "Results" columns from the performances section on the Adam Lambert article which you have been in some way recently involved. The poll is here. Your time is appreciated. -- Banjeboi 21:40, 8 August 2009 (UTC)

Stavelot

Sorry for the late answer. The article about the abbey of Stavelot was created with material from the article about the city... Therefore I don't have any source. Sorry I can't help you. Vol de nuit (talk) 19:54, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

Wikimedia UK Newsletter - August 2009 Issue

Summary: Our Initiatives are starting to be developed - please get involved! In this newsletter, we also announce the results and prizes for Wikipedia Loves Art, and we bring you the latest on our Charity status application, in addition to our regular features on Other Chapters' Activities, recent Press Coverage and recent and upcoming Meet-ups.

In this month's newsletter:

Wikimedia UK is the operating name of Wiki UK Limited. Wiki UK Limited is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and Wales, Registered No. 6741827. The Registered Office is at 23 Cartwright Way, Nottingham, NG9 1RL.

Delivered by Mike Peel (talk) 08:29, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Please see this discussion which is related to a proposed change to {{Recent death}}. An example of how this change would appear is on this userpage. --Brian McNeil /^talk 00:19, 31 August 2009 (UTC)

Talkback

{{talkback|TachyonJack|gTranslate.js}} TachyonJack (talk) 12:58, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free media (File:Sweden_greater_arms2.png)

Thanks for uploading File:Sweden_greater_arms2.png. The media description page currently specifies that it is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, it is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the media was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that media for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

If you have uploaded other unlicensed media, please check whether they're used in any articles or not. You can find a list of 'file' pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "File" from the dropdown box. Note that all non-free media not used in any articles will be deleted after seven days, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. Thank you. Lokal _Profil 19:35, 17 September 2009 (UTC)

Wikimedia UK Newsletter - September 2009 Issue

Summary: This month, our Initiatives Director explains our Initiatives, we update you on our Membership (including some new benefits for members!), keep you informed on our Charity Status application, and update you with our regular sections regarding Other Chapters' Activities, Press Coverage, and UK Meet-ups!

In this month's newsletter:

Wikimedia UK is the operating name of Wiki UK Limited. Wiki UK Limited is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and Wales, Registered No. 6741827. The Registered Office is at 23 Cartwright Way, Nottingham, NG9 1RL.

Delivered by Mike Peel (talk) 12:34, 27 September 2009 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Prettytablewidth

Template:Prettytablewidth has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Thank you. Ten Pound Hammer, his otters and a clue-bat • ^{(Many otters • One bat • One hammer)} 20:46, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

Rügen

I removed the former countries box you added to Rügen for the following reasons:

the kingdom, later principality of Rügen was larger than the island the article is about, and has its own article with a respective fc box
as a principality, it existed from 1168, not 1162.
the principality was Danish. It was also part of the HRE, but to what extend (which territories in what periods) is not that easy to determine.
the capital was Charenza. Whether or not this was Garz is uncertain, recent research makes Venz a more probable site.
the coat of arms you added might or might not be the original one.

If you are not comfortable with my assessment, feel free to contact me. Regards Skäpperöd (talk) 12:28, 18 October 2009 (UTC)

FAC

Hi Owen. There is a huge difference between GA and FA. I'm actually one of the least picky reviewers, so grit your teeth - it's a bear pit out there. I've written lots of FAs, so I know the ropes, but even now I'm picked up on odd referencing and image issues, and that's before they have started shredding my prose. I've only skimmed through the content, because at present the article will be opposed on technical/MoS issues. You may be able to fix/replace references, but if not it may be an idea to withdraw the nom for now and get a peer review. Have a look at similar FAs to see how the referencing should look. I know not everyone likes them, but if you use citeweb, citebook and citejournal templates for you refs, it makes it harder to inadvertently omit parameters, and it enables the bots to add data like doi or pmid numbers. No reason to be defensive, if you are uncertain, ask; if you think the reviewer is wrong, say so. Jimfbleak - talk to me? 07:59, 25 December 2009 (UTC)

Have a look at Ashton-under-Lyne, a recent "places" FA to see how the refs should look Jimfbleak - talk to me? 08:10, 25 December 2009 (UTC)

I've done a draft of the art section at User:Johnbod/Stavelot. Let me know what you think; it needs a bit of a tidy though. Johnbod (talk) 03:55, 12 January 2010 (UTC)

Map of Hansa cities and kontore

Dear Owen Blacker,

researching on the Hanseatic league after today's TV feature on SWR Fernsehen (http://www.swr.de/tv/-/id=2798/nid=2798/did=5644076/1xrpjrr/index.html), I opened the Wikipedia article, found the 1902 map and your modernized version of it at http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Extent_of_the_Hansa.png.

While the color coding of your map is nice, I find it somewhat lacking in information: as the Hanseatic league was a league of cities, each of the many dots should carry a name, shouldn't it? This way, the most important Hansa cities and kontore could be identified. I admit there isn't much space in the map. An ideal technique would be to have the dots stick out a little text field, much like a tool tip in GUI programming. Unfortunately, I am not familiar with graphical tools such as MM Flash myself.

Best of holiday greetings, Gpermant (talk) 18:20, 27 December 2009 (UTC)

Dear Owen, I cannot quite follow your argument about city labels not fitting different languages. After all, how many names in different languages are there for the cities of Hamburg, Bremen, or Riga? If you stick to the name given by the Hansa or in the original map from 1902 (e.g., Reval and not Tallinn), it should be understandable to all users in all the Wikipedias.

A map with dots but no labels reminds me of geography tests we used to do in high school. "Who can name the rivers, countries and cities in an unlabeled map of, say, Africa?" It is not what you would expect to find in encyclopedia.

Yours, Gpermant (talk) 16:05, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Flag of Japan/archive2

I put in the trans title for all of the Japanese (and 1 Chinese) titles and I changed language=Japanese to language={{ja icon}}. User:Zscout370 ^{(Return Fire)} 05:38, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

CfD nomination of Category:Apartheid in South Africa

Greek letters

Note that all letters are listed in template:Greek Alphabet.

You fixed template redirect only in one letter. So please fix this in all letters from:

to:

because rest is unfixed. Thanks. 194.73.229.124 (talk) 13:59, 28 February 2010 (UTC)

Please do it, because if I tried to do it repeatedly in past, Future Perfect at Sunrise treated me as horde of banned users which I never was, regardless of editing anonymously or under accounts. He simply prejudicially associates banned users with all newbie editors editing in that area. 194.73.229.124 (talk) 14:40, 1 March 2010 (UTC)

Future Perfect at Sunrise

We should overthrow/desysop/bananize Future Perfect at Sunrise in Wikipedia, because he is most tyrannic administrator ever encountered by us there. I give you evidence of this:

173.212.202.130 (talk) 14:53, 1 March 2010 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free image File:Rheinau.png

⚠

Thanks for uploading File:Rheinau.png. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

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Thank you. DASHBot (talk) 08:17, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

I've changed the deletion tag to a speedy-deletee — from Template:Di-orphaned fair use to Template:Db-nowcommons (File:Rheinau-blazon.svg) and Template:Db-unfree. — OwenBlacker (Talk) 14:49, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

Countenance divine

I have opened an AfD for Countenance divine at WP:Articles for deletion/Countenance divine if you are interested. Tb (talk) 01:24, 10 April 2010 (UTC)

Translation proofreading

I see you are listed as a fr-en proofreader. Would you mind taking a gander at Pierre Nora, tr from fr:Pierre Nora? Aside from some minor details in the bibliography I think it's close to done. Thanks, User:LeadSongDog come howl 20:41, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

You are now a Reviewer

Hello. Your account has been granted the "reviewer" userright, allowing you to review other users' edits on certain flagged pages. Pending changes, also known as flagged protection, will be commencing a two-month trial at approximately 23:00, 2010 June 15 (UTC).

Reviewers can review edits made by users who are not autoconfirmed to articles placed under flagged protection. Flagged protection is applied to only a small number of articles, similarly to how semi-protection is applied but in a more controlled way for the trial.

When reviewing, edits should be accepted if they are not obvious vandalism or BLP violations, and not clearly problematic in light of the reason given for protection (see Wikipedia:Reviewing process). More detailed documentation and guidelines can be found here.

If you do not want this userright, you may ask any administrator to remove it for you at any time. Courcelles (talk) 00:01, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

Historical maps, principality of Stavelot-malmedy

Hello Owen,

I've been on hiloday when you posted your message on my talkpage on the Dutch Wikipedia. The source for my maps of the Westphalian circle is a rather large map found somewhere in the "Source Room" of the the University of Amsterdam. The original map is in A@ format, so it was rather diffcult to get a digital scan. It's called the Historical Atlas of Westphalia or something. It was published around 1974. I've been meaning to look it up again. Currently I'm working on the southern section of the map, but Stavelot-Malmedy and Liege are done. It won't be long untill is the rest is done as well. I could send you the half-finished work, but it might be more convenient to finish the work myself, especially as I've screwed up the layers recently.

Greetings, Sir Iain (talk) 15:22, 29 July 2010 (UTC)

Coat of arms of Nuremberg

Hey Owen, I tried to insert the greater coat of arms of Nuremberg also in the general infobox and created a combined graphic, but it doesn't work. Do you have an idea how to work in both coats? --Pirkheimer (talk) 19:29, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

Done. Unfortunately there's no way to make it bigger, though… — OwenBlacker (Talk) 19:47, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

The size was actually also my problem... The template is quite restrictive... I thought you might know an other solution. So the old version is perhaps the better one... But thank you! --Pirkheimer (talk) 20:07, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

Indeed. It looks (from the code), as though we used to be able to specify the size, but that the ability was removed. Very frustrating. — OwenBlacker (Talk) 20:26, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

History of Nuremberg

Hey Owen, I would propose to integrate the Article "Imperial City of Nuremberg" within a more open one called "History of Nuremberg". At the German Wikipedia there is the same situation and as result both articles ("Imperial Citiy of Nuremberg" and History of Nuremberg) have a lot of redundance. Of course you are the author and it's your decision. But I'm just trying to combine both articles at the German page, so that I'm interested in your writing. --Pirkheimer (talk) 17:22, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

I'd like to make a more comprehensive article about the Reichsstadt, rather than one about the history of the city more widely — writing about the administration and territory possessed by the city. I think I'd prefer to see there being two articles, to be honest. Sorry :o) — OwenBlacker (Talk) 17:34, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

I have to think about this. It's a difficult subject: Is Nuremberg and the Reichsstadt Nuremberg identical or not? Perhaps the Reichsstadt is only a certain political institution and Nuremberg a wider term. But even if the institution has the same name in 1220 and 1805, it changed itself fundamentaly. So everything flows and is the same... I have to think about this... Nevertheless, Albrecht Dürer was born in the city, and not at the institution ;-) --Pirkheimer (talk) 21:31, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

But the article about the Reichstadt is about a former country (former states of the Holy Roman Empire are my main interest on Wikipedia), whereas the history of the city started before 1219 and continued after the end of the HRR and would be quite a different article, but with strong similarities in some areas. And yes, Dürer wasn't born in the institution, but the sovereign territory where he was born was the Reichsstadt (as opposed to the Duchy of Bavaria or the Kingdom of Prussia or somewhere) :o) — OwenBlacker (Talk) 22:47, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

Talkback

Patriarchate and Patriarchal State of Aquileia

Hi,

I'm not really in agreement with your idea that we should merge these two articles as:

1. They are not identical. The Patriarch did run the state, but Patriarchate existed before 1077 when they received imperial immediacy and after 1445 when they accepted their lack of temporal power. 2. The Patriarchal state has an inherent notability as a state.

I can quite understand that it is not easy as there is a coincidence in the English name. However they were quite distinct, and deserve separate entries.

The Italian Patrie dal Friûl is even more confusing as it covered more than the March of Friuli and the Venetian administrative name for the conquered territory was also Patrie dal Friûl.

JASpencer (talk) 15:06, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

I can see your point (and I wasn't aware of that). But the English-language name for both entities is the same thing. Would it not make sense to have the content that is about the non-state entity be sections within the article about the Reichsfrei state? That's generally what seems to be the case in duchies and abbeys that have been Reichsfrei for only part of their existence, for example.

So the article would effectively be about the non-state entity, with a History section that includes a === Reichsfrei principality === section and an infobox at the top showing that (for some of the entity's existence) it was a historical state.

The Imperial Abbeys are probably good examples of these. — OwenBlacker (Talk) 16:10, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

I don't like that either as the pre statehood Patriarchate was the major player in the Schism of the Three Chapters. They really should be separate. JASpencer (talk) 16:23, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

And you have six councils held due there to its ecclesiastical status. Three of them 381, 553 and 1409 are actually quite far reaching across the Catholic church. JASpencer (talk) 16:31, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

But patriarchal State is a term I've never heard before. And the article at Patriarchate is mainly about the state, isn't it? I can see your point about wanting two separate articles, but I don'think that Patriarchal State of Aquileia is quite the right title for the state generally known as the Patriarchate of Aquileia. Tbh, I'm not sure what to recommend. Perhaps have two articles at Patriarchate of Aquileia (state) and Patriarchate of Aquileia (ecclesiastical entity) or some such? — OwenBlacker (Talk) 16:50, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

I have seen Patriarchal State, but mainly the Patriarchal State of Friuli, which is really from the Italian, and it could be confused with the Venetian administrative territory and also falsely limited to that particular area when for much of the time the remit was wider. I don't really mind what they are called, but they must be seperate.

Of the five sections in the article only one was about the Temporal power. The Patriarchy had been around from 560 to 1751 and had been a state from 1077 to 1455 (1420 really, but 1455 was when they accepted the facts).

JASpencer (talk) 16:58, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

Does the temporal state need more than a section (even a big section) about it, within the article about the entity itself? — OwenBlacker (Talk) 10:56, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

Well yes, it's a state with its own 400 year history and relations with other states. Similarly the Patriarchate had issues in its relationship with Rome, Milan, Grado and its suffragen bishops. Remember they went into a two century long schism as well. They are both important in their own right. I'd also argue that the Monasteries and dioceses are important in their non-state functions, atlhough for pragmatic reasons they can probably live on an integrated article. JASpencer (talk) 15:29, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

As neutral I must agree with JASpencer. Patriarchal State and Patriarchate were different subjects, with different territory, different time duration and different source of the power. --Yopie (talk) 02:23, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
- Yeah, I think JASpencer has persuaded me that he's definitely right — they do want to be two articles. It's just a case of working out how to name them. — OwenBlacker (Talk) 08:28, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
  - OK, I'll take the merge off. Is there any discussion board for naming conventions for articles? JASpencer (talk) 11:20, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
    - There's the talk page on WP:AT, but I think that'd be overkill. Just think of a good name for the article that isn't Patriarchate of Aquileia (state) and move them both, I say :o) — OwenBlacker (Talk) 13:42, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

Map Done

Hello Owen,

I've finally finished the Locator Maps for the Southern-Westphalian Circle. I thought you might be happy with the locator map of Stavelot-Malmedy. The Southern part of Westphalia covers a lager area so it might be harder to see the amount of details with a scaled down map. I hope it helps!

Sir Iain (talk) 20:34, 13 September 2010 (UTC)

Thank you very much for the Star! I'm flattered! :) If there's anything you might want changed you can always ask me. For instance, if you'd like it I could create of zoomed in topographical map of the "United Abbeys".

Thanks again! Sir Iain (talk) 20:07, 14 September 2010 (UTC)

That would certainly be quite cool, if you wanted to do so. The article is Principality of Stavelot-Malmedy, so feel free to think of any way in which the article might be improved with maps (or in any other fashion). — OwenBlacker (Talk) 10:32, 15 September 2010 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for File:Dexter in the Dark cover (Amazon).png

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Fair use rationale for File:DMZ -1 page01 panel01.png

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Robert Randall (advocate)

You may be interested in the article at Robert Randall (advocate) that I have created. -- Alan Liefting (talk) - 01:02, 8 October 2010 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for File:Effendi cover (Amazon).jpg

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Undoing of addition - Germanic Neopaganism

Hello, Is there any reason in particular why you undid my addition of Forn Siðr Blótsfélag Sjánghais under "Germanic Neopaganism"? Just curious. - Lao Ying —Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.247.10.158 (talk) 14:46, 28 November 2010 (UTC)

Not me; that was this edit by 79.54.82.168. I've restored your links. — OwenBlacker (Talk) 15:08, 28 November 2010 (UTC)

Note: The original addition was by IP 114.247.10.151 at 14:40, 8 November 2010.

Ouch. That appears to be a dynamic IP in Italy with no talk page. Why would that person do such a thing? I have been looking at some of the other contributions from that person, and it seems the contributor in this case has a hangup about the purity of what (s)he appears to be referring to in many places as Chinese Ethnic Religion, and many of the changes from this contributor appears to correct phrases indicating that Chinese Ethnic Religion is a mix of other religions. It is conceivable that the mention of a Forn Sidr society in China has offended this person. Could the addition of the Forn Siðr Blótsfélag Sjánghais be protected in any way? - Lao Ying —Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.247.10.158 (talk) 15:21, 28 November 2010 (UTC)

Not really; I don't think one POV edit merits page protection. We should just keep an eye on the page :o) — OwenBlacker (Talk) 15:39, 28 November 2010 (UTC)

UK Community Notice - IRC meeting

Dear Wikipedian,

This is the first of what will hopefully be a regular notice to help bring together the UK community so that you can be involved in some amazing things. To kick things off, there will be a UK community IRC meeting at 1800 UTC, December 7, 2010 to discuss the future growth and developement of Wikimedia UK. Without huge community support and involvement, the chapter cannot be successful and to get the most out of it, get involved.

For information on the community IRC meeting please go here

More to come about:

Wikipedia 10th Anniversary Events
1st Annual UK Wiki-conference
Trustee interest meeting - an event for those community members with even just a fleeting interest in becoming trustees of Wikimedia UK.

Many Thanks

Joseph Seddon

User:Seddon

Delivered by WMUKBot (talk) on 05:37, 5 December 2010 (UTC)

UK IRC community meeting

Just a quick reminder about the IRC meeting at 1800 UTC tonight to bring together the Wikimedia community in the UK to help the growth and success of the UK chapter and community activities. For information see wmuk:Community_IRC_meetings

Many Thanks

Joseph Seddon

User:Seddon

Delivered by WMUKBot (talk) on 17:27, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free image File:DMZ -1 page01 panel01.png

⚠

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Boulion

Hello Owen,

Making the map of what I think was boulion around wasn't too difficult. But I admit that I've been lazy, I've just done basic SVG stuff and no research at all. By the way, I'm confused about Boullion's history. Was it in intergral part of Liege in 1560 as my map indicates (German maps are usually good) or was it already 'independant'? Or was it a fief of Liege around this time with a semi-independant duke? About the map, if any exclaves need to be added to Boullion, that can easilly be fixed, just give me a shout! :)

Greeting, Sir Iain (talk) 22:39, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

London Wikimedia Fundraiser

Good evening! This is a friendly message from Chase me ladies, I'm the Cavalry, inviting you to the London Wikimedia Fundraising party on 19th December 2010, in approximately one week. This party is being held at an artistic London venue with room for approximately 300 people, and is being funded by Ed Saperia, a non-Wikipedian who has a reputation for holding exclusive events all over London. This year, he wants to help Wikipedia, and is subsidising a charity event for us. We're keen to get as many Wikimedians coming as possible, and we already have approximately 200 guests, including members of the press, and some mystery guests! More details can be found at http://ten.wikipedia.org/wiki/London - expect an Eigenharp, a mulled wine hot tub, a free hog roast, a haybale amphitheatre and more. If you're interested in coming - and we'd love to have you - please go to the ten.wikipedia page and follow the link to the Facebook event. Signing up on Facebook will add you to the party guestlist. Entry fee is a heavily subsidised £5 and entry is restricted to over 18s. It promises to be a 10th birthday party to remember! If you have any questions, please email me at chasemewiki at gmail.com.

Hope we'll see you there, (and apologies for the talk page spam) - Chase me ladies, I'm the Cavalry (talk) 23:38, 12 December 2010 (UTC)